Is using a rotary processor the way to go for B&W films?

bogeyes · Feb 26, 2005

AT the moment I am using small paterson tanks to develop 35mm/120 films.I get really bored and impatient developing my films, I am considering using my Jobo processor to dev/stop/fix and wash all my black and white films is this a quicker\ less labour intensive way to go? I tried lobbing XP2+ in with my colour film but I dont like the long exposure times it takes to print XP2+ negs on B&W paper.

Christian Kolinski · Feb 26, 2005

Yes, why not?
I use my Jobo CPE2 for most of my b/w developing (exceptions are Rodinal and some special things like Kodak Imagelink). I have very good results with ID11/D76, Calbe A49 and some Tetenal devs. You just have to adjust developing times according to the manufactures spec-sheet (-15% for ID11 IIRC).

gbroadbridge · Feb 26, 2005

You betcha !!

I haven't hand processed a single B&W film since I found a CPE2. You need to adjust you devel time of course, but once it's nutted out it is much more consistent.

Graham

bogeyes · Feb 26, 2005

When it comes to washing do you leave the film in the same water or do you change the water several times say once every 3 mins X 6?

Fotohuis · Feb 26, 2005

Most developers will do fine on Jobo CPE-2. Some exeptions: Rodinal (Agfa), Tanol (Moersch), Imagespeed, Nanospeed (SPUR).

If you want an inversion system automated, look at the Heiland Tas processor. If you are already using the Jobo 1500 system it's economical with the chemicals. Jobo 1510 250 ml, 1520 470 ml or 1540 910 ml.

Very reproducible, external memories for different combinations, automatic temperature and develop time corrections within 0,1 degrees C. Accoustic warning process almost finished and completely finished. High preformance materials PTFE, S.S. used. Only not very cheap.

best regards,

Robert

gbroadbridge · Feb 26, 2005

bogeyes said:
When it comes to washing do you leave the film in the same water or do you change the water several times say once every 3 mins X 6?

I do not wash the film using the CPE. I hand wash using ilford recommendations.

Sorry I should have made this clear before.

The CPE is great for processing, but if you want to wash using the CPE you need to read the instructions and even then I would be cautious

Graham.

Peter Schrager · Feb 26, 2005

rotary

I don't do alot of small films but when I do I use an old Beseler rotary base and a Paterson tank that holds two reels. Works just fine and alot cheaper than a Jobo. I guess if you're doing 4x5 or larger then the Jobo is the way to go. There are also film tubes available from J+C or you can make them yourself.
Regards, Peter

Christian Kolinski · Feb 26, 2005

I use the Ilford method with the CPE. Fill with water... let it rotate for some seconds, change, let it rotate etc...

Works fine.

Bob F. · Feb 26, 2005

To wash, I remove the tank from the CPE2, set it on its bottom and run a hose down the centre tube and run water through that as a film washer, but yes, use the CPE2 for develop/stop/fix - washup graduates etc while it's spinning...

Bob.

Wally H · Feb 26, 2005

You didn't say which Jobo processor and I don't know about any other than the one I use, the ATL2000... I use it for all my film processing except any Foto flo steps... It was acquired specifically for films, B&W and E6 six step, and does a good consistent job... I prefer it connected to a tempered water source and plumbed for draining... I have no experience using it for prints, but it can be used for most processes using as many as chemicals / steps...

Ronald Moravec · Feb 26, 2005

I think it is more trouble than it`s worth for a few film a week. You have to set and clean the jobo, get the waterbath correct, and by them you are already done.

I use it for color only. It you want to process b&w it will do fine with normal developers. Make sure you can get enough stock solution for diluted developers.

I recomment the 2500 tanks and 6 in dia reels.

Bob Carnie · Feb 26, 2005

My experience would say that if you are only doing a few rolls a week stay with the hand inversion method.
I only swithched to Jobo because volume of work . I think that if you hand process yourself consistantly every time with good twisting inversion techniques it is every bit as good as a Rotary Processor.
If you are going to do a lot of complicated and different processes then haveing the memory programs on a Jobo is hard to beat.
My pet peeve is replenishing the developers, I do not replenish and if you do not, your film will be first rate.

Flotsam · Feb 26, 2005

Personally, I think that intermittent agitation is the way to go for B&W. I used a CPE2 for a while and it was convenient and gave good results but I think that contrast is better controlled with hand agitation. Also, as I tested more and more films for rotary, I started to think about what would happen if the CPE's motor died on me. I'd have to wait for a repair or start testing all over again . Since I rarely do more than a few of rolls at a time and enjoy the simple rhythm of darkroom work, the K.I.S.S. philosophy inavariably serves me best.

That being said, I do use my Jobo for occasionally processing 4x5 film in a reasonable volume of solution (12 sheets in 500 ml... hard to beat). And if I did a higher quantity of processing I would have to consider the convenience and economy of it.

chuck94022 · Feb 26, 2005

Christian Kolinski said:
...exceptions are Rodinal...

I use my Jobo for B&W film development with no problems. I do low quantities, and do agree that by the time I've set up my Jobo, I probably could have finished if I did hand agitation. However, I like the exacting repeatability of the Jobo. Since I'm not an expert yet, I like to eliminate as many random variables as possible. The Jobo helps by keeping the temps and agitation consistent.

I have not yet started using Rodinal, but would like to try it. Why does it not work with a Jobo?

-chuck

Christian Kolinski · Feb 26, 2005

Most b/w is done at 20degC, about room-temperature so I don't have to wait for the water to warm up. If I only do some b/w films I fill only about 2 litre into my CPE2 - just enough to cover the heating - and use it as a rotary base only. So it's as fast as inversion.

@chuck94022:
It works with a Jobo. Rodinal is said to loose some if it's sharpness when used with rotation - I can't verify that.

I use Rodinal in high dilution and only minor agitation - so I need the full 470ml of my Jobo 1520 tank and for 3sec agitation every 5 min I don't need a Jobo.

gbroadbridge · Feb 26, 2005

chuck94022 said:
I
I have not yet started using Rodinal, but would like to try it. Why does it not work with a Jobo?
-chuck

I'd like to know too. I've been processing HP5+/rodinal 1+25 for six months in the Jobo with no problems at all. The results are quite similar to the same film in Ilford LC29.

Graham.

gbroadbridge · Feb 26, 2005

chuck94022 said:
I use my Jobo for B&W film development with no problems. I do low quantities, and do agree that by the time I've set up my Jobo, I probably could have finished if I did hand agitation. However, I like the exacting repeatability of the Jobo. Since I'm not an expert yet, I like to eliminate as many random variables as possible. The Jobo helps by keeping the temps and agitation consistent.

I have not yet started using Rodinal, but would like to try it. Why does it not work with a Jobo?

-chuck

Setting up the Jobo here is as simple as loading the film onto the spools and turning on the power. The water bath sits at around 24C without external heating, water out of the tap is around 25C in summer, around 19C in winter.

I don't bother emptying the jobo, a couple of drops of aquarium agaecide keeps the algae at bay.

For B&W printing (bigger than 8x10) I use the jobo too.

The only time the jobo heater gets going is when I'm processing C41, and it does a triffic job with that too.

RA4 is done at room temperature using patterson chems.

Graham.

chuck94022 · Feb 26, 2005

I don't have a dedicated wet room for the Jobo. I process in the family room, which happens to have a wet bar. I connect to the faucet (for CPP cooling if needed), and use the sink as necessary for draining.

But unfortunately, I share the room with the family, and they insist (well my wife insists anyway) that the Jobo get stowed when not in use. So even for BW, setting up means putting it up on the bar, connecting, filling, etc.

Since I usually batch things together I usually have enough stuff to process to justify the effort. And usually I'm doing a mix of BW and E6 in the session, so it has to get set up for the E6 anyway.

I'm going to try hand processing and agitating some roll film I have though. I've got a test roll just sitting there waiting for me to load. Now where is that round tuit...

josephaustin · Feb 27, 2005

With the old besler or other motor bases of that Ilk, could you use a patterson tank, for 4x5, If you just did a couple sheets at a time? Just curious if anyone has tried this.

jp80874 · Feb 27, 2005

bogeyes said:
When it comes to washing do you leave the film in the same water or do you change the water several times say once every 3 mins X 6?

I'm not sure this second question was completely answered for you. I have been using a CPP-2 for about a year for 120 roll film, 4x5 and 8x10 sheet film. Using rollo pyro developer the instructions call for 20 minutes of wash. I
dump the water and then add 350ml every two minutes. I then take the
tank off, run water through until the bubbles stop.

At that point I take the film out and put it in a stainless tank with a gallon
of distilled water poured into the empty cap of a foto flow bottle. Jobo
says not to put foto flow in the Jobo plastic tanks. I use distilled water
for this because my main water source is a well. After hang drying, the
film is clean and clear of water spots.

I hope this helps.

John Powers

Is using a rotary processor the way to go for B&W films?

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