Is this a clever scam?

Mats_A · Mar 3, 2010

Take a look at http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280470846718&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

It's a Rolleicord Vb. Seller claims that he knows nothing about it and can't even tell if it's working.
It seems to be in B+ condition so a prima specimen should bring over 200.

Something in the text suggests to me that the seller knows more about that than he claims. Maybe the fact that he mentions serial number whithout anyone asking for it.

Is this a scam, such that he knows it is broken and sells it anyway. If it's in good condition you could get yourself a Cord Vb for a very cheap price.

Or you could pay way too much for something with a broken shutter.

What's your opinion O Mighty Forum Brain?

r

Ps. I am not asking for advice. Ordered my Rolleicord from KEH 3 days ago.

JBrunner · Mar 3, 2010

I looked at the listing. I note that the seller has over 100 positive feedbacks with a 100% positive feedback rating. Based on that I would lean towards his description being an honest one. Examining the seller's past transactions, and noting the handle of the seller as being a "junk shop", I would accept that the seller knows little about cameras, and simply has come across this one. It may be functional, it may not. I have purchased many such cameras from similar folks at boot sales, etc. Sometimes I've made out very well, and sometimes I have managed to purchase an ornament. All in all I think I've come out ahead. That's my 2 cents.

Q.G. · Mar 3, 2010

A seller who says he doesn't know whether the thing he is selling works, doesn't ask much (low starting price)... i don't see how he could be trying to pull the wool over someone's eyes.
I'd be more suspicious of someone saying that everything works perfectly.

It's an opportunity for someone willing to take a risk.

Some opportunity hunters will get carried away, and go too high in a bidding war with likeminded opportunity seekers.
If so, the seller get's lucky. That's how auctions work.

Ian Grant · Mar 3, 2010

Highly unlikely, the seller has no other photographic items listed, and says from a house clearance. Also has made a good effort to photograph the camera.

Ian

Rick A · Mar 3, 2010

It could be that the seller has done some home work, and knows enough to list serial numbers, even without knowing how to operate the camera.

Rick

Mats_A · Mar 3, 2010

JBrunner:
You might be right. I noticed the same thing. But IF I wanted to sell a broken camera on eBay my ad would look just like this one

r

Ps. I just love your sig.

elekm · Mar 3, 2010

Why must everything be a possible scam? Sometimes, sellers aren't photography or camera experts. They just have things to sell.

railwayman3 · Mar 3, 2010

I can't see any particular reason for being suspicious at all. The camera looks in nice condition, but the seller makes it quite clear that it may not be working. With 15 bids at present, I'd guess the only risk might be to get caught up in a bidding war and pay too much.

Could be a good buy for someone willing to take a chance, I'd be tempted myself if I needed another MF .

Mats_A · Mar 3, 2010

Maybe I need to be more trusting.
It most likely is a honest deal but something in the text woke my suspicion.

I need to watch less of Dr House. "It's a basic truth of the human condition that everybody lies."

r

JBrunner · Mar 3, 2010

shimoda said:
Maybe I need to be more trusting.
It most likely is a honest deal but something in the text woke my suspicion.

I need to watch less of Dr House. "It's a basic truth of the human condition that everybody lies."

r

I think it's about even money. You a gambler?

Mats_A · Mar 3, 2010

JBrunner said:
I think it's about even money. You a gambler?

Is poker considered gambling? But then I have not played poker in over six months so... maybe not.

r

pschauss · Mar 3, 2010

I make it a rule not to buy from a seller who says "I know nothing about cameras" or "I don't know if it works" or who will not a accept returns.

CBG · Mar 3, 2010

If it is worst case scam and you get nothing, you are out £65.00. If it is broken, you are out a repair fee. I'm guessing that if it is in perfect working order, it would be worth somewhat more than the asking price here. I'm making a wild guess that it would be worth £100.00 to £150.00???

Here are your possibilities - just a complete guess - you can do your own math and see what you think...

Chance of a total rip off and nothing of any value arrives at your door . . . . . . 5% likelihood of receiving value of £0.00

The chance it is broken or at least needs a tune up seems about even to me. . .45% likelihood of receiving value of £20.00

Chance it is in perfect order . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .50% likelihood of receiving value of £100.00 to £150.00

When I sum up what could happen I'm guessing that the price offered is reasonable.

Mats_A · Mar 3, 2010

CBG said:
If it is worst case scam and you get nothing, you are out £65.00. If it is broken, you are out a repair fee. I'm guessing that if it is in perfect working order, it would be worth somewhat more than the asking price here. I'm making a wild guess that it would be worth £100.00 to £150.00???

Here are your possibilities - just a complete guess - you can do your own math and see what you think...

Chance of a total rip off and nothing of any value arrives at your door . . . . . . 5% likelihood of receiving value of £0.00

The chance it is broken or at least needs a tune up seems about even to me. . .45% likelihood of receiving value of £20.00

Chance it is in perfect order . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .50% likelihood of receiving value of £100.00 to £150.00

When I sum up what could happen I'm guessing that the price offered is reasonable.

I think the price will rise over a 100. Rolleicord Vb:s in good condition have been selling on eBay lately for over 200£

r

fotch · Mar 3, 2010

If the seller knew how to try it and it worked the one or two times he operated it, that does not guarantee that it would work a third time or fourth time after the buyer receives it. Used, 50 years old, certainly in need of routine cleaning and lubrication, what more could be expected other than AS IS?

Some professional repairers sell recondition used cameras with a guarantee, for a price that reflects a fully functioning used camera, and of course, it cost a lot more.

Buying used as is doesn't guarantee a good buy.

Mats_A · Mar 3, 2010

fotch said:
If the seller knew how to try it and it worked the one or two times he operated it, that does not guarantee that it would work a third time or fourth time after the buyer receives it. Used, 50 years old, certainly in need of routine cleaning and lubrication, what more could be expected other than AS IS?

Some professional repairers sell recondition used cameras with a guarantee, for a price that reflects a fully functioning used camera, and of course, it cost a lot more.

Buying used as is doesn't guarantee a good buy.

You are right. But then I (as seller) would have said it just as you did now. Claiming you know nothing and are selling in good faith..... Hmmm

As I said, I might have to learn to trust people more.

r

ic-racer · Mar 3, 2010

Scamming a Rolleicord?? Probably not worth the effort Maybe if it was an Aurum from Nigeria with a $200 buy it now :0

Mats_A · Mar 3, 2010

ic-racer said:
Scamming a Rolleicord?? Whats the point Maybe if it was an Aurum with a $200 buy it now :0

As I said. Rolleicord Vb:s in good looking condition have been selling for over £200. Don't know about you but for me that is money. Not a fortune but still money.

r

Jojje · Mar 3, 2010

One of his other items made me wonder...:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Jewellery-Job-Lot_W0QQitemZ280473230240QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Jewellery_Watches_VintageCostumeJewellery_CA?hash=item414d81dba0[/URL]
If in doubt, there will always be others.
Why not buy from german or english e-bay - sensible prices.

fotch · Mar 3, 2010

shimoda said:
You are right. But then I (as seller) would have said it just as you did now. Claiming you know nothing and are selling in good faith..... Hmmm

As I said, I might have to learn to trust people more.

r

Oh, I don't know. Maybe not.

Whenever I see a seller claiming they know nothing about it, I automatically assume its likely that may know but won't tell. In any case, if the risk is not worth the reward, pass it up.

I have purchased items like this and usually get a good deal. On the other hand, when there has been full description, it may have been misleading, and I have had to either to reverse or settle for a partial refund. "As is" means no recourse.

suzyj · Mar 3, 2010

One of my nicest cameras is a Nikon FE2, that I bought on ebay for AU$50, from a listing with one dreadful photo of a dirty camera, and a description not unlike this one. I didn't bid very much, because I didn't want to be burned too bad if it wasn't working. Sure enough, it turned out that under a good thick layer of dust, there was an absolutely beautiful camera, in close to mint condition. I've since put dozens of rolls of film through it without a hitch.

The listings I tend to stay away from are the ones where the item is well described and beautifully photographed, as I know they'll go for silly money. Of course, when I sell things, I make sure to describe them in great detail and to take lots and lots of beautiful photos.

This one's half way - there are beautiful photos, showing a camera in impeccable cosmetic condition, but dreadful text. Personally I would impose a moderate maximum bid, program that into a sniper, and refuse to look again until after the auction has ended.

Andy K · Mar 3, 2010

shimoda said:
Take a look at http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280470846718&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

It's a Rolleicord Vb. Seller claims that he knows nothing about it and can't even tell if it's working.
It seems to be in B+ condition so a prima specimen should bring over 200.

Something in the text suggests to me that the seller knows more about that than he claims. Maybe the fact that he mentions serial number whithout anyone asking for it.

Is this a scam, such that he knows it is broken and sells it anyway. If it's in good condition you could get yourself a Cord Vb for a very cheap price.

Or you could pay way too much for something with a broken shutter.

What's your opinion O Mighty Forum Brain?

r

Ps. I am not asking for advice. Ordered my Rolleicord from KEH 3 days ago.

I have seen a couple of Rolleicord Vb TLR's go for over £200 recently. As Rolleiflex prices climb, 'cords seem to be gaining in popularity.

John Koehrer · Mar 3, 2010

I'd set a highest bid limit for myself & snipe it. That way the other bidders don't know that there's another interested party & you have set the maximum that you will bid.
I didn't notice shipping charges though.

Wayne R. Scott · Mar 3, 2010

If I am interested in an auction item that has a low starting bid, the last thing on earth I would do is ask about the item on an internet forum. You have just added from one to fifty competitors for your item. I'm am betting it goes for well over 150.

Wayne

ic-racer · Mar 3, 2010

shimoda said:
As I said. Rolleicord Vb:s in good looking condition have been selling for over £200. Don't know about you but for me that is money. Not a fortune but still money.

r

Ok, I thought you meant a scam where they just found a picture on the internet. Looks like the concern is that it may not function 100%. The starting bid was very reasonable though. If someone wants to bid more I'd let them

Did you get your own from KEH yet? If the finder seems dim, remember the fresnel was an option that fit on top of the ground glass.
I just had my Rolleicord out last week. I usually print them 6" x 6" and at that size the images are indistinguishable from those taken with a 2.8F.

Is this a clever scam?

Mats_A

JBrunner

Moderator

Q.G.

Ian Grant

Rick A

Mats_A

elekm

railwayman3

Mats_A

JBrunner

Moderator

Mats_A

pschauss

CBG

Mats_A

fotch

Mats_A

ic-racer

Mats_A

Jojje

fotch

suzyj

Andy K

John Koehrer

Wayne R. Scott

ic-racer

Is this a clever scam?

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