Jobo 2500 reels

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Craig

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Tonight I decided to take a close look at my Jobo reels and try and figure out why I have been unable to load a 120 film on them. I started by cutting a piece of 120 backing paper to length and used that as a substitute for film, and tried loading in room light.

On my first try the paper would only load about 2 wraps and would go no further. What had happened was there is a small piece of the plastic that has broken where the red tab snaps to allow for loading a 220 film or two 120 films. The edge of the film would drop out of it's track toward the centre of the reel due to it's natural curl and jam. My reels came with my processor which I bought used, and half of my reels were broken. I believe that any breakage condems the reel to scrap.

After finding an unbroken reel, I tried again to load it with paper. The paper would start, but once it was about half way on, it was getting more and more difficult to advance, and I started to hear (and see) the familiar crunching sound I have experienced before of film buckling and creasing. The paper was essentially stuck, and I was unable to move it any further.

After a close inspection, I found that the inner portion of the reel where the film goes is slightly too narrow for a 120, there was absolutely no edge to edge clearance. When a small amount of film is on the reel, there is enough wobble to allow the reel halves to move slightly to allow some clearance, but as more film is put on, this wobble disappears and the film is wedged in place.

Next, dug out my calipers and started measuring. I first measured the width of a piece of Ilford HP5 and it is 2.410". Then I measured the backing paper, and it was 2.460", or 0.050" wider than the film, as expected. Next I measured the inside track of the reel, and it came to 2.396", or 0.014" (0.36mm) narrower than the width of the film. This measurement confirms my experience of being unable to load a complete 120 onto the reel due to binding. In comparison, the film track width of a Paterson reel is 2.435", or 0.025" wider then the film. This probably explains why I have always been able to load a Paterson reel with ease, it's wider than the film; so there is some clearance for the film to move side to side.

My solution was it use a cut off wheel in my dremel tool and to slightly cut some material off of the locking pegs on the inside if the reel, to allow it to move outward slightly. This makes the track for the film wider, and I was able to load the paper entirely once I had made this modification. I eyeballed how much to take off, and it ended up widening the reel by about 0.020", so now the track is at least the width of the film. I was able to load the backing paper successfully in the dark. However, I find that it is still much easier to crease and/or buckle the film than loading a Paterson reel. In the second photo the cut mark is visible at the bottom of the centre portion.

So for the 120 position anyway, a Jobo 2500 reel requires modification to be successfully used. I have not measured the 35mm position, but I have had similar troubles loading 35mm in the past.

IMG-0885.jpg
IMG-0886.jpg
 

AgX

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This is the most interesting report on a Jobo reel I ever read!

What puzzles me is that the tube you have been working on is seemingly fixed too deep into the spiral part. What one could imagine happening at assembling is that the tube had been fixed not deep enough, resulting in a larger distance of the two spirals to each other. Bu too deep should not be possible, as there is an arrest.
Unless, one of the two parts, tube or spiral has been made not to size.
 
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Craig

Craig

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Unless, one of the two parts, tube or spiral has been made not to size.

I have 6 reels, and all were identical and too narrow. They must have been made that way.
 

Besk

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I cut slight bevels on the leading edges of my film. Never had a problem.
 

AgX

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But in Craigs case(es) such would not help. Or not much, as the film then would be under tension between the reels even if passing all ridges, making pushing the film onto the reel, by whatever technique, difficult.
 

MattiS

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Strange -I never heard about this clearance issue before. At the end of this yt-video you can hear the film slack in the 2502 reel, same here with my older (transparent) 2004 Duo reels and Ilford FP4 (61.3mm / 2.413" wide). Can you be sure they are Jobo OEM (at least they look like OEM)?
 
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Craig

Craig

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As far as I know they are Jobo reels. They came as a package with an ATL-3000, a couple of expert drums and 3 of the 2500 tanks. Whoever bought the stuff originally went top of the line, I can't see them cheaping out on reels.
 

AgX

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You should contact Jobo in Germany, as you think they were faulty from the start.
 
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Craig

Craig

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I suspect they are at least 30 years old, so any warranty is long expired! What I have come across is a design to 3D print a core that allows the use of Paterson reels in a Jobo tank. That's worth an experiment I think.
 

AgX

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A warranty typically is aimed at longevity issues.

For a manufacturer it should be embarrassing to have sold things unusable from the start. More so when this is made public.

But yes, some manufacturers do not bother about their reputation.
 

MattKing

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Does anyone know of any film formats that are very slightly narrower than 120? I'm wondering if those reels are specially designed for something other than 120.
 
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Craig

Craig

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The only markings I see on the reels are numbers on the outer edge of the two halves of 04065 and 04066 if that means anything.
IMG-0888.jpg
IMG-0887.jpg
 

MattiS

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Did you check if the flanges are straight or bent due to e.g. too hot cleaning?

20220531_211215.jpg


You can also try to pair the halves different. Maybe tolerances add up in the right way, but I doubt this a bit.
 
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Craig

Craig

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Yes, all are perfectly flat. I measured the width at several places around the perimeter and got the same width. My reels are all black, not clear like yours though.
 

AgX

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The only markings I see on the reels are numbers on the outer edge of the two halves of 04065 and 04066 if that means anything.

Similar figures on the part shown on the Jobo site. Likely the number of the molding tool.
(Of course if one would copie such part there is no reason not to copy such too.)
 

john_s

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Would different makes of 120 film be slightly different? I have some of those 2500 reels and I did have trouble feeding some films into them but I don't remember if they were Ilford or Fuji.

Isn't the film supposed to be 60mm (exactly?). So the OP's Ilford sample is more than that (2.41" is 61.2mm)

Edit/: wiki says up to 61.7

 
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nbagno

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I have a bunch of new Jobo 2500 reels, I use them exclusively on all sorts of different 35mm and 120. I often double up on 120 on a reel. Not discounting that you are having issues, I don't have any. They work perfectly.
 

AgX

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Isn't the film supposed to be 60mm (exactly?)

No.

Each and every rollfilm dimension is meanwhile internationally standardized.
The width of the film proper today has to be within 60.7 and 61.7 mm, which already is a large tolerance.
However there was an older standard where both limits were larger!
 
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