I'm asking the general public here... what dslr has the best monochrome (b&w) profile?

vanislandguy · Jun 7, 2024

I have been on a hunt of finding an older camera. An older dslr that has the best jpg ( out of camera ) monochrome profile looking almost like it was shot on film. I heard the 5d classic does well. What about specification? A CCD vs CMOS? Full frame or APSC? Low 10 or high 30 mega pixels camera is best? Can anyone go into clinical depth into this topic with links and maybe some comparison photos? I would like to see a combination of photographers give their experience or input. My goal is to buy a camera but want to make sure I buy the right one.

What about older DSLR's being turned into monochrome? Taking off the bayer filter. Is this a good way to go? Who might do this in Canada? So much here to talk about. Thanks

xkaes · Jun 7, 2024

vanislandguy said:
Can anyone go into clinical depth into this topic with links and maybe some comparison photos?

You mean do your work for you?

BrianShaw · Jun 7, 2024

"I'm asking the general pubic here... "

Just suggestion. but you might want to edit the title a bit. While sometimes some people can act like Richards, as you can see, it's certain that you're interested in other opinions too.

what dslr has the best monochrome (b&w) profile - Google Search

MattKing · Jun 7, 2024

BrianShaw said:
"I'm asking the general pubic here... "

Just suggestion. but you might want to edit the title a bit.

Fixed now - thanks for noting that Brian .

markjwyatt · Jun 7, 2024

vanislandguy said:
I have been on a hunt of finding an older camera. An older dslr that has the best jpg ( out of camera ) monochrome profile looking almost like it was shot on film. I heard the 5d classic does well. What about specification? A CCD vs CMOS? Full frame or APSC? Low 10 or high 30 mega pixels camera is best? Can anyone go into clinical depth into this topic with links and maybe some comparison photos? I would like to see a combination of photographers give their experience or input. My goal is to buy a camera but want to make sure I buy the right one.

What about older DSLR's being turned into monochrome? Taking off the bayer filter. Is this a good way to go? Who might do this in Canada? So much here to talk about. Thanks

Some of the Leica rangefinder (e.g., not a DSLR) monochromes are quite good (CMOS). I think Pentax recently came out with a monochrome DSLR also, but have not seen too much of the output. In general, I find the explicitly monochrome sensors work better than color sensors desaturated, but I do not have hard proof of that.

I still prefer B&W film to desaturating my Fuji XT-2.

Paul Howell · Jun 7, 2024

Pentax K3 monochrome, examples I've seen on line look really nice. Saying that my Pentax K 2000 in monochrome mode works pretty well, easy to adjust contrast in PS, light room or Corel. But my current fav is the Sigma SD 9 or 10.

vanislandguy · Jun 7, 2024

xkaes said:
You mean do your work for you?

No. Obviously, it would hard to try the many different cameras out there to get the right look I'm after. I'm just asking the public for their input. Is this a no go question nowadays? Sharing information together with like minded individuals. Wow???

vanislandguy · Jun 7, 2024

Paul Howell said:
Pentax K3 monochrome, examples I've seen on line look really nice. Saying that my Pentax K 2000 in monochrome mode works pretty well, easy to adjust contrast in PS, light room or Corel. But my current fav is the Sigma SD 9 or 10.

Great. Thats sounds like an intellectual reply. Not like the other gent. I appreciate your logical valued point there. Yes, I have heard Pentax have some nice examples. Thank you.

koraks · Jun 7, 2024

xkaes said:
You mean do your work for you?

That was totally uncalled for. Please don't do that again.

As to the question asked - I'm afraid I only have experience converting digital images to B&W with the channel mixer and selective multi-layer adjustments*. I've always found this a particularly powerful approach that reduces reliance on what the camera does quite minimal. If I were to do digital B&W, I'd probably continue doing it that exact way.

* When I got my first DSLR, a Canon 20D, I did in fact try out its B&W jpeg functionality. It was perfectly acceptable/usable. Never used it much though.

vanislandguy · Jun 7, 2024

koraks said:
That was totally uncalled for. Please don't do that again.

As to the question asked - I'm afraid I only have experience converting digital images to B&W with the channel mixer and selective multi-layer adjustments*. I've always found this a particularly powerful approach that reduces reliance on what the camera does quite minimal. If I were to do digital B&W, I'd probably continue doing it that exact way.

* When I got my first DSLR, a Canon 20D, I did in fact try out its B&W jpeg functionality. It was perfectly acceptable/usable. Never used it much though.

Thank you. As an inexperienced photographer I value your suggestion and creative practice to convert images. I will have to find and dig further into this method. Again, thank you.

BradS · Jun 7, 2024

I would think that the issue / opportunity with a DSLR is that you still see the scene in color...no? I wonder if some of the new mirrorless cameras show the scene in B&W when set to output B&W jpegs?

koraks · Jun 7, 2024

BradS said:
I wonder if some of the new mirrorless cameras show the scene in B&W when set to output B&W jpegs?

Good point; the camera actually doesn't have to be all that new for this. I checked my EOS 7D and its live view does give a monochrome image if that's selected as the recording mode - so it's effectively WYSIWYG.

vanislandguy said:
Thank you. As an inexperienced photographer I value your suggestion and creative practice to convert images. I will have to find and dig further into this method. Again, thank you.

Sure thing! Don't tell anyone - I gleaned this trick many years ago from no other than Ken Rockwell....(who surely didn't think of it himself, either).

Hassasin · Jun 7, 2024

I know one thing, I've been astonished by FUJI B&W output straight from camera without any post. So long as exposure is within margin, and auto mode will get that most of the time, the results are great.

I have been intrigued by the Pentax Monochrome offering, and whatever I could find on line looked really good too, but splurging on Mono body while owning Fuji H1 does not seem logical, especially with several top X lenses in the bag.

Hassasin · Jun 7, 2024

BradS said:
I would think that the issue / opportunity with a DSLR is that you still see the scene in color...no? I wonder if some of the new mirrorless cameras show the scene in B&W when set to output B&W jpegs?

Fuji surely does.

BradS · Jun 7, 2024

vanislandguy said:
What about older DSLR's being turned into monochrome? Taking off the bayer filter. Is this a good way to go?

I don't think this would be feasible. Seems like the surgery would be prohibitively expensive, and the firmware would be all kinda confused.

You also ask a lot of questions about specs and so on ... searching for the best anything is folly. There is no perfect camera. Every single one is a compromise of some sort, and "Best" is also highly subjective - what's best depends entirely upon what's important to you. What's best is often what one is used to. Ergonomics, for example, count for a lot.

So, don't worry too much about finding "the Best". Seems like it would be better to just get a new or relatively new camera and start making photos. Finding a camera body that fits your hands from a brand whose controls and menus make some sense to you is, perhaps, more important than all those nitty-gritty technical specifications.

There is MUCH to learn and no matter how much time you put into researching on-line, you won't really start to learn anything until you start doing. Get a camera and start.

BradS · Jun 7, 2024

Hassasin said:
Fuji surely does.

That's really cool!
...and they have that Fuji Acros film sim.....hmmm...so, tempting.

markjwyatt · Jun 7, 2024

BradS said:
That's really cool!
...and they have that Fuji Acros film sim.....hmmm...so, tempting.

Yes, Fuji ACROS sim may be the exception for FUJI and desaturated color sensor output. I have not played enough with it. They have put a lot of interesting ideas into that simulation. I still do prefer B&W film though.

Paul Howell · Jun 7, 2024

BradS said:
I don't think this would be feasible. Seems like the surgery would be prohibitively expensive, and the firmware would be all kinda confused.

You also ask a lot of questions about specs and so on ... searching for the best anything is folly. There is no perfect camera. Every single one is a compromise of some sort, and "Best" is also highly subjective - what's best depends entirely upon what's important to you. What's best is often what one is used to. Ergonomics, for example, count for a lot.

So, don't worry too much about finding "the Best". Seems like it would be better to just get a new or relatively new camera and start making photos. Finding a camera body that fits your hands from a brand whose controls and menus make some sense to you is, perhaps, more important than all those nitty-gritty technical specifications.

There is MUCH to learn and no matter how much time you put into researching on-line, you won't really start to learn anything until you start doing. Get a camera and start.

+1, for the cost I would get a K3 monochrome, $2K new, not sure if it has been out long enough to many used.

loccdor · Jun 7, 2024

I like doing the per-image adjustment that Koraks suggested because the best looking profile is actually going to vary a lot from image to image. Working this way allows you to tailor it to get the best result for your specific case.

Something that can help your eye visualize in monochrome as well as improve your final image is to use a color filter, most commonly a yellow. It will take some of the variety of color out of the scene when you look through the viewfinder or at the LCD screen.

abruzzi · Jun 7, 2024

If you want the insane answer, a phase one 150mp IQ4 150 Achromatic back installed on a Phase One XF. After you realize that will cost $30k or more, then I’d definitely look at the Pentax K3 monochrome. I’ve not used one, but what I’ve seen from them is very very nice. Also as mentioned a mirror less Fuji with the film simulations can create a very nice jpg.

BradS · Jun 8, 2024

markjwyatt said:
... I still do prefer B&W film though.

Yeah, me too but I've no darkroom at the moment and the nearest merely competent mini-lab is ~100miles away. So, I decided to finally give digital a try. Got a Nikon Zfc a couple of years ago - my first ever digital camera. The learning curve has been insanely steep - like starting all over again. It's challenging but fun.

BradS · Jun 8, 2024

incidentally, I just checked the Nikon Zfc ... it also displays a monochrome image when any of the various monochrome picture controls is selected!

Pretty cool!

BrianShaw · Jun 8, 2024

I use a 4.1 megapixel Sony Cybershot and the monochrome that comes out looks quite a bit like Tri-X.

bdial · Jun 8, 2024

I’ve seen some truly lovely 16x20 prints done with a Leica monochrome and a monochrome ink set on the printer. I don’t know what used Monochromes go for, but it’s likely more than a new Pentax.
That said, if I could afford it, the Leica would be my choice, otherwise, I’d perfect my skills of doing it in post, using whichever digi body suited me. My D850 has a monochrome mode, but I’ve not really explored it.

Paul Howell · Jun 8, 2024

bdial brings up a good point, spending on Leica or Pentax monochrome also means a better than standard inkjet ink set, so printer, inkset and monochrome ink adds what the price.

I'm asking the general public here... what dslr has the best monochrome (b&w) profile?

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