Ilford Pan F: How to lower contrast?

blindphotographer · Feb 16, 2014

I would like to make Ilford Pan F my everyday film for Noblex 6x12 panoramas. But I would need to tame the high contrast I have always observed in the past. I am planning to expose at ASA 25 and my developer is Kodak D76 which is not toxic to our landscape gray-water system. I am guessing no agitation at all. Does dilution matter?

erikg · Feb 16, 2014

I'd recommend Rodinal 1:100 or pyrocat HD for this film, with gentle agitation.

nworth · Feb 16, 2014

Minus development; stand or semi-stand development. Experiment before committing any valuable negatives.

Dr Croubie · Feb 16, 2014

I'd suggest a few tests: sacrifice a film or two photographing the exact same scene (either use 135-size or a 645/6x6 camera to get more of the same on a roll), then cut it up into equal portions in the dark bag (it doesn't matter if you slice through a frame, as long as you've got enough of a frame to be able to tell the contrast), develop in different ways to see what you can get.

blindphotographer · Feb 16, 2014

I bought a Rodinal clone and nearly passed out (quite literally) after just opening the bottle. I had hoped to use it at 1:100 but it was not to be. Can I use D76 highly diluted for stand developing? If so, what dilution would be a starting point for about an hour of development time? I had already planned to expose a roll of 120 (six 6x12's) and slice them up for test processing.

Tony-S · Feb 16, 2014

Perceptol 1+2 at 72F or if it's still too high 510 Pyro.

Richard S. (rich815) · Feb 16, 2014

I've shot it on very bright beaches in the summer and to tame contrast would go at 25 and then pulled development time 20-30%. Worked very well.

Gerald C Koch · Feb 16, 2014

Reduce the EI to 32 and develop in D-23 1+1.

cjbecker · Feb 16, 2014

If your happy with your shadows, just simply reduce developing time. If you want more shadow detail lower your iso also (testing will need to be done for correct development time) also try reducing your agitation. (Will lower your highlights, and again will need to be tested for development time)

Thomas Bertilsson · Feb 16, 2014

Dilute your D76 1+3 and experiment with developing time until you get what you want contrast wise.
Final neg contrast YOU control, regardless of the film's intrinsic contrast.

Roger Cole · Feb 16, 2014

One word: Diafine.

It's pricey but lasts practically forever and works great with Pan F+. You can get the full 50 speed or a bit better - I typically shoot at EI 64.

I know you said D76 and what everyone else is telling you will work, but you will lose speed as you noticed.

Pioneer · Feb 17, 2014

Roger Cole said:
One word: Diafine.

It's pricey but lasts practically forever and works great with Pan F+. You can get the full 50 speed or a bit better - I typically shoot at EI 64.

I know you said D76 and what everyone else is telling you will work, but you will lose speed as you noticed.

Sorry to jump in here like this but I think I'll try this Roger. I tried this film a bit right after Efke 25 went away but was never happy with the results so I moved to other things. I have the Diafine and I still have several rolls of Pan F. If I can satisfactorily tame the contrast I would be a real happy camper.

Hmm, and D76 1+3 with slightly reduced time may work as well Tom. I tried 1+1 and stock D76 but was never real happy.

Gotta love this forum! Suddenly, out of the blue, I have two new mini-projects.

miha · Feb 17, 2014

ID11/D-76, 1+1. Camera meter set to EI 32 in summer at the Adriatic seaside gave me great negatives that printed easily.

Richard S. (rich815) · Feb 17, 2014

An old APUG thread that might help too: Controlling contrast in Pan F

(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

MDR · Feb 17, 2014

A Tiffen Ultracon Filter can lower the contrast a bit. Lowering the EI to 32 with development adjustment might help as well.

Adjustment of the developing time is the single best option to reduce the contrast. In a low contrast situation you might want the contrast increase the film can give you, in a contrasty scene a bit of developing time adjustment and the use of a filter that can lower the contrast is the way to go.

Regular Rod · Feb 17, 2014

blindphotographer said:
I would like to make Ilford Pan F my everyday film for Noblex 6x12 panoramas. But I would need to tame the high contrast I have always observed in the past. I am planning to expose at ASA 25 and my developer is Kodak D76 which is not toxic to our landscape gray-water system. I am guessing no agitation at all. Does dilution matter?

Is this contrast acceptable?

https://www.flickr.com/search/?w=23468852@N02&q=Pan F

If so the regime is semi-stand using either 510-PYRO or OBSIDIAN AQUA like this: http://freepdfhosting.com/3e906fe75d.pdf

RR

David Allen · Feb 17, 2014

I know the OP stated wanting to use D76. However, I personally would use a two-bath developer such as Barry Thornton's. As regular readers will know, this is my single developer for my standard Delta 400 film. Why then recommend it for Pan F? - well when I used to do landscape work, my film of choice was Pan F and two-bath developer made it an easy film to use (the loss of one stop was not an issue).

Thornton's developer is very easy to make (having only a few ingredients) and very cheap. If the OP wants the formula either Google it or send me a PM. Using it with Pan F (provided you expose correctly for the shadows) you will never again have any excessive contrast problems with Pan F.

Let us know what finally works for you.

Bests,

David.
www.dsallen.de

Roger Cole · Feb 17, 2014

Pioneer said:
Sorry to jump in here like this but I think I'll try this Roger. I tried this film a bit right after Efke 25 went away but was never happy with the results so I moved to other things. I have the Diafine and I still have several rolls of Pan F. If I can satisfactorily tame the contrast I would be a real happy camper.

Hmm, and D76 1+3 with slightly reduced time may work as well Tom. I tried 1+1 and stock D76 but was never real happy.

Gotta love this forum! Suddenly, out of the blue, I have two new mini-projects.

Let us know how it goes. I like the combination (the negatives at EI 64 are what I might call "delicate" but print nicely. They certainly aren't contrasty - I usually print them with a grade 3 filter - but you might prefer a little more density. Still you won't have to shoot at 25 or even 32.

David Allen said:
I know the OP stated wanting to use D76. However, I personally would use a two-bath developer such as Barry Thornton's. As regular readers will know, this is my single developer for my standard Delta 400 film. Why then recommend it for Pan F? - well when I used to do landscape work, my film of choice was Pan F and two-bath developer made it an easy film to use (the loss of one stop was not an issue).

Thornton's developer is very easy to make (having only a few ingredients) and very cheap. If the OP wants the formula either Google it or send me a PM. Using it with Pan F (provided you expose correctly for the shadows) you will never again have any excessive contrast problems with Pan F.

Let us know what finally works for you.

Bests,

David.
www.dsallen.de

I agree that two bath works well for Pan F+.

I originally tried Diafine just to try get as much usable speed from it as possible without building excess contrast, but I found it a good combination.

kreeger · Feb 17, 2014

In general, increased exposure with reduced development will lower the contrast of any film. But each film has it's own fingerprint of contrast and you must do testing to get the desired results.

My test bed is my 500C/M camera with 120 makro planar, Soligor 1 degree Zone VI modified meter, and my MacBeth TD504 densitometer. That testing shows that I should rate ISO 25 PANF normally to get .10 above base+fog for Zone I use Clayton F76 1:9, 4.5 mins at 68F and I don't really see the contrast as an issue, just very high resolution of course. Given the rule of thumb that is 1/30 at F11/F16 in bright sunlight.

I find that Fuji Acros, rated at ISO64 gives me all the resolution I want in a 120 film these days with the increased in speed for the size prints I make. I moved away from D-76 years a go and prefer the premade 1 shot developers for consistency sake like HC-110, Rodinal and F76+.

That Noblex is quite a camera and given the negative size you have with that beast I would think you could use any modern film who's contrast characteristics meet your vision.

Roger Cole · Feb 17, 2014

There is no such thing as "ISO25 PanF" at least on today's market, which is Pan F+ (I don't know what the speed was before it was "plus.") It is ISO 50. You may need to rate it at an EI (Exposure Index) of 25 for your personal system and tastes and needs, and that's copmpletely legitimate. But it's confusing to call it ISO, and it's confusing to call that "rating it normally" - "normal" ordinarily means "box speed" and that is 50 for Pan F+.

Thomas Bertilsson · Feb 17, 2014

The cheapest solution for the Original Poster is probably to get some Sodium Metaborate and use Thornton's no brainer 2-bath method.
Here is my method using Thornton's advice:

1. Low to normal contrast - D76 1+1 - normal developing time, unless it was a foggy day in which case I add some time at developing and might shoot my film at a higher EI.
2. In very high contrast situations I use D76 1+1 for about 70% of the normal developing time, and then I use a bath of two heaped teaspoons of sodium metaborate to one liter of water for 3 minutes. This gives you 90% of the benefit of 2-bath developers such as Diafine, but you can continue with your normal developer.

Ilford Pan-F+ is no different when you try to achieve the type of tonality you want. Yes, it has a curve that is different from other films, but by simply cutting developing time where appropriate, you end up with a negative of similar final contrast to a low contrast film that's developed longer.
I don't know what all the fuss with Pan-F+ is about. I ran some test rolls last summer, because I was curious, and I had normal contrast scenes dialed in with a standard developer by the second roll, and it was no more difficult than Tri-X or HP5+.

cliveh · Feb 17, 2014

May I suggest Pan F (rated at 50 ISO for exposure) develop in D76 at 1:1 at 20°C for 14 minutes.

Anon Ymous · Feb 17, 2014

cliveh said:
May I suggest Pan F (rated at 50 ISO for exposure) develop in D76 at 1:1 at 20°C for 14 minutes.

Are you sure? Perhaps you meant to say D76 1+3. Ilford suggests 8,5 minutes at 20°C in D76 1+1 and 15 minutes in D76 1+3. 14 minutes in D76 1+1 would give excessive contrast, wouldn't it?

cliveh · Feb 17, 2014

Anon Ymous said:
Are you sure? Perhaps you meant to say D76 1+3. Ilford suggests 8,5 minutes at 20°C in D76 1+1 and 15 minutes in D76 1+3. 14 minutes in D76 1+1 would give excessive contrast, wouldn't it?

I don't care what Ilford suggests and they don't make D76. This works for me and I know a good developed negative when I see it.

Anon Ymous · Feb 17, 2014

cliveh said:
I don't care what Ilford suggests and they don't make D76. This works for me and I know a good developed negative when I see it.

Fair enough, but the OP wanted lower contrast. BTW, Ilford make ID11, which is practically equivalent to D76. They also publish their own development times for both developers, which are the same.

Ilford Pan F: How to lower contrast?

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