Ilfords 2016 ULF campaign and 122 roll film

Hi,
I am trying to drum up interest for 122 size roll film so that Ilford may get sufficient orders for their 2016 Ultra large format campaign to make it happen.
I wrote to David Abberley of Ilford a few months ago and he quoted his technical people as saying:[TABLE="align: left"]

"The 122 format = 92mm slit width which fits within a 95.25mm wide wrapper / spool.
Theoretically we could finish this as a single slit (10m) if we can pattern the rest of the width to other formats.


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[TABLE="align: left"]

Would much rather finish to 92mm width pattern though; less complex / prone to issues."


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David recommended not using the sheet base which in last years ULF campaign was available as order number 1164756 FP4+ in 50ft length 9cm wide as it would be too difficult to roll. I have to agree!

He suggested I post on APUG to promote any interest there may be apart from myself!

I would be prepared to order 2 x 10metre rolls which is 2 x 393 inches and since in a 6 exp roll the film itself is 38 inches long this would yield 20 rolls if you have the backing paper.
I only have 9 original rolls and therefore backing paper to reuse.
My preference would be FP4+ but just as happy with HP5 or anything that is not aged 46 years or older! 6 rolls dated 1973 just went on eBay for $271.66 !!

I have no idea where to go from here as I believe the orders have to be made to accredited Ilford stockists only. Maybe if all those interested also wrote to Ilford they may make a run available to order for 2016

If there is a better place to post this please let me know, you never know if there is enough interest maybe New Ferrania will make some colour 122 as well

George

I can neither help with your interest (no 122 involvement) nor offer any suggestion of a better place to solicit support from others. However, in my opinion, the mere fact that David Abberley responded to your inquiry in a matter-of-fact fashion is very positive. I'd been concerned that HARMAN's new owners might not approve further annual special sizes ordering programs, especially since the phrase "break even" has been used to describe those activities in the past.

Thanks for what appears to be good news!

I would be curious about 130 sized roll film as well but finding spools would be impossible.


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Having set up for 118, a quantity of backing paper, spools etc and been stymied by that thick useless 9cm FP4 i ordered, I'd probably get at least one roll to slit down. In for a penny, in for a pound.

GregW said:

Having set up for 118, a quantity of backing paper, spools etc and been stymied by that thick useless 9cm FP4 i ordered, I'd probably get at least one roll to slit down. In for a penny, in for a pound.

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Thanks for the positive replies.
At least 130 can be slit down to 2 7/8 inch ( an odd size even for back then!) and 118 is the same 3 1/4 inch width as 122, as is 107,119,124 and 125!
I think 122 is a good compromise to get as many old roll film sizes as practible and could even be used on the very early 3 1/2 inch wide 101 and 106 sizes with only 1/8 inch loss of coverage top and bottom of frame but that would be another story for someone else

George

Hi George

Although I only use 35mm film, I would like to give you a hand.
It is always positive and nice to see Harman responding the way they did to you.

You asked if interested people would write to Harman.
May I suggest you put here an email address they can write to Harrman?
I'm not sure if there is a direct address to David Abberley or if it is a generic one.

I'll suggest you also post at the LFF forum if you haven't done so, the FADU and Filmwasters.
I can post on the last 2 for you if you don't mind me quoting your initial post.
I can also do the same for the Ilford and Harman groups on Flickr, even as I'm admin there.

My votes of success to you.

Ricardo thanks thats very encouraging.
I wrote to technical@harmantechnology.com which is their generic web site inquiries.
I will post on the LFF forum as you suggest.
Please feel free to use my post here to copy to the other sites also as it would undoubtably help especially on Flickr.

Thank you for your help in getting the word out.

Count on me to order some 122 film. Please let me us know when and how.
Spools and spool adapters are now being made with 3-D printers. I bought adaptors to shoot 120 and 70mm film in my 3-A Brownie.
Michael

Michael,
Hopefully Ilford will release details on their web site later this year, of the ULF campaign, which also includes old sizes, if enough people ask them for 122 size roll film they may make it available to order through their appointed stockists.
I have seen those 3D printed adapters, handy to have and better than nothing I suppose!

A request was sent.

Geopadi2 said:

Michael,
Hopefully Ilford will release details on their web site later this year, of the ULF campaign, which also includes old sizes, if enough people ask them for 122 size roll film they may make it available to order through their appointed stockists.
I have seen those 3D printed adapters, handy to have and better than nothing I suppose!

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Please keep us informed. I'd be interested in 122 also, but have some constraints: it must come spooled with backing paper. I have no spare spools or backing paper... and little time to do it myself. So if it is a complete roll of film I'm in; otherwise probably not.

I have a set of the 122-120 adapters also. Haven't tried it yet... mostly because of no time to figure out the winding regime that will be required.

George

I've posted on RFF, FADU, Filmwasters and Flickr.
Hope for success.

Well I promise you won't get 122 sized backing paper from Ilford. Lucky enough to get the bulk film.

Although there may be ways to create your own backing paper (which is easier than creating your own film)

Ricardo, thanks very much hopefully some more people will also write to ilford expressing their interest in buying 122 stock.

Regarding anyone not having old backing papers I read somewhere (here I think) that "Essex" paper can be used but I don't know anything about it, so I will stick with backing paper that I have.
Since Ilford sell 120 size backing paper during the annual ULF campaign maybe they would supply information on their supplier but that would assume it is made in larger widths?
Cheers

I think you mean Exeter paper, available from cartoon colour, There was a problem with their cart system adding the wrong amount for shipping (way too much), so I' just phone in your order.

Does anyone have the specification for the markings on 122 backing paper?

I know I could copy off of an old backing paper... If only I had one.

GregW said:

I think you mean Exeter paper, available from cartoon colour, There was a problem with their cart system adding the wrong amount for shipping (way too much), so I' just phone in your order.

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Thanks for the correction, its good to have alternates as a fall back position.

BrianShaw said:

Does anyone have the specification for the markings on 122 backing paper?

I know I could copy off of an old backing paper... If only I had one.

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The distance between numbers - centre of one number to centre of next number is 5 3/4 inches the stagger between top number and same bottom number is 1/2 inch. I have attached a scan so you can see what I mean.

118 and 122 are definitely different widths, Nikor Products made different spools for the two sizes. (They were the two widest spools.)

There's 90mm FP4+ listed this year, but that's a tad narrower than real 122 film. I don't know if it would load correctly on my 122 Nikor reel, which would be a base requirement for me to buy it. I ordered a roll of the 91.7mm HP5+ both of the years they offered it, didn't meet the minimum either year.

I have no idea what camera would use real 90mm film!

I wonder if a bunch of people could band together and commit to buying a full slitting of 91.7mm film. Something like 10 or 11 rolls would be a full cut of their 40 inch wide master roll. I've got a lot of Verichrome Pan 122 in good condition, but it's not very sharp film. My preference would be HP5+ for the speed, but I'd join an order for either FP4+ or HP5+.

It really needs someone to look at various older roll film formats and buy film off Ilford to slit to various sizes, I'd like to use 110 for instance which is a 5x4 roll film.

Ian

John Shriver said:

118 and 122 are definitely different widths, Nikor Products made different spools for the two sizes. (They were the two widest spools.)

There's 90mm FP4+ listed this year, but that's a tad narrower than real 122 film. I don't know if it would load correctly on my 122 Nikor reel, which would be a base requirement for me to buy it. I ordered a roll of the 91.7mm HP5+ both of the years they offered it, didn't meet the minimum either year.

I have no idea what camera would use real 90mm film!

I wonder if a bunch of people could band together and commit to buying a full slitting of 91.7mm film. Something like 10 or 11 rolls would be a full cut of their 40 inch wide master roll. I've got a lot of Verichrome Pan 122 in good condition, but it's not very sharp film. My preference would be HP5+ for the speed, but I'd join an order for either FP4+ or HP5+.

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John,
After some communication with Ilford they confirmed to me that the 9cm x 50ft roll is in sheet base at 175 micron thick which is too thick to spool, if it had been in their roll film base at 110 micron or even the 35mm size mini base at 125 micron, I would have ordered a roll, as I am not concerned that it is about 2mm less than original film width since with B&W processing I use 2 1/2 inch tubes as deep tanks for the 122 size film.
I measured two old 122 films at 120 micron average thickness (one developed and one not) so with a probable modern film emulsion of approx 6 micron onto the 110 base it would be close enough at 116 micron to original for similar spooling.
I am making my own reel by hacking 2 paterson reels together so I can process some Kodak SO-200 color negative film that I am slitting down from the 5 inch rolls. I am trying to find the ASA rating for it! Tank development of colour is a lot easier!
I could easily make another reel for 9cm width if that is easier for Iflord to produce as it seems to be the closest on offer at present. The 8 and 10 inch rolls in mini base are a tad expensive to slit down myself!!
Ilford could not tell me what the 9cm x 50ft sheet base roll is used for, only that the customer orders enough to make it worth their while.
It would indeed be great if enough people ordered sufficient numbers of 9cm in roll film 110micron base to make a viable order, maybe next year! Any volunteer organisers?
I too would prefer HP5+ but hey I would also be over the moon with FP4+ ;p)

Are you guys crazy? As long as Ilford would be willing to bring back a paper-backed roll film, why has everyone already forgotten about good ol' 220 film of not-so-long-ago??

There is certainly no dearth of 220 backs (or cameras which use that size) out there on the used market . . . at dirt cheap prices! Think of doubling your time between changing shots on a GX617, for example.

Just a thought .

:

122 film? Had never heard of the format until reading this thread.

I would buy a roll or two if 122 film was available on a roll base.

Good luck with this, a few people have been trying to get 122 for a while now.

I was successful in getting enough interest in 70mm in both unperforated and double perforated a few years back that it got run, and the peroration apparatus got machined. The world order was... I believe 4 rolls shy, so I bought 4 extra rolls.

So find out the exact number of requests and just make up the difference if you really want it to happen.

Good luck!