Just ruined a roll of film

[cerber0s]

And not the cheap Fomapan either but an expensive Kodak Tri-X. What's worse is that I had high hopes for several of the photos. There will be a question at the end of this but this is what happened:

I'm planning on getting a bag for loading the film into the Patterson reel but for now all I have is the bathroom. I get the film out and onto the reel and start cranking, which is fine at first, as usual. While 120mm film and the 35mm film that I roll from bulk film (I usually only roll up between 12 and 20 frames) will roll up without glitches I frequently have problems with full 36 frame rolls. Somewhere around half way the film seems to get stuck and I can't crank the reel without the film bukling. During this ordeal the film was abused more than it deserved but that's not where it went wrong...

Eventually I gave up and put the film down the tank and turned on the lights to see if there was something stuck in the reel that prevented the film from rolling up. Just as I did that I realized that the center tube was still in the reel and I hadn't put the cap on the tank, I could see the film curled up through the center hole...

Anyway, I got it developed and there are three useable photos on there, the rest came out with special effects all over them

What am I doing wrong? Why does this happen with longer rolls of film? I will use the ruined roll to see what's going on in daylight but I'd apreciate some tips if you have them.

On the bright side I tried (2nd time now) to run the film through a bath of 99% isopropanol after I rinsed it. I usually have problems with dust on the negatives since I have to leave them hanging to dry in the kitchen. Both the last roll and this one that I ran through the alcohol came out completely dust free and were dry to the touch within a minute, with no obvious side effects.

 

[glbeas]

Your reel may be dirty from photoflo or other crud. Clean it with a toothbrush then rinse real well and see if that helps. Another bit that will help is clip the corners of the lead edge at a 45 degree so it will resist catching.
Things like that is why I switched to steel reels, once I learned to load them never had much problem loading anything.

 

[BradS]

Plastic reels?
This is a fairly common issue. Here are some suggestions:
1. make sure the reels are scrupulously clean and more importantly, DRY.
2. when you cut off the leader, trim corners off the leading edge of the film. so that the corners are just a tiny bit rounded. You only need to cut off a tiny bit of each of the corners of the leading edge like an eighth of an inch or so. It's hard to explain...easy to do.
3. Do not ever put your reels in photoflo...or if you do, spend a lot of time and effort cleaning them after each time. I use a tooth brush, a little baking soda and hot water.
4. the changing bag will make it harder. Use the bathroom and make sure it is dark (obviously) and that you are relaxed.
5. as you've learned, don't force it.

 

[Cholentpot]

Welcome to the club.

Your reel may be dirty from photoflo or other crud. Clean it with a toothbrush then rinse real well and see if that helps. Another bit that will help is clip the corners of the lead edge at a 45 degree so it will resist catching.
Things like that is why I switched to steel reels, once I learned to load them never had much problem loading anything.

Always wipe down the reels. Never let them air dry.

 

[Ernst-Jan]

What am I doing wrong?

you say 120mm

 

[cerber0s]

you say 120mm

That I did, sorry

Although half the circumference of an exposed negative is around 120mm

 

[cerber0s]

Thank you guys. By reel I meant the Patterson spiral but you figured that out. I'll experiment with the messed up film. Ibtried it now with the same result but the spiral might not be dry yet.

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

Paterson reels must be absolutely dry, or the film will bind.

 

[Deleted member 88956]

I don't know what that bit about NOT letting them air dry is about. You cannot wipe the reels dry, I don't even know why anyone want to wipe them to begin with.

Anyways, it does sound like the reels had moisture still affecting full 35mm length going in. Any dirt build up would be too easy to see so I assume they look clean in that sense.

After a reel is well flushed in water, shake out all water you can, then dry them up. I always use hair drier in low heat to do that, takes 5-10 minutes to get them were they need to be.

Film leading edge needs to be clean cut, snipping corners slightly won't hurt either. Film needs to have clean start, so it really starts to easily go in by simply pushing it in without twisting of halves. There should be near zero friction all the way, but twisting action is usually needed once things get going.

 

[R.Gould]

Before you start loading the film, take a sharp pencil and run the lead around the groves, film willl then slid in like a hot knife though butter, works every time, at least for me, that is all I ever do, never clean the reel's, other than with the washing of the film, just take the film out, put reel to one side to dry, next time run the pencil around, load film, 35mm without triming the leading edge just load,develop stop,fix wash wetting agent, hang film up and put reel aside to dry

 

[Sirius Glass]

For all reels and all roll film, trimming the corners saves a world of grief.

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

I've not ever wiped my reels, and just let them air dry. Been doing so for 30 years. Never had an issue.

 

[Sirius Glass]

I have been air drying reels, plastic and steel, for decades without a problem.

 

[MattKing]

Wipe the reels first.
Then air dry them in a location with reasonably low humidity, for a good length of time - either all day or over night.
I use nail clippers to trim the corners of the leading edge. Usually I leave the leader out of the cassette, which allows me to both clip the corners and start loading the reel in room light.
If you leave the leader out after rewinding the film, tear off the tongue as soon as you remove the film from the camera, so that you don't mix up unexposed and exposed rolls. It helps to have either a marking system or a separate spot in your camera bag for exposed film - otherwise you can end up going out with only exposed film at hand.
As for technique when you are actually loading the reels, a gentle touch is really important. The reel should be balanced between the fingertips of both hands, and you need to concentrate on keeping the sides parallel. There is a tendency to push harder when it gets difficult, when it is better to hold the reel more softly.

 

[Huss]

I had problems with film binding on my plastic reels made by Arista. 35mm film. What I discovered is that it would only happen from film in cameras that bends the film against the grain, i.e the opposite bend of how it is packed in the film canister.
So pretty much any traditional manual film advance film camera like Nikon F, F2, F3. But not F4, F5 or F6! (Or N2000, F75, F80). That is because those auto loading/advancing cameras bend the film the same way it came out of the canister.
Same for Pentax MX/K2/LX vs Pentax P30T. Or Leica R4/R5/R6/R7 vs R8/9.

The fix is to in the dark (obviously!) take the film completely out of the canister and load it from the other end, making sure the film bend matches the curve of the developing reel.

I have had zero issues since, and my reels are used with photoflow and air dried.

 

[wjlapier]

I too use photoflo and air dry my plastic reels. What I did recently was remove the ball bearings and film loads much easier. Before removing the ball bearings I would wash the reels in soapy water and then rinse and air dry. That helped but the removal of the bearings really made a huge difference.

 

[pentaxuser]

Before you start loading the film, take a sharp pencil and run the lead around the groves, film willl then slid in like a hot knife though butter, works every time, at least for me,

This has worked for me very well. I have used this from the time Richard first suggested it. I feel this is an underrated "trick" Apart from Richard and now me no-one seems ever to mention it. Ideally a soft lead is better such as a 6 or 8B. Such pencils are very good for writing on the back of print paper as well

pentaxuser

 

[R.Gould]

This has worked for me very well. I have used this from the time Richard first suggested it. I feel this is an underrated "trick" Apart from Richard and now me no-one seems ever to mention it. Ideally a soft lead is better such as a 6 or 8B. Such pencils are very good for writing on the back of print paper as well

pentaxuser

I learned this trick when I was about 10, it was taught me by a Professional photographer friend of the family when I was moaning about films sticking, and I have rarely had a film stick since and never a ruined fiolm, and he also told me if a film does stick the a sharp tap on the work surface will unstick it
Richard

 

[pentaxuser]

I learned this trick when I was about 10,
Richard

So you have been using it for about 15 years now

pentaxuser

 

[Wallendo]

If you are saving up for a dark bag then you probably don't want to spend more money, but I find that owning and being able to load both a Paterson and a metal Hewes roll comes in handy. In the rare cases where film doesn't load on one type, I have the other to which I can switch. I have only had one roll I couldn't load on my Paterson (a roll of Efke), but was able to load it on a metal reel. One option to consider in the future if this ever happens to you again is to cut the film when it sticks and develop the two half of the film separately. You will lose one frame, probably the best shot on the roll, but can salvage the other 35.

 

[Rowreidr]

Nail cutter and soft leaded pencil added to the cart. Like usual, I just take from the forum and have nothing to add. Thanks for the great ideas!

 

[cerber0s]

Thank you all! I will start by making sure it's dry enough and trim the edges.

The pencil trick is widely used unbthe string slots on nuts for guitars to prevent string binding.

 

[Cholentpot]

A wipe them dry the best I can. I don't like getting lime buildup on the reels.

 

[Horatio]

I had a roll of film buckle and stick Saturday, before giving up and loading it onto a steel reel. It worked perfectly fine the first few rolls of film. I’ll try these tips next time. Meanwhile I’ve purchased a used Lab-Box.

 

[Hatchetman]

scrub the reels with a toothbrush soap and water. air dry 24 hours. always rinse the reels with plain water after you remove the film from the photoflow rinse. I think its the photoflow that causes a lot of the stickiness.