Ilford Galerie 3

IHi guys!
i've found a box of galerie 3 that i bought 4/5 years ago and I never open it!...
What developer you recommend to use with this paper?
What kind of paper is this?...is it a good paper?warm,neutral,could?
The texture of this paper is similar to the texture of the ilford multigrade MG?
thanks

i'm forgiven:does this paper works fine with eukobrom or with dokumol?
Regards

Lovely paper, texture depends on the surface that you have bought...all mine is glossy. The surfaces are in line with the Multigrade FB papers, semi matt and glossy. Really any good paper developer will work with Gallerie, I personally use Dektol or Ethol LPD, and the tone is considered neutral.
Bear in mind that this is a fixed grade fibre based paper and needs to be handled accordingly. The gd #3 will suit negs from normal to slightly low in contrast, depending of course on the enlarger you are using.
I am not familiar with Dokumol but Eukobrom will work fine, enjoy!

Thank you!very interesting your opinion!
the last question:is the grade 3 a real grade 3 or does it have more contrast than a grade 3 (like for example the bromide kentmere grade 2:it was incredible because it seems a grade 4!)...is the same for the Galerie?
are there diference with the multigrade mg?Thank you very much
Regards

Dear Peters8

Grade 3 is grade 3 :

Galerie is the highest quality photo paper we make, and my personal favourite. Baryta base, neutral to neutral / cool image colour. Its a completely different emulsion to MULTIGRADE FB and therefore you cannot really compare the two.

Simon ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :

Tonight i printed on Galerie G3 using PQ print developer. The paper is about a 1/2 grade less contrasty than EMAKS G3. I would classify Galerie a G3. I agree the paper is different than Multigrade IV. I think it may be sharper. The finish and tone are nicer. I can reduce contrast by overexposing and shortening development. You still get strong blacks and nice mid tones. I'm looking at the 3rd neg/print run through 30 oz of developer; overexposed and developed for 100s. Print size is whole plate on 9x11 inch paper. The tone is neutral; complex, rich in nuance some middle gray warmth, with great micro contrast and mid tone separation. The print is rich enough without toning.

Each paper has unique characteristics. The ADOX papers are nice but I prefer the softer white and gloss of Galerie base paper v ADOX.

I've used Galerie off and on but I'm matching new negatives to its contrast curve. In some ways it is easier to print on graded. You are forced to match negatives to the paper and therefore are close when you print. I'm aware of VC advantages but if the negative is good the print on graded paper comes easy. Your main print control is dodging and burning.

In the late 70s a survey of photographers said they wanted this type paper. Behind David Vestal's writing for Popular Photography the community of photographers partitioned manufacturers to produce their best. Galerie is the last of the great graded papers. It would be a shame if it was no longer manufactured.

Simon R Galley said:

Dear Peters8

Grade 3 is grade 3 :

Galerie is the highest quality photo paper we make, and my personal favourite. Baryta base, neutral to neutral / cool image colour. Its a completely different emulsion to MULTIGRADE FB and therefore you cannot really compare the two.

Simon ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :

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Very interesting post. I've run up a Kodak man on here, and now apparently an Ilford man. Neato. Just the guy I would have wanted to ask my all-important question. Prefaced by saying that for a number of years I've just used whatever paper came with another load of old photo equipment. So that means I am out of touch on what's available new these days. Does your company, Ilford, presently manufacture any paper exactly identical to the Ilfobrom F DW #2 paper from the 70's and 80's that was a divine gift to photgraphic printing? Is there the actual thing still made, or a re-name of the same thing? Thank you. I will await a reply, if you might be so kind.

Dear Henry,

ILFOBROM was a 'breakthrough' product for us as it had defined and accurate grede steps.

ILFOBROM had a lighter baryta ( Fibre ) base than is commmercially available today, and was discontinued in the 70's when RC bases became predominant, the amount of graded papers made and sold today is very, very small, we make ILFOSPEED ( RC ) KENTMERE ( RC ) and GALERIE ( FB ) in a limited number of grades and surfaces. We will always make a graded RC and a graded FB, but as I have said MULTIGRADE in all its forms dominate sales, but graded is IMPORTANT and GALERIE is I believe ( and yes I am biased ) the best photo paper in the world.

Simon ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :

Thank you Mr Galley. I used to think the variable contrast papers were pretty neat--you only had to buy one paper/ And I'm sure the manufacturers and dealers like not having to tie up a lot of money on keeping inventory. But I've turned cold as a fish on the VC papers. You never know where #2 REALLY is. I have 2 enlargers---the light color temp is certainly bound to be different. And when developing film, there's always a certain amount of the purple anti-halation backing that migh not have gotten washed off, film bases vary, line voltages vary. So #2 is an ever-elusive goose chase. On the graded papers, the grades are hard-and-fast, #2 is #2, period. So much for my thesis on graded papers. Thank you again for answering.

henry finley said:

You never know where #2 REALLY is. I have 2 enlargers---the light color temp is certainly bound to be different. And when developing film, there's always a certain amount of the purple anti-halation backing that migh not have gotten washed off, film bases vary, line voltages vary. So #2 is an ever-elusive goose chase. On the graded papers, the grades are hard-and-fast, #2 is #2, period.

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Removal of film dyes is mostly time in fix and/or use of a wash-aid. My work flow process produces clear film with modern T-grain emulsions. Variations are part of the B&W process. Fresh paper vs old paper makes a difference along with the enlarger light source. When you get your image chain dialed in and minimize the deltas you can produce consistant negatives which print easy. Not using variable contrast paper forces me to concentrate on dodging/burning or other minor print controls such as exposure/toning. I accept what the negative holds and don't force the print to be unnatural. That approach to printing is not for everyone and is limiting. But print decisions are made simple.

henry finley said:

Thank you Mr Galley. I used to think the variable contrast papers were pretty neat--you only had to buy one paper/ And I'm sure the manufacturers and dealers like not having to tie up a lot of money on keeping inventory. But I've turned cold as a fish on the VC papers. You never know where #2 REALLY is. I have 2 enlargers---the light color temp is certainly bound to be different. And when developing film, there's always a certain amount of the purple anti-halation backing that migh not have gotten washed off, film bases vary, line voltages vary. So #2 is an ever-elusive goose chase. On the graded papers, the grades are hard-and-fast, #2 is #2, period. So much for my thesis on graded papers. Thank you again for answering.

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Hi Henry,

There are various ways the results from fixed grade papers might vary. Firstly the developer may be a soft- or hard-working one - you might find half a grade difference between developers. A diffusion enlarger will give lower-contrast results than a condenser enlarger. Post-fixer treatment like ferri aka liquid sunshine can be used to add more contrast. Film base colour won't affect graded papers, and if you've got purple dyes left in your films, you aren't fixing or washing them properly.

Galerie is a very nice paper with good deep blacks and responds wonderfully in selenium toner - it turns a warm brown whereas Multigrade turns subtly blue-grey and is more difficult to split-tone than Galerie. Mind you, with a selenium/sulphide split-tone, Multigrade has a nice contrast between cool/warm, whereas Galerie splits warm/warm. Such a shame Ilford doesn't make Galerie with the dead matt surface any more - that's progress I suppose!

Cheers,
kevs

My first introduction to an Ilford product was back in maybe '74 I suppose. My favorite camera store, (as did any other in town) had put in a small stock of "Ilford". It was a lesser brand, but cheaper, so I bought some Ilfobrom F2. "WOW! Look at that surface" That was some great stuff. But what happened? Ilford started getting a name for itself (at least around this area of the country). Then Kodak and Ilford both started getting finey-artsy about it, and the whole thing started going to pot. If there was anything better than plain Ilfobrom that I was getting at a decent price, then I wasn't interested. On the Kodak side, Kodabromide was it, yellow as it was, compared. A new standard was set. Some things just can't get better. They don't need to be. Then things got pricey. I was never an artsy-kookie type. (No insults here intended or conveyed). I didn't care anything about that "fine art" social trend.
To this day I would be a happy camper with my Ilfobrom, Dektol, selenium, and such. I would stop with the selenium when the pea-grean just went away, and not have to make a big Ansel A sideshow out of it. Ilford Galerie. Hmm. I suppose I might try some, reluctantly. Now where's the smiley thing to put an air of good-humor on this? Thanks, friend. Will do.