KMZ MIR reproduction/fake?

keyofnight · Feb 3, 2013

I was thinking I would grab myself a classic Soviet rangefinder of some sort—I figured it'd be fun to use on the street, and I've always wanted an old Soviet camera. I found a KMZ MIR floating around the 'bay in what looked like good condition, CLAed, etc. It, however, has a very high serial number—so high that it made me doubt this is a real MIR camera. As far as I know, there aren't any MIR cameras with numbers starting with '62', most reported numbers I've seen start with '59' or lower. Here's the listing: http://www.ebay.com/itm/MIR-Zorki-4...232?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item19d8172290 . It might be a reproduction, a fake, or just a really late model. Were these made in `62?

…am I right to be worried? Or am I being paranoid? Is this thing the real deal? (These things aren't expensive in the first place, but I don't want to buy a knockoff for the price of the real thing.)

Thanks folks.

benjiboy · Feb 3, 2013

Get your rational head on, why would someone want to go to the trouble to fake something as complex as a precision camera for a selling price of $63 ?

Ian Grant · Feb 3, 2013

That price seems high for one with the Industar, I'm looking at buying one for the f2 Jupiter lens and £20/$32 seems about average selling price.

Ian

nicholai · Feb 3, 2013

Ian, this one has been CLA'd and has 90 days of warranty.

Ian Grant · Feb 3, 2013

Yes, you're right, I guess that's worth a little extra

Ian

keyofnight · Feb 3, 2013

Ian Grant said:
That price seems high for one with the Industar, I'm looking at buying one for the f2 Jupiter lens and £20/$32 seems about average selling price

If only it had that Jupiter… (; It'd be a deal made in heaven.

benjiboy said:
Get your rational head on, why would someone want to go to the trouble to fake something as complex as a precision camera for a selling price of $63 ?

You're right. But things aren't adding up. It looks like an earlier MIR, but it's made in 62? I guess I just want to know more.

Роберт · Feb 3, 2013

Zorki 4K with J-8 and J-12. New shutter curtain CLA and a new sun hood (40,5mm). Eur. 80,-. An almost new Zorki bag too.

J-12 from a first test film.

J-8 from a first test film.

Z4K with J-12 and Oly VF-1 incl. Zorki bag and blocking the dioptry leveling with Poster Pritt.

A simple 3in1 lens hood: 28-35mm, 50-60mm and >85mm. Especially in front light situations with the J-8 a big improvement.

If you want you can make great photos with this combination. The Jupiter-8 is a pre war Zeiss Sonnar type lens and the Jupiter-12 is a pre war Zeiss Biogon type design. Not bad at all. Especially not for this amount of money.

Ian Grant · Feb 3, 2013

Well you live in the right place to get bargain ex-Soviet cameras I remember some of my friends in the 1970's getting superb results from the Zorki 4's and the Kievs and their surprisingly good Jupiter lenses.

Just before Christmas I picked up a near mint Zorki C (Cyrillic markings) for £2 ($3.20/2.4- euros) and I really want a nice Jupiter lens for it, not the later black version.

The other Soviet era camera I find fascinating is the Zenit C, it's ironic that modern Cosina made rangefinder cameras (Bessa, Zeiss Ikon, Epson digital etc) are based on a Cosina SLR minus the mirror box. The Zenit C is a Leica copy with a mirror box added

Ian

Kiev88user · Feb 3, 2013

Hi, this is an interesting one. Basically the MIR was made from 1959 to 1961 - please see http://www.fotoua.com/1cameratip.php?st=7&rd=4&seek1=&seek2=&usl=4&usl1=mir&seek3=3 and Jean Loup Princelle's book. The lens is from a FED camera, the MIR would have had a Industar 60 or 26M for internal consumption and a Jupiter 8 for export, this one is intended for internal consumption as it has Cyrillic script name. See http://www.ebay.com/itm/MIR-Vintage...888400326?pt=Film_Cameras&hash=item2ec5e1b9c6 as an example. The only difference between the MIR and Zorki 4 was the lack of slow speeds mechanism.

Cheers,

Steve

Роберт · Feb 3, 2013

Yes, the MIR (= Peace) is a simply Z4. These Zorki's ( = Sharp seeing) were going out in 1990/1991 for a few Deutsche Mark (DM) really a few €'s. The Zorki 4K was an export product with improved film level and fixed spool. But the Jupiter optics are really good. Till 1949 they were made of original Zeiss supplies taken away from the factory in Germany. If you have a good J-8 or J-12 they can almost compete with some Leica lenses.

Rhodes · Feb 3, 2013

I loved and miss my Zorki 4K! Brighter finder I ever saw in a rf and for me,a great camera.

keyofnight · Feb 3, 2013

Thanks for the responses!

Kiev88user said:
Hi, this is an interesting one. Basically the MIR was made from 1959 to 1961 - please see http://www.fotoua.com/1cameratip.php?st=7&rd=4&seek1=&seek2=&usl=4&usl1=mir&seek3=3 and Jean Loup Princelle's book. The lens is from a FED camera, the MIR would have had a Industar 60 or 26M for internal consumption and a Jupiter 8 for export, this one is intended for internal consumption as it has Cyrillic script name. See http://www.ebay.com/itm/MIR-Vintage...888400326?pt=Film_Cameras&hash=item2ec5e1b9c6 as an example. The only difference between the MIR and Zorki 4 was the lack of slow speeds mechanism.

I was interested in the MIR in the first place because I've read the Z4 slow-shutter mechanism is a possible failure point, so the MIR is supposedly more reliable than the Z4. I also love the how "Мир" looks in script—I don't know why. (;

This Fotoua page is exactly what made me wonder what's going on with this camera. The style of the camera looks too old (lots of accents) for such a high serial number, the serial number is also higher than the highest reported serial number on the Fotoua page.

I'm probably overthinking this. Should I pick this particular one up? It seems like a good deal for having been CLAed.

Oy. Forget it. I'm going to order from Fedka.com. (;

KMZ MIR reproduction/fake?

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