issues with FSU screw mount lenses on Leica Barnack cameras?

BradS · Aug 24, 2019

What are the issues associated using a former soviet union lens, like (but not limited to) the Jupiter-8 or Industar-22 on a genuine Leica?

Is the registration distance correct? Are these lenses generally rangefinder coupled?

I guess, this is my biggest concern...will the rangefinder on the little Leica work and will it be reasonably accurate?

...but, other in-compatability issues are definitely of interest too.

StepheKoontz · Aug 24, 2019

I did some research, it appears while they are "coupled", the calibration between a real leica (+ Canon, Nicca and other japanese clones) vs FSU LTM stuff isn't the same. I have a Jupiter 3 that is extra sharp on my sony A7 even wide open, but always seems a bit OOF on my Leica at anything away from infinity. On my little Zorki, it works fine.

More than you probably want to know about this. https://www.dantestella.com/technical/compat.html

Bottom line, use FSU lenses on an FSU body. The Japanese lenses and bodies all seem to work fine with Leica lenses and bodies.

BradS · Aug 24, 2019

StepheKoontz said:
I did some research, it appears while they are "coupled", the calibration between a real leica (+ Canon, Nicca and other japanese clones) vs FSU LTM stuff isn't the same. I have a Jupiter 3 that is extra sharp on my sony A7 even wide open, but always seems a bit OOF on my Leica at anything away from infinity. On my little Zorki, it works fine.

More than you probably want to know about this. https://www.dantestella.com/technical/compat.html

Bottom line, use FSU lenses on an FSU body. The Japanese lenses and bodies all seem to work fine with Leica lenses and bodies.

Thank you Stephe ! This helps a lot.

bdial · Aug 24, 2019

FWIW, my Jupiter 12 works fine on my M4-2, and it seems to do equally well on my Japanese screw mount bodies (Canon and Nicca). I've even used it with an M8. But maybe I'm just lucky. I have read that often they need adjustments to work correctly.

__Brian · Aug 24, 2019

https://jasonhowe.blog/50mm-jupiter-3-f1-5-information

Jason Howe hosts my DIY instructions for the J-3, also how to convert a pre-war 5cm F1.5 Sonnar to Leica mount.

The Russian lenses are built to the Contax 52.4mm standard, the Leica is built to a 51.6mm standard. The tolerances on Russian lenses is +/- 1%, so you may get lucky. Typically thickening the shim by 0.12mm or so does the trick, and someone may have done this already. My advise- shoot a few test shots with the lens close-up and wide-open. Use a ruler, post back the error.. So, focus at an object 1Meter away, record the error in millimeters. Post the results, I have an Excel spreadsheet to compute the change in shim thickness required. This is based on the formula for Focal Length, also given in the instructions.

http://static1.squarespace.com/stat...r-3-Shimming-Instructions.pdf?format=original

A thread on DIY Jupiter-8,

https://cameraderie.org/threads/trying-to-adjust-a-jupiter-8-for-leica.48961/

And my Industar-50 collapsible thread:

https://cameraderie.org/threads/industar-50-collapsible-mount-50mm-f3-5.49070/

The I-50 is a great lens.

__Brian · Aug 24, 2019

This thread has images from several Jupiter-3's, all properly adjusted for Leica.

https://cameraderie.org/threads/jupiter-3-5cm-f1-5-various-manufacturers.37715/

Most are with the M9 and M Monochrom.

Ko.Fe. · Aug 24, 2019

I had, have many FSU RF lenses on Leica. Most of them needed to be shimmed. Some are very easy like J-12, black J-8, collapsible Industars. Some are not, like J-3.
Once they are correctly shimmed, they are sharp enough lenses for 8x10 prints.

J-3 on M3 at f5.6

Industar-26M on M3.

StepheKoontz · Aug 24, 2019

Shimming adjusts them to focus correctly on a Leica at close distances, but then they are off at longer distances. It's the same problem you have trying to use Contax lenses on a Nikon.

btaylor · Aug 25, 2019

I fiddled around with FSU cameras and lenses, Leica screw mounts, Canon, Contax and Nikon RF’s. My conclusion: save yourself the trouble and just use lenses with the cameras they were designed for. You get to use more cameras that way too— a win-win!

__Brian · Aug 25, 2019

StepheKoontz said:
Shimming adjusts them to focus correctly on a Leica at close distances, but then they are off at longer distances. It's the same problem you have trying to use Contax lenses on a Nikon.

It is best to adjust the lens for close-up/wide-open use, and to stop down 1F-Stop when using at infinity. Sonnar formula lenses have a large focus shift towards infinity, in the case of using FSU lenses on Leica cameras: this works in your favor. The same is true of using Contax lenses on Nikon cameras. I have one Nikon S2 modified to take Contax lenses, prefer the 1x finder over the Contax finders.

Whether it is worth the effort or not, up to the individual. The FSU lenses are faithful implementations of the pre-war German Sonnars.

__Brian · Aug 25, 2019

1953 KMZ Jupiter-3 on the M Monochrom, at F1.5.
Distance:

1953 J-3 remount, Wide-Open by fiftyonepointsix, on Flickr

Close-up:

1953 J-3 remount, Wide-Open by fiftyonepointsix, on Flickr

This lens has a fair amount of cleaning marks on the front element, would run ~$150.

guangong · Aug 25, 2019

btaylor said:
I fiddled around with FSU cameras and lenses, Leica screw mounts, Canon, Contax and Nikon RF’s. My conclusion: save yourself the trouble and just use lenses with the cameras they were designed for. You get to use more cameras that way too— a win-win!

DITTO!!

issues with FSU screw mount lenses on Leica Barnack cameras?

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