ilnesses related to black and white photography

removed account4 · May 1, 2014

just wondering if there are any illnesses ( acute or minor )
related to black and white photo chemistry.
im not talking pyro or exotics
but regular old run of the mill m/hq developer and fixer ( speed or hypo )

and i mean using your hands, and having a not so well ventilated chamber.

i know of dermatitis, anything else ?

BrianShaw · May 1, 2014

fatigue and malaise (at times)

Bob Carnie · May 1, 2014

One of the best fashion printers in Toronto in the early 90's had to quit printing , every time she walked into the darkroom she had major reactions. I believe it had to do with the fixer.

Shame as she was really good.

heterolysis · May 1, 2014

As Bob mentioned, sensitization could be a problem for some people. Things may not bother you now, but after years of exposure even small doses may be too much. Wear gloves and get the best ventilation you can. I develop in a bathroom with very minimal air circulation, but don't plan on it as a long-term solution.

Capsaicin is a sensitizer and after years of cutting hot peppers my hands flare up really badly. A good rule of thumb is just to always be careful.

Vaughn · May 1, 2014

I know you are not asking about alt processing, but I now have asthma due to platinum printing -- from blow-drying the freshly coated prints over a five year period. It (asthma) hit me all at once. Now I air dry them and have no problems. Blow-drying kicked platinum salts into the air.

Gerald C Koch · May 1, 2014

Early photographers seemed to have a shorter life span and this has been attributed to the use of various developing agents. Edward Weston developed a Parkinson-like neural condition in later life that has been connected to Amidol. His finger nails were turned black by this chemical as he did not use tongs or gloves.

Para- and ortho-phenylenediamine and their derivatives, the color developing agents besides causing severe dermatitis can cause cross-sensitization toward other chemicals. Metol poisoning is well known but its incidence has decreased with newer production methods that do not start with phenylenediamine. Absorption of developing agents through the skin can lead to liver and kidney failure.

As I mentioned on another thread fixer is safe and used as an off-label treatment for various skin conditions. Sodium thiosulfate is used to treat cyanide poisoning.

yulia_s_rey · May 1, 2014

Mental health only. First, it makes you seem schizophrenic: you write hundreds of little, dated labels and paste them around your darkroom (especially on chems and papers) and you write pages upon pages of notes only you can understand. Second, you get OCD: you follow strict and often weird rituals when you found your desired effect:I insist only only using branch water. Temps have to be exactly 68.54° F, then agitate for the first 58 sec, then for 23 secs every min...It's madness!

Fortunately, your physical health is not affected as long as you wear gloves and an apron and have good ventilation in your work area.

summicron1 · May 1, 2014

some folks get skin reactions to the fixer -- depends on how sensitive you are. I get some from using my fingers, switched to tongs, end of problem.

highly sensitive folks can't even be in the same room as the stuff. If you are one of those yu will know very quickly.

pgomena · May 1, 2014

I knew a guy who became so sensitized to photographic chemicals he couldn't walk into a gang darkroom at photo school without his eyes swelling up and mattering. He had to give up all wet processing and sent his film to a lab. He was OK around B&W machine processors, but wet processes were out.

I used to be "hands in" processing film and paper. I now wear gloves for wet processes and only work in a well-ventilated space.

MattKing · May 1, 2014

I expect that many of the health effects experienced by darkroom workers are the result of spending long hours in dark, poorly ventilated rooms, and would be almost as likely to occur if there were no photographic chemicals involved.

I've spent years (decades!) getting my hands in black and white chemicals, without ill effects. I am very careful, however, about ventilation and now recommend gloves and tongs to everyone and try to follow my own advice.

DREW WILEY · May 1, 2014

The most chronic side effect is boredom from doing other things, once you get hooked on darkroom work.

Prof_Pixel · May 1, 2014

I suppose SO2 fumes from fixers could be a real problem.

ntenny · May 1, 2014

GAS.

-NT

pdeeh · May 1, 2014

SO2 definitely gives me a short but sharp dose of asthma; not at all from fixer, but from Selenium toner. Not nice.
I've learned to try and be careful mixing up potions containing Sodium metabisulfite for the same reason

Gerald C Koch · May 1, 2014

It is important to make a distinction between toxicity and allergic response. A toxic substance will produce the same response from all people whereas an allergic response will be specific toward only certain people. Some people are sensitive to sulfites and sulfur dioxide in particular. They may suffer an reaction from drinking certain wines and eating at buffets. They may also have a problem with an acidified sulfite solution such as a fixer. This is not toxicity and may not answer the question in the the original post.

AgX · May 1, 2014

The original question is about illness and does not differ between toxic and allergenic character of chemicals.

However the field of substances that act allergenic to some person is wide. Other substances act allergenic to many people.

Futhermore there are reactions to chemicals that are even spontaneous, but not allergic.

Thus there is also the question what illness means. Something that goes on after contact, or also something that makes one feel ill, but leads to recovery short after end of contact.

Gerald C Koch · May 1, 2014

AgX said:
The original question is about illness and does not differ between toxic and allergenic character of chemicals.

However the field of substances that act allergenic to some person is wide. Other substances act allergenic to many people.

The subject can be rather complex. I was focusing on things that cause damage even after the exposure ceases. While an allergic reaction can be very serious it depends on repeated contact. A single exposure to a toxin can cause permanent damage.

Prof_Pixel · May 1, 2014

Gerald C Koch said:
I was looking at things as those that cause permanent damage even after the toxic exposure ceases.

... and SO2 gas can cause long term problems for some people.

jovo · May 1, 2014

Gerald C Koch said:
Early photographers seemed to have a shorter life span and this has been attributed to the use of various developing agents. Edward Weston developed a Parkinson-like neural condition in later life that has been connected to Amidol. His finger nails were turned black by this chemical as he did not use tongs or gloves.
.

I believe Weston used pyro which, arguably, has been linked to his Parkinsons, and not Amidol though I won't bet the farm on that (not that I have a farm to bet!). I'm between darkrooms at the moment, but when I am able to set up the next one I will continue to use the exhaust fan, tongs, and nitrile gloves. I use a dust mask when I mix powdered chemicals (D-76), and the various powdered ingredients in thiocarbamide toner. I had hoped to blame my grey hair on long years of darkroom practice, but nobody will buy that story for a moment, so I'm stuck with acknowledging the toll of years!

Gerald C Koch · May 1, 2014

Weston used Amidol for his prints and even had his own variation on the developer. The Amidol accounts for why his nails were always black. There is even a photography where you can see the names. But his illness could be from either developing agent. Amidol is mentioned because the contact with this developing agent was more extensive.

paul ron · May 1, 2014

Some people are sensative to the chemicals either directly on their skin as well as fumes n particulates.

Be mindful when mixing acids, pour the concentrate into water n not water into concentrate... This will cause fumes.

Also when reconstituting powders... Avoid breathing the fine dust in the air n pour very slowley.

As always better to be cautious n wear protective gear... Gloves n masks. if you do have reactions consult a doctor.

Poisson Du Jour · May 1, 2014

A photographer I worked with in the early 1990s developed skin cancer and a form of fungal nail disease; he was involved in wedding photography with both colour and B&W darkroom processing at home. Initially the cancer looked like small warts but rapidly evolved into weeping sores, later found to be squamous cell carcinomas and the lesser basal cell carcinomas. There was very little to exclude the handling of dark room chemicals over the long term. He was not one to be in the sun because he was far too busy for anything like relaxation. I spent a lot of time in the darkroom with him but was not touching any chemicals (I was more concerned with the fumes). I have skin cancer on hands but it is related to sun exposure from decades ago. Today photographers are much more astute and cautious but there is still a very high risk of inflammatory disease (lungs, skin) in susceptible individuals over the long term.

DREW WILEY · May 1, 2014

The problem with allergic sensitization is that it can sneak up on you slowly, and then one day, whammeee ... it suddenly hits you like a brick and you potentially become sensitive for life. I'm personally allergic to RA4 chemistry, so I have my drum processor mounted on a roller cart,
and do the actual processing outdoors during mild weather. Otherwise, I have a good fume hood and always wear nitrile gloves, no matter what
kind of darkroom chemical I'm handling.

Simon R Galley · May 2, 2014

Dear All,

All common sense in the replies... the most important is a well ventilated darkroom, and use gloves and tongs and have an eye wash handy, keep the MSDS's handy.

When I started in the darkroom....it was a big darkroom and well ventilated but we didn't use tongs or gloves, it was just not possible.....we used 24 x 20 dishes and could process up to 100 sheets 10x8 ( same image ) at one time bottom to top... bottom to top.

After about 6 months my nails started to turn brown and go soft.. but that was about it.

The B&W Chemistry was mostly liquid mixing, but I can remember mixing powder colour chemistry in a 25 gallon electric paddle mixer on wheels, hot water in and then poured in 3 big bags ( all AGFA ) no mask, nothing and dusty ( it made it difficult to light my cigarette ! ) I would not dream of doing that now... I'm still here though.....

Simon ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :

Jaf-Photo · May 2, 2014

Well, many household chemicals will make you ill, if you don't treat them properly.

Just take precautions to avoid getting the photo chems on your skin, in your lungs or in your mouth and you should be ok.

Do think about the environment and other life forms too. Collect the waste liquids in a bucket or a tank and deliver them to the local chems disposal. Don't pour it down the sink.

Other than that, hobby use of photo chems is unlikely to cause much harm.

ilnesses related to black and white photography

removed account4

BrianShaw

Bob Carnie

heterolysis

Vaughn

Gerald C Koch

yulia_s_rey

summicron1

pgomena

MattKing

Moderator

DREW WILEY

Prof_Pixel

ntenny

pdeeh

Gerald C Koch

AgX

Gerald C Koch

Prof_Pixel

jovo

Membership Council

Gerald C Koch

paul ron

Poisson Du Jour

DREW WILEY

Simon R Galley

Jaf-Photo

ilnesses related to black and white photography

Moderator

Membership Council

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency