Ilford MGIV FB in Selinium toner

thefizz · May 18, 2006

I understand that Ilford Multigrade IV Fibre paper does not shift in colour very much when toned in Selinium. Would the use of a warm tone developer when printing with this paper result in more colour change when toning or does developer type matter as it is the same paper?

Peter

Edit: Sorry posted in colour forum in error, maybe someone can move it for me to the B&W section.

unregistered · May 18, 2006

Depends on the time and dilution. However, it will never tone as much as a warm tone paper will. Developer will help a little, but not much. Also using 1:3 dilution again will help a little.

theyankeesnapper · May 18, 2006

thefizz said:
I understand that Ilford Multigrade IV Fibre paper does not shift in colour very much when toned in Selenium. Would the use of a warm tone developer when printing with this paper result in more colour change when toning or does developer type matter as it is the same paper?

Peter

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You would be better off with Kodak Brown Toner or Agfa's Varidon toner rather than Selenium for Ilford VC Fb..

Regards.

Bob McCarthy

bobbysandstrom · May 18, 2006

Peter: I just toned some prints I did using MGIV and Ilford Multigrade developer. I used selenium 1:4 for 4, 5, and 6 minutes. After 4 minutes I found the print to take on too much of a purple tone. At the same time, the dmax didn't increase very much if at all from a subjective standpoint. (No measuring) So, I think unless ilford comes up with a way to change that with their new Selenium, I will not be using mgIV. I hate to whine but with PolymaxFA FB I had a pretty neutral look that selenium toned perfectly to my tastes. I am still looking to get really excited about a paper/dev combo. So far, it's Forte Multigrade and Neutol WA. Being the Neutol is hard to get here in the U.S., I ordered some Ansco 130. In fact I just finished mixing it and am looking forward to trying it with the Forte. I should be receiving my Nuance Expo in the mail today as well. I'll post my findings.

thefizz · May 19, 2006

Thank you all for your input. I will be doing a few tests some myself.

Peter

bobbysandstrom · May 19, 2006

I tried the Formulary 130 with the forte polygrade and am VERY pleased. Beautiful! I will selenium tone the prints today to see what happens next. I'm pleased with the dimensionality and dmax as they stand right now so no matter what, I got a winner!

jneuhauser · May 20, 2006

Split toning with selenium

I have gotten split tones with Ilford MGIV FB --the shadows turn a pinkish warm tone and the highlights stay pretty much the same. Works well right out of the fixer but you have to be careful not to get staining. Has anyone else tried this?

Janet

Dan Henderson · Jul 5, 2006

jneuhauser said:
I have gotten split tones with Ilford MGIV FB --the shadows turn a pinkish warm tone and the highlights stay pretty much the same. Works well right out of the fixer but you have to be careful not to get staining. Has anyone else tried this?

Janet

Hi Janet. Sorry for the PM, but I just noticed this post from you back in May that is related to an issue I am dealing with at the moment: getting the color shift I am looking for with selenium toner. Can you tell me what dilution of toner you are using, and the time?

Thanks,
Dan Henderson

blansky · Jul 5, 2006

Why not use warm tone paper and warm tone developer? Then selenium tone.

MIchael

Phillip P. Dimor · Jul 5, 2006

I am a big fan of warm tone paper and ethol lpd 1:4 with selenium toning..
Particularly the Ilford WT RC paper.. Beautiful chocolate-brown. Just remember to develop in the print developer for 2 minutes. I always try to expose so that the image prints out in at least 2 minutes. *shrug*

If you are going for a cold blue/black tone, perhaps some benzotriazole added to your developer might help. I do selenium tone ilford mgiv, mostly for permanence though if you mix the selenium strong enough and let it sit there long enough.. It does tone a bit.

hywel · Jul 6, 2006

A subject close to my heart right now: I'm relatively new to the darkroom and just last weekend I finally got my first bottle of Kodak Selenium Toner. I also picked up a copy of PhotoTechniques with an article about using it. The suggestion there was to tone MGIV FB for 8 minutes at 1+10 in working strength HCA for maximum Dmax, so it seemed like a good place to start. Having read about how MGIV doesn't really tone I was expecting to be on the lookout for increased Dmax. After studying for a while I can probably convince myself that there is some Dmax increase but the real change is the colour; it's definitely turned bluer or perhaps the word is charchol. I love it.

As I had some, and I'd heard about how it tones so much more, I also tried some Warmtone FB. I'm not sure I really like Warmtone untoned, a bit too warm for me, but I like the change the selenium produces very much, although I can't see that it's any more of a change than that I can see in the MGIV.

But then the next day I took my comparison pictures into the office where half dozen souls were cadjoled into passing their judgement. Not one of them, without prompting, noticed a difference between the toned and untoned. On either paper!

Oh, everything developed in Ilford Multigrade Dev. And, as I can't get anything other than Ilford paper, and have less than a year's experience in the darkroom, I can't comment on how MGIV compares to other papers. But, as I said, I do like what I see, so do have a go and see for yourself.

blansky · Jul 6, 2006

hywel said:
A subject close to my heart right now: I'm relatively new to the darkroom and just last weekend I finally got my first bottle of Kodak Selenium Toner. I also picked up a copy of PhotoTechniques with an article about using it. The suggestion there was to tone MGIV FB for 8 minutes at 1+10 in working strength HCA for maximum Dmax, so it seemed like a good place to start. Having read about how MGIV doesn't really tone I was expecting to be on the lookout for increased Dmax. After studying for a while I can probably convince myself that there is some Dmax increase but the real change is the colour; it's definitely turned bluer or perhaps the word is charchol. I love it.

As I had some, and I'd heard about how it tones so much more, I also tried some Warmtone FB. I'm not sure I really like Warmtone untoned, a bit too warm for me, but I like the change the selenium produces very much, although I can't see that it's any more of a change than that I can see in the MGIV.

But then the next day I took my comparison pictures into the office where half dozen souls were cadjoled into passing their judgement. Not one of them, without prompting, noticed a difference between the toned and untoned. On either paper!

Oh, everything developed in Ilford Multigrade Dev. And, as I can't get anything other than Ilford paper, and have less than a year's experience in the darkroom, I can't comment on how MGIV compares to other papers. But, as I said, I do like what I see, so do have a go and see for yourself.

To get a real noticeable color change in warm tone paper, you should develop in warm tone developer, then selenium tone. The tone then is very noticeable. There is also a difference in the tone if you just develop warm tone in warm tone developer and don't tone, although far more subtle.

Michael

hywel · Jul 7, 2006

blansky said:
To get a real noticeable color change in warm tone paper, you should develop in warm tone developer, then selenium tone. The tone then is very noticeable. There is also a difference in the tone if you just develop warm tone in warm tone developer and don't tone, although far more subtle.

Michael

Not that I can get any warmtone developer here but should some appear...

What I like about Selenium toning the warmtone paper (developed in Multigrade) is that it makes it less warm (less brown). Should one develop in warmtone developer I presume that it would come out even warmer, if then toned in Selenium what colour change occurs?

Hywel

Ilford MGIV FB in Selinium toner

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