Is HC-110 Killing my stop bath?

Kaboom · Sep 22, 2009

Hi!
I've always used Kodak acetic stop with indicator and never once in my life had i seen it lose strength, i always discarded way before that happened.
But ever since i started using HC-110 a couple of weeks ago, it seems to change color very, very quickly.
Granted i'm doing a lot more printing, but that doesn't justify how quickly its losing strength.
Does HC-110 do this or am i just being paranoid? the bottle of concentrate is freshly opened (the stop one, the HC-110 has been opened but almost full for about 2 years).
Also, i have noticed that now when i fix and wash the film the fixer and water seem to come out with a slight pinkish tinge to them. However when i re-pour the fixer out of the bottle next time it seems perfectly clear. WTF??? Could this also be because of the HC-110? or is it the anti-halation layer in the T-MAX (i thought that was supposed to be dissolved in the developer) i'm currently developing?

any help appreciated!

trexx · Sep 22, 2009

See the stick thread on the pink for more background about it. The source of the pink goes away in fixer, also in washing, so when you poor it back in the container it is pink and a short time later it is back to clear.
As for stop you can test the ph and see if the indicator is correct. I just use water for film so I don't know the file of fix and HC110. But the stop will look like grape koolaid when exhusted.

MattKing · Sep 22, 2009

In your post you note "Granted i'm doing a lot more printing".

Are you using HC110 as a print developer? If so, how do your prints look?

The stop bath will go from acid to alkaline, and the indicator will change colour, if a sufficient quantity of sufficiently alkaline chemistry (developer, for instance) dilutes it. If you change developers, you may very well be increasing the alkalinity of the chemistry that carries over into the stop bath.

To the chemists out there - is HC110 (say dilution B) likely to be more or less alkaline then print developer (say Dektol stock)?

Matt

eddym · Sep 22, 2009

You could avoid the problem by switching to a water rinse stop.

jeffreyg · Sep 22, 2009

I second Eddy McDonald. I have never used acid stop for film (30+ years) always water - with a variety of developers and have no problems.

Kaboom · Sep 22, 2009

stop is cheap enough that after reading a lot of threads and info about acid vs water i think i'll stick to the acid. i might try a couple of rolls and a few prints with the water stop and see how i like it.

Nope, i'm not developing paper in HC-110, but i think i might give that a go too and see how it turns out now that i have a couple of batches of old paper. I mentioned the printing increase because i thought it might be influencing the stop depletion more than the HC-110.

About the pink tinge- Sorry, i must have missed it! i read the threads and didnt see it. I guess that's why i've also read that apparently t-grain films deplete fixer faster than traditional film.

lns · Sep 22, 2009

If I'm reading you right, you are using the same stop for film and paper? In which case, I think you are right that the increased use is probably what's exhausting the stop.

I've used HC-110 and never noticed it had any effect on the stop, but I use Ilford's Ilfostop. Ilford says to discard the mixed Ilfostop after 7 working days, so I do prepare a fresh batch every once in while whether it turns purple or not. Actually, it has never turned purple on me. Like you, I'd rather be safe and sorry, especially since it's pretty cheap.

-Laura

Monophoto · Sep 22, 2009

Kaboom said:
Hi!
I've always used Kodak acetic stop with indicator and never once in my life had i seen it lose strength, i always discarded way before that happened.
But ever since i started using HC-110 a couple of weeks ago, it seems to change color very, very quickly.
Granted i'm doing a lot more printing, but that doesn't justify how quickly its losing strength.
/QUOTE]

First, HC110 is film developer. I don't understand how your printing volume enters the discussion at all.

Indicator stop changes from yellow to purple when it is exhausted. Actually, the color is an indication of the pH of the stop. Developer is alkaline, while stop and fixer are acid. When the carry-over from the developer causes the fixer to change from acid to alkaline, it changes from yellow to purple.

I have never seen stop change color when processing film. Now, I will say that I use stop as a one shot - discarding it after a single use. Actually, in recent years I have not actually used acid/indicator stop - just a plain water rinse.

So if you are talking about film development with HC110, and you are seeing the stop change from yellow to purple, then either you are reusing stop (which I don't recommend), or you are not carrying over an enormous amount of developer into the fixer.

fschifano · Sep 23, 2009

Are you using the same batch of stop bath for both film and paper then? It's probably a safe bet that you're using the same batch of fixer for both as well. Not the best idea in the world. Tray processing papers introduces all sorts of particulate matter into the tray. Some of it is airborne, and some of it comes from the paper itself. None of it matters much to the print, but there might be the possibility of having some of that crud stick to your film, and that's not good. Do yourself a favor by keeping the whole process as clean as possible. Use separate batches of stop and fix, one for film and one for paper.

MattKing · Sep 23, 2009

fschifano said:
Are you using the same batch of stop bath for both film and paper then? It's probably a safe bet that you're using the same batch of fixer for both as well. Not the best idea in the world. Tray processing papers introduces all sorts of particulate matter into the tray. Some of it is airborne, and some of it comes from the paper itself. None of it matters much to the print, but there might be the possibility of having some of that crud stick to your film, and that's not good. Do yourself a favor by keeping the whole process as clean as possible. Use separate batches of stop and fix, one for film and one for paper.

What Frank said!

Matt

Henry Alive · Sep 23, 2009

I can not tell you what is happening with your film developing system, but I would like to recommend you what I usually do:
- Develop with HC110 for the adequate period of time. I do not recuperate this liquid.
- I fill the tank with water, and I wash and stop the film for 1 minute. This water is throw it away.
- I fill the tank with the Stop Liquid, and after 1 minute I recuperate it for using again.
- I fill the tank with water again, and I wash the film for 1 more minute. This water is throw it away.
- I fill the tank with the Fixer Liquid, and after the appropriate time (5 minutes in my case) I recuperate it for using again.
- Finally, I wash the film and practically the process has finished.
In this way, using the water washing stapes, I am sure the stop and fixer liquid will be cleaner and, for instance, they could be in good conditions for new process.
Henry.

Is HC-110 Killing my stop bath?

Kaboom

trexx

MattKing

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eddym

jeffreyg

Kaboom

lns

Monophoto

fschifano

MattKing

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Henry Alive

Is HC-110 Killing my stop bath?

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