Kodak Aerographic film - trying to identify the type.

Hi,

I've got a few rolls of kodak aerographic film. Most Aerographic film I can find information for seems to be based on Plus X and coded 2402. There are others that are infra-red or based on Pan X, but usually beginning with 24xx.

The film I have is coded 2645.

When I googled for the description of 2645 - I can't find any mention of it anywhere at all.

I've scrubbed the kodak site and all the usual sources of suck knowledge but absolutely no mention of it. I've found that long list of Kodak product codes compiled by Tom Philo, but the list contains nothing starting 26...

I tried emailing Kodak - but no reply.

From trying it I know it is a very fine grain Black and White film that seems to have extended red sensitivity - but it would be nice to know whether it is Pan X or Plus X based and what the sensitivity and sensitisation is and so forth...

On the box it just says:
Kodak "Aerographic" film

Made & Packed by Kodak limited

2645 (Estar Base)


Anyone any ideas?

Thanks

I don't have a complete answer for this, but the reference to "Kodak Limited" tells me that it probably originated in the UK.

The OP is in the UK so no surprise there.

Kodak often plays games with digits in their product codes to denote slight differences (usually in base material or thickness) so if we say OK, maybe that's a variation on 2445... then that doesn't work either, because 2445 is a color negative film and you say this is B&W. So I'm stumped.

Duncan

The Kodak help desk can be very helpful, especially if you can find a catalog number on the package.

The only reference I can find to Kodak 2645 is from an article published by the RSPSoc.org in 1980 where they mention

Kodak Aerographic film type 2645 (SM) has replaced Ilford FP3 (SM) as a medium speedlmedium contrast film

Click to expand...

From that, I would surmise that it is a very old high resolution B&W film.

Hi,

Thanks for the replies.

Yes, I found that brief reference to The Royal Photogrammetry Society article, too. Tantalisingly they just give that briefest of mentions in an extract. To read the rest of the article you need to register with an on line library and pay to download it. If it was a few pence I'd pay - but you can't find out until you've signed up and joined the library.

It does tend to suggest it is a Plus-X based film if they compare it with FP3 and call it 'medium speed'. Having used some, though, it seems pretty slow to me - I might have guessed Pan X, even.

It isn't so very old, either. There is no date of production or expiry date, but there is a 'Batch Test' date of 1990 - so I assume that is near to the date of manufacture.

It was military surplus. The film was purchased from a dealer who sold ex- Ministry Of Defence equipment.
I presume the MOD have looked after it properly - I should say it was either frozen or refrigerated for most of it's life as it doesn't show much signs of base fog, despite it's presumed age.

Never mind, I'll have to slice up a few more sheets for the Speed Graphic and discover it's characteristics for myself.

steven_e007 said:

Hi,

It isn't so very old, either. There is no date of production or expiry date, but there is a 'Batch Test' date of 1990 - so I assume that is near to the date of manufacture.

Click to expand...

That may be when that batch of stored film was tested (i.e. they pulled one roll out of the warehouse and tested it to ensure that the remaining film was still in-spec), so it's possible that was well after the original use-by date.

Duncan

frobozz said:

That may be when that batch of stored film was tested (i.e. they pulled one roll out of the warehouse and tested it to ensure that the remaining film was still in-spec), so it's possible that was well after the original use-by date.

Duncan

Click to expand...

The 'Batch Test' is part of the original packaging label, so I doubt it was batch tested after it was supplied by Kodak - but it may well have been batch tested as you describe by Kodak before supply. It is an interesting thought - it makes it plausible that the film could be some long extinct 1970s specialist emulsion. I like that idea, it makes the film sound quite intriguing and exotic!

Does anyone know how long a film could be stored by the manufacturer after production but before sale?

And any guesses how long it could be successfully stored after sale before showing signs of staleness if the organisation warehousing it knew what they were doing?

That film was custom made for the CIA, so it doesn't officially exist.

steven_e007 said:

Does anyone know how long a film could be stored by the manufacturer after production but before sale?

Click to expand...

A very very very long time...

From the Wikipedia entry for Technical Pan:

When the film was discontinued, Kodak revealed that none had been made for many years, and that it was still on the market only due to a large roll being found in frozen storage.

Click to expand...

Duncan

actually i just went to eBoink and i found your film ...

"KODAK PLUS X AEROGRAPHIC FILM 2402 ESTAR BASE"

it has a high red sensitivity for cutting through haze ...
you can find all sorts of info/ help / hints on cutting and use
on mrfoto 's website

http://mrfoto1.com/

have fun !
( i have used this film it is great !, a little thin and curly, but works great just the same ! )

john

jnanian said:

actually i just went to eBoink and i found your film ...

"KODAK PLUS X AEROGRAPHIC FILM 2402 ESTAR BASE"

it has a high red sensitivity for cutting through haze ...
you can find all sorts of info/ help / hints on cutting and use
on mrfoto 's website

http://mrfoto1.com/

have fun !
( i have used this film it is great !, a little thin and curly, but works great just the same ! )

john

Click to expand...

Hi,

Yep - you are probably right, I expect it is the same type of film - it is just this weird number, 2645, that made me wonder if it was a different emulsion.
It came from a British supplier via mail order, not eBay or Mr. Foto.

One thing I have noticed, though, is that all of the currently available aerographic films from Kodak seem to be on open reels - presumably loaded in a darkroom - and they are very long lengths (Hundreds of feet).

The film I have is in cassettes, like giant 35mm cartridges, and comes in 20m lengths.

Maybe that is the answer to the mystery - 2645 is Plux -X Aerographic loaded in 20 metre cartridges?

It sounds reasonable so I'll choose to believe it, for now, unless someone comes up with a better answer!

Some nice info on Mr. Foto's site. I particularly liked this reassuring snippet:

"Keeping Qualities of this Bulk Film:
Aerographic Plus-X 9.5 inch width... is Extremely Durable and Resistant to improper storage. Just keeping it cool below 70º F it will last 10 - 15 years or more. With normal Refrigeration 20 - 30 years or more. If Frozen your Grandchildren will be shooting it. (If you leave any)".

he'll respond to email and he knows all the #s since
he has sold everything from plus x and panatomic x aero
to duplicating film ... he's a nice guy .. and likes to help fellow photographers

have fun!
john

jnanian said:

he'll respond to email and he knows all the #s since
he has sold everything from plus x and panatomic x aero
to duplicating film ... he's a nice guy .. and likes to help fellow photographers

have fun!
john

Click to expand...

I'll certainly try him - in the mean time I've had a reply from Kodak...

Their technical director for aerial and Industrial said "I searched everywhere and could not find anything on 2645. "
:confused:

I've just gone and read the boxes again in case it is me that has goofed - no, it DEFINITELY says 2645 on each one.

Very strange!!

Maybe I have your answer

I found a film called SO-267
there is a 26 code for you

Panatomic type

no mention of anything but maybe a mapping film with PX backing
from other panatomic aerial film details not that much sharper than any other plus-x, super-xx
film speed for other Pan-x at 20 and still called medium speed
slow aerial was 6, 10, 1.6 and had resolution #s of 200+ compared to 40-50 for standard types

I don't know
SO-267 is mentioned all over the net as a film used on space missions apollo12
SO-267, Plus-XX, high-speed black-and-white, thin-base film, ASA 278

Double-x is listed in the c hart, though. why wouldnt they just call/list it double-x instead of "pan"?


damn, I'm an idiot
I now see that S0-267 was only called Pan not Pan-x
panatomic came before X but still

It's listed along/under tri-x films if that helps

http://www.scribd.com/doc/56444536/Photo-Interpretation-Guide-for-Forest-Resource
just scroll for about 20 seconds
The emulsions are different than ordinary still films
similar to plus-x? verichrome?



internet post
"I have 2 rolls of Kodak Professional Color Negative Film, SO-267, C-41
processing, ISO 80, dated July 1975"

maybe one for both color and BW