Is it possible to over replenish stock XTOL?

Mainecoonmaniac · Jul 3, 2011

I've been using replenished XTOL stock 70mls per roll. It seems that my negs are are getting thinner as I use the replenished developer with time. Could I add a little more per roll? I would think that it would be impossible to over-replenish since I'm using stock developer. Anybody else finds that 70mls per roll is a bit conservative also? Or is it just me? :confused:

trexx · Jul 3, 2011

We all have to fine tune the amounts. If I do five rolls at once I do 350 or 7o ml per roll. but one or two roll I do 100ml per roll.

Can you over replenish. May be if the volume of the replenished stock is low. I keep my volume at 2.5L

markbarendt · Jul 3, 2011

Mainecoonmaniac said:
I've been using replenished XTOL stock 70mls per roll. It seems that my negs are are getting thinner as I use the replenished developer with time. Could I add a little more per roll? I would think that it would be impossible to over-replenish since I'm using stock developer. Anybody else finds that 70mls per roll is a bit conservative also? Or is it just me? :confused:

How old is the unused stock?

How many rolls have you run?

How big is your "replenished" bottle?

Ian Grant · Jul 3, 2011

You may need to look at how you're storing the Xtol, (stock & replenisher) I've never had issues with thinner negatives with any replenished developers until the developer begins to collapse - but that's heavy commercial usage and there's tell tale signs, negatives are still OK but contrast drops etc.

Type of bottle is quite critical particularly if plastic, some breathe oxygen and I've had devs go off in under 3 months that last 18 months in the right bottles.

Ian

Mainecoonmaniac · Jul 3, 2011

I use polyethylene bottles for the developer

Ian Grant said:
Type of bottle is quite critical particularly if plastic, some breathe oxygen and I've had devs go off in under 3 months that last 18 months in the right bottles.

Ian

I also use an air tight glass bottle to store the replenisher. Is polyethylene gas permeable?

Ian Grant · Jul 3, 2011

Some polyethylene bottles are gas permeable, which surprised me initially. The high density ones are fine.

Ian

Mainecoonmaniac · Jul 3, 2011

Thanks I checked

Ian Grant said:
Some polyethylene bottles are gas permeable, which surprised me initially. The high density ones are fine.

Ian

I'll avoid the non-high density Polyethlene containers.

I checked the container and it's HDPE. I've been using an Ikea Lingonberry syrup 1.5 liter containers.

I guess I'll have to figure out my own way of replenishing my XTOL.

markbarendt · Jul 3, 2011

You may just need to adjust your time a bit.

Maris · Jul 4, 2011

My Xtol is 4 years old and is replenished at the rate of 90ml per standard film. Its activity is 75% of fresh and a routine developing time increase takes care of that. After many square metres of film I doubt any atoms of the original Xtol batch are still present but the stuff is unerringly consistent film after film after film....

Mainecoonmaniac · Jul 4, 2011

Wow that's amazing. Do you see a huge difference between your seasoned developer and a fresher batch of XTOL?

markbarendt · Jul 4, 2011

Yes, a significant difference. That's why I asked how many rolls you've done.

Newt_on_Swings · Jul 4, 2011

Hmm maybe I should start replenishing my xtol. I have been using 1:2 and 1:3 dilutions 1 shot. Do you guys see a good bit of savings?

cjbecker · Jul 4, 2011

I replenish with 100 per roll. I am still working out all of my numbers though. I have had probably 75 rolls through it.

Also been going for 3.5 months.

Nicholas Lindan · Jul 5, 2011

Newt_on_Swings said:
Hmm maybe I should start replenishing my xtol. I have been using 1:2 and 1:3 dilutions 1 shot. Do you guys see a good bit of savings?

Replenished Xtol is used full strength. So you are using 100ml FS / roll when replenishing.

Compare that to 1-Shot:

35mm 36ex in a 250 ml/roll tank: 1:2 uses 83ml; 1:3 uses 62ml.
120 in a 500 ml/roll tank: 1:2 uses 167 ml; 1:3 uses 125ml.

Replenishing makes sense if photography is your business - for an amateur like myself a stable developer (D-76 1:1, Microdol-X 1:3, HC-110h from syrup) used 1-shot makes more sense.

Newt_on_Swings · Jul 6, 2011

Nicholas Lindan said:
Replenished Xtol is used full strength. So you are using 100ml FS / roll when replenishing.

Compare that to 1-Shot:

35mm 36ex in a 250 ml/roll tank: 1:2 uses 83ml; 1:3 uses 62ml.

120 in a 500 ml/roll tank: 1:2 uses 167 ml; 1:3 uses 125ml.

Replenishing makes sense if photography is your business - for an amateur like myself a stable developer (D-76 1:1, Microdol-X 1:3, HC-110h from syrup) used 1-shot makes more sense.

Thanks, I guess I'll stick to using it 1 shot!

markbarendt · Jul 6, 2011

I actually replenished at Kodak's 70ml recomendation which worked great. For 35 mm that gets replenishment very close to one shot dilute economy.

The places replenishment really shines are for economy are where larger tanks need filling. A roll of 120 only costs 70 ml regardless of tank size in replenished Xtol.

When sheet film hits the equation, the difference become significant. I can fill a 1.1 liter tank to do a single sheet of 4x5 and it only costs 18ml of Xtol.

Nicholas Lindan said:
Replenished Xtol is used full strength. So you are using 100ml FS / roll when replenishing.

Compare that to 1-Shot:

35mm 36ex in a 250 ml/roll tank: 1:2 uses 83ml; 1:3 uses 62ml.

120 in a 500 ml/roll tank: 1:2 uses 167 ml; 1:3 uses 125ml.

Replenishing makes sense if photography is your business - for an amateur like myself a stable developer (D-76 1:1, Microdol-X 1:3, HC-110h from syrup) used 1-shot makes more sense.

Ian Grant · Jul 6, 2011

I've used replenished developers since the late 60's, there's major advantages in using Xtol replenished, one of which is economy.

The Kodak replenishment figure of 70ml per 35mm film or 80 sq inches are quite high, this is based on bleed replenishment, and in practice is more than is theoretically needed. So the figures above are meaningless particularly when processing 120 and 5x4 and multple rolls of 35mm.

However the other advantages are finer grain, better acutance and an improved tonal range and very consistent results, plus you have developer made up ready for instant use which cuts times considerably. It's forgotten than many developers were designed for replenishment from the outset and their use dilute came later.

Ian

L Gebhardt · Jul 6, 2011

Any of you using replenished XTOL in a Jobo, or other rotary tank? Does the presumably increased oxidation cause a problem?

Is it possible to over replenish stock XTOL?

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