Ilford vs Kentmere VC paper Grade 5

PVia

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Hi all...

The fact sheets on these VC papers (Ilford Multigrade IV FB and Kentmere Finegrain FB) list different filtration for Grade 5.

My question is, with the Ilford you can't reach the Grade 5 with a dichroic head (only goes to 170 instead of 199) but with the Kentmere you can (130), so do you get a true Grade 5 with the Kentmere?

Also, I'm finding the Kentmere quite a bit muddier than the Ilford. Anyone with the same thoughts?
 

BobNewYork

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Is the Kentmere muddier at the "Grade 5" filtration? If that's the case then Kentmere G5 is a lower contrast than Ilford. Grade numbers have always been all over the place. I print a Stouffer step wedge at a range of filtration values and work out my own contrast - in stops. Just easier with a new neg.

Bob
 

Stan160

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It's taken a bit of practice, but I can get crisp whites and good highlight detail without muddiness on Kentmere Fineprint FB. The paper seems less sensitive to hard contrast exposure, so more is needed to deepen the blacks and open the mid tones out, compared to some other papers.
 

Domin

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This "only" 170 is probably equal to both 199 and 130. There are at least four different filtration scales and its clearly seen in the leaflet inside ilford paper box or envelope. My enlarger goes to 130 and I do get grade 5.

More important I find the flitration/gradation table more of a guideline than rule. I would not expect different papers to behave the same. If I remember correctly agfa multricontrast was visibly contrastier than ilford MGIV.
 

Martin Aislabie

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PVia said:
Hi all...

Also, I'm finding the Kentmere quite a bit muddier than the Ilford. Anyone with the same thoughts?
Click to expand...

I don't find Kentmere muddy - although I have never tried it up at grade 5.
Its a much faster emulsion than Ilford
Have you checked your safelight is OK with Kentmere, just because its OK with Ilford doesn't make it OK with anyone else's
If the muddy look is in the deeper darker tones - is your developer OK - in the dark tones is where exhausted developer first shows its exhaustion.
The other possibility if the muddy look is in the shadows - what is your developer temperature like - cold developer can give muddy looks.
Hope this helps
Martin
 

AndreasT

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What I have noticed is that the Kentmere Finegrain VC paper is rather flat with the hard grades. Grade 5 is softer than grade 4. But still my favourite paper.
Andreas
 

langedp

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PVia said:
...Also, I'm finding the Kentmere quite a bit muddier than the Ilford. Anyone with the same thoughts?
Click to expand...

I don't find Kentmere FB muddy at all. It is a colder tone paper than Ilford and gives crisp whites when developed completely. How long are you developing and with what kind of agitation? If you're getting muddy prints and as a result hitting the contrast hard all the way to grade 5, chances are you're not developing it fully. If you're currently developing for 2 minutes with gentle tray rocking for agitation, try three minutes (with appropriate exposure reduction). Alternativey, try a more aggressive agitation of the print by constantly flipping it over in the developer. You may even want to try both.

With a proper contrast negative and developing the print to completion, I rarely go beyond grade 2 or 3.
 
OP
OP

PVia

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I was surprised to see this old thread revive a bit, and that is the beauty of APUG forums.

Well, now with one year of printing under my belt, I've learned a lot by spending time in the darkroom, asking questions and experimenting. My processing is now standardized to give me negatives that will print well and I feel like I know my materials, from film, chemicals to paper.

I'm looking forward to my 2nd year and continuing to grow. Thanks to everyone here at APUG who has answered my many questions...
 

Thomas Bertilsson

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So how do you like Kentmere Fineprint today? I had a foray with it a while back and learned a lot by taming it. To me it's a paper perfect for things like architecture or similar where stark contrast with really crisp whites and rich blacks can be needed. It's beautiful and it tones well, which is not necessarily always the case for cold to neutral tone papers.

- Thomas
 
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