Insuring "vintage" Hasselblad V equipment as non-pro

ChrisBCS · Mar 21, 2017

So I'm piecing together my V system, the body a '67 500C and the lens a '75 80mm planar, etc.

These are still high value items that don't depreciate like that new Canon dslr body once it is two years old.

This setup will not be for studio work, and will face a lot of wide wide world risks, so I'd like to get it covered under homeowners.

Anyone have experience or advice on this? It would be greatly appreciated!

Chris

Eric Rose · Mar 21, 2017

I just give it a dollar replacement value and insure it at that.

Fujicaman1957 · Mar 21, 2017

See your agent and get a separate policy for photo equipment. I have mine thru State Farm and they charge me about $12 per $1000 dollars worth of equipment.

Moopheus · Mar 21, 2017

ChrisBCS said:
These are still high value items that don't depreciate like that new Canon dslr body once it is two years old.

Well, they depreciated like a new camera, 30 or 40 years ago.

ChrisBCS · Mar 21, 2017

Moopheus said:
Well, they depreciated like a new camera, 30 or 40 years ago.

Hahah! Excellent point.

ChrisBCS · Mar 21, 2017

Fujicaman1957 said:
See your agent and get a separate policy for photo equipment. I have mine thru State Farm and they charge me about $12 per $1000 dollars worth of equipment.

Excellent. Thank you.

ac12 · Mar 21, 2017

TALK to YOUR insurance agent, as coverage varies from company to company.
What coverage any of us have may not be what you can get.

Policy
- Some companies will insure a camera under basic "home owners" only up to $X.
  To insure beyond that, you would then need a separate camera rider.
- Some companies may cover all your photo gear (up to $xx,xxx) as a non-professional under 'home owners.'
- Specifics:
  - Some policies/riders may require detailed listing of each piece of gear to be insured; description and serial number.
  - Where in the policy is coverage for misc gear; case, meter, tripod, head, etc, etc.
  - Watch out for EXPENSIVE misc gear. A Gitzo tripod + head, costs as much as a camera.
Recovery:
- Some companies will insure at replacement value.
  So you can pay $1,000 for the camera, but insure for $3,000. You will pay premium on the $3,000 insured value.
- Some companies will pay out based on depreciated value, or cost less depreciation. So each year your gear is worth less and less.
  But watch out, you may still be paying premium based on the original cost, even though the coverage is going down each year.
Other
- Very important is to find out what is NOT covered.
  - Some will cover theft but not damage from dropping the camera, others may cover both.
- And where you may need additional coverage/rider.
  - Example, travel outside the US.

ChrisBCS · Mar 21, 2017

Thank you ac12!

Sirius Glass · Mar 21, 2017

I had replacement cost coverage on my home owner's policy for years. I finally stopped buying the insurance.

nsurit · Mar 22, 2017

Insuring as part of your homeowners policy typically would insure it for for specified perils. Basically the same things covered by the homeowners policy. Things like fire, theft, etc and probably with the same deductibles and exclusions.

Insuring on a separate policy typically would offer "all risk, world wide." An example might be when look over the side of the boat and your camera slips off you neck and goes swimming. Covered under an all risk policy, not on your homeowners.

Replacement cost vs actual cash value. In my opinion, they are one in the same when you are looking at the kind of photo equipment we use. What would it cost to replace your Hasselblad 500C with like kind and quality?

Yes, I am a retired insurance agent, having worked for a company all would recognize. About 10 or 12 years ago, I had a theft loss of camera gear that amounted to about $9000 and a couple of smaller losses later on. I decided to drop the insurance and absorb any future losses to my camera gear. That works for me. There would still be coverage, subject to high deductibles, at home or while traveling, assuming it was a peril covered by my homeowners.

Talk to your agent. Keep in mind your insurance company is not going to want to get nickeled and dimed to death with claims.

RalphLambrecht · Mar 24, 2017

ChrisBCS said:
So I'm piecing together my V system, the body a '67 500C and the lens a '75 80mm planar, etc.

These are still high value items that don't depreciate like that new Canon dslr body once it is two years old.

This setup will not be for studio work, and will face a lot of wide wide world risks, so I'd like to get it covered under homeowners.

Anyone have experience or advice on this? It would be greatly appreciated!

Chris

I found a reasonable 2nd -hand replacement value and bought a rider for the homeowners insurance about a decade ago. a few years back, I had spent more on insurance than the replacement would cost and canceled the rider

Theo Sulphate · Mar 24, 2017

Should one photograph the equipment as proof of ownership?

Maybe put the photos in a safety deposit box?

In my safety deposit box I have physical photos of various possessions as well as USB sticks with photos. However, I believe USB stick data will last only about 10 years unless rewritten.

Sirius Glass · Mar 24, 2017

RalphLambrecht said:
I found a reasonable 2nd -hand replacement value and bought a rider for the homeowners insurance about a decade ago. a few years back, I had spent more on insurance than the replacement would cost and canceled the rider

That is my experience too.

nsurit · Mar 24, 2017

Having photos and inventory of your property is very helpful. Used equipment is best (in my opinion) covered for ACV (actual cash value). Replacement cost and actual cash value would seem to be the same for a 500 C Hasselblad.

mgb74 · Mar 25, 2017

nsurit said:
Having photos and inventory of your property is very helpful. Used equipment is best (in my opinion) covered for ACV (actual cash value). Replacement cost and actual cash value would seem to be the same for a 500 C Hasselblad.

Just make sure the photos aren't stored in the same location in case of fire.

I assume digital photo files are adequate for documentation. But I would update them periodically to avoid issues with whether the condition as shown in the photos is current.

M Carter · Mar 25, 2017

Theo Sulphate said:
Should one photograph the equipment as proof of ownership?

Maybe put the photos in a safety deposit box?

In my safety deposit box I have physical photos of various possessions as well as USB sticks with photos. However, I believe USB stick data will last only about 10 years unless rewritten.

Safety deposit box? Sooo stone age!

Photograph your expensive gear. Make a spread sheet (or just a word doc) with serial numbers, model numbers, replacement value, etc. Put thumbnail sized images in the file with the file names of full sized photos. Upload it all to a free "cloud" account - dropbox gives you a free GB, I think google gives you 10 or 20 gigs. As you get new gear, it's easy to add that to the list.

My agent just laughed when I described my gear - dozens of packs and heads, HMI lights, hot lights, cinema stands and grip, film, digital and video cameras, a crazy amount of audio gear... he said I'd need a business rider and documentation of all the stuff, but as i recall, the price he quoted was reasonable and covered me when traveling, too (I do a lot of location work with digital, and usually bring an RB rig or an isolette if I drive far). Haul all that crap into motels, too.

So for me it makes sense - you really have to do the math and see with premium and deductible is worth the expense. You're often better off to get a premium quote, and open a savings account and religiously put aside that amount each month. Basically be your own insurance company. 15 years down the road without a "claim", and you could have a nice little sum.

The only things I would have claimed in 20 years: a theft of a light meter and Schneider loupe, probably by a delivery guy, $400? And a dropped Sigma lens. Both lower than deductible. But a fire or serious theft could wipe me out, so I'm working up my inventory documentation.

Theo Sulphate · Mar 25, 2017

M Carter said:
Safety deposit box? Sooo stone age!

I already have old negatives and other ancient family artifacts in the box. It's the safest place and it's dark and temperature controlled.

If saving things in dark cold stone enclosures were good enough for the Egyptian Pharaohs, they're good enough for me!

M Carter · Mar 27, 2017

Theo Sulphate said:
I already have old negatives and other ancient family artifacts in the box. It's the safest place and it's dark and temperature controlled.

If saving things in dark cold stone enclosures were good enough for the Egyptian Pharaohs, they're good enough for me!

Yep, for physical items that works. If you just have data, pics and spreadsheets for insurance, the cloud is pretty handy and you can just send a link to the claims dept.

I'm thinking of putting a small fridge in my detached garage and running Cat6 to it and sticking a backup drive in it - I usually have like 6TB of editing data going at any one time (too much for the cloud). They say the fridge is last to go in a fire and it's nicely sealed...

wombat2go · Mar 27, 2017

One time I towed a boat trailer over my camera bag, getting ready for vacation..
I put a claim to household insuance co. for an ME Super.
The insurance company asked me to re verify that I had actually run over the camera and that it occurred in the driveway.
After that I got a voucher to take to the local camera shop for a new Pentax.

nsurit · Apr 3, 2017

Guess I shouldn't have got myself involved in this thread. Bad Karma. This last weekend dropped my camera in an elevator. Busted it. If scheduled on an all risk policy it would have been covered. It wasn't. The sucking noise you hear is folding green leaving my wallet. I did know the risk and assumed it. That is OK.

cramej · Apr 3, 2017

RalphLambrecht said:
I found a reasonable 2nd -hand replacement value and bought a rider for the homeowners insurance about a decade ago. a few years back, I had spent more on insurance than the replacement would cost and canceled the rider

Same here - I had about $10k work of gear covered when I shot more weddings with digital equipment since there was a greater possibility of it being stolen. Several years after I slowed down on the weddings, I dropped the coverage and saved myself $300/year. I now only have a few individual pieces that would bruise the pocketbook to replace so it's not worth it anymore.

paul ron · Apr 4, 2017

OMG.. jinxed yourself! sheesh.

when I was in business, we insured our equipment but when it came time to collect.. .we got almost nothing after depreciation even though the stuff was very expensive, but OLD. The lesson learned was insure the people coming into our studio for a bit more instead of equipment.

We started to put away money each moth for replacement of equipment in case it happened again. We managed to save quite a few thousand in a short time. Lucky we never had another incident.. but the money saved did buy us a new balcar power box... the old one burned up and blacked out half the USA (1977) hahahahahahahahahha.

Arklatexian · May 22, 2018

Sirius Glass said:
That is my experience too.

I do not have any of my equipment insured. If I were smart, I would find out how much the insurance premium would be on an estimated replacement cost for all my gear, Then stash an equal amount away every year. It probably would not take too long before having enough money to duplicate all your equipment should you decide to do so. Do be sure that tax has been paid on the money set aside. Tax people get interested when lumps of money show up from seemingly nowhere. The moral of all this is: "insurance is expensive".......Regards!

film_man · May 22, 2018

There are two schools of thought. One is that insurance is expensive and over X years you could replace it or whatever. Which is accurate.

The other school is what I subscribe to. My insurance costs me 5% of the value insured (on a specialist photo gear insurer), ie 20 years to break even. So I can either keep paying that every year and take my gear out and not be too precious about it OR I can save that money and spend the next 20 years worrying if I drop the camera.

Neil Poulsen · Jun 2, 2018

nsurit said:
. . . on a separate policy typically would offer "all risk, world wide." An example might be when look over the side of the boat and your camera slips off you neck and goes swimming. Covered under an all risk policy, not on your homeowners.. . .

At least, check out the cost of insuring your equipment under a general photographer's insurance policy. (ASMP?) I had a photographer's policy for a while, and my equipment was insured world-wide and at replacement cost. When I compared what I was paying to insure my equipment in this policy to that of my home owners policy, it struck me that the latter was quite a bit more expensive per $1000.

Insuring "vintage" Hasselblad V equipment as non-pro

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