Ilford FP4 Plus Latitude

[Jimi and Jim and Janis]

Hey guys. I'm getting back in photography and now I have a lightmeter so I can get serious about my exposures. Does anyone know how many stops fp4+ can hold between low-lights and highlights. Or perhaps there is a website that lists this information for various film stocks for future reference. Thanks very much. Im not sure im useing the right terminology but I think its understandable what I'm asking

 

[AgX]

Terminolgy:

What you are looking for is the Exposure Range

Latitude is the Sum of over- and under-exposure one can achieve given a standardized Subject Brightness Range.


So you see, Latitude and Exposure Range are coupled to each other and thus people here will understand you.

 

[Jimi and Jim and Janis]

I see, thank you very much. And where would I find the exposure Range for said film?

 

[Brook Hill]

I have two seperate reports on film tests, one gives FP4 an exposure latitude of plus or minus 1 2/3 stops and the other plus or minus 2 stops, take your pick but it does suggest that FP4 is fairly forgiving film.

Tony

 

[2F/2F]

Do you want to know the exposure latitude? This means how much you can mess up exposure with it and still get a printable shot. This is, to a large degree, a subjective thing, as the standard of judgment is print quality...a very subjective thing.

Do you want to know how large of a luminance range (subject brightness range) the film can capture? If so, that is determined by the shape of the film's curve and the film's maximum and minimum densities. This is the dynamic range of the film, and seems to me to be what you are asking for.

...and, most importantly, the above is far different than what the printing paper can actually print. Film can capture much, much more than printing paper can actually print in a straight print expposure. Thus, we have a negative with a bunch of information on it, and when we print, we decide which of this information to use, by way of various methods of manipulation, such as burning and contrast filtration. (This is why so many people are so on about scanning. It takes a good printer to dig everything out of a negative and get in onto the print, but it is not so technically demanding of the printer with a scan and Photoshop.)

 

[Jimi and Jim and Janis]

I thought my question would yield a straight-forward answer like the one Brook Hill provided, but it seems its a little bit more complicated then that. I'll do some reading up on the subject. Thanks to all

 

[edtbjon]

Eh, no. It's not really as simple as that. If you're getting into b/w photography trying to find the acceptable luminance range (latitude), you are locking yourself up to a firm set development time etc. The great thing about b/w film is the versatility in that you can adjust your development to get good negatives from various situations.
That may become a bit difficult if you are shooting 36 picture 35mm film rolls, unless you shoot the whole roll at the same scene.
I do personally shoot with either a Hasselblad, where I use 3 film backs, so that I can choose the best suited developement for any given scene. Or, I sometimes shoot Large Format with a Sinar F, where I can choose how to develop each sheet of film individually. I do shoot 35mm too, but for that I buy 100' rolls which I load into my own film cassettes. I then load shorter lengths of film so that each film is about 12 usable frames long. I try to spend that piece of film on one scene, which I assess for luminance range and then adjust my development accordingly.
While I'm aware of the zone system, I find it a bit tedious to work with in the field, which is why I use a very simplified version having 3 different development times for a film and that's it. I simply look at the "sharpness" of the shadows to determine which dev time to use. Sharp shadows means high contrast which have to be compensated with a shorter dev time. etc and so forth...

//Björn

 

[Mick Fagan]

Jimi, Jim and/or Janis, I think what you are after is what should you be looking for in printable form on paper.

Ilford FP4+ will reasonably easily, hold printable detail over about 7 stops.

Paper (Ilford Multigrade IV RC Pearl surface) will reasonably easily, hold about 3 stops.

That is, if you do a straight print from a negative, then your best outcome is about 3 stops anywhere amongst the 7 stops on your film.

However with dodging, burning and what have you, you can virtually print that entire 7 stops that are on your film.

Your call.

This is a very simple answer, you have to remember that both the film and paper will actually hold a greater range of stops.

Ideally the best prints will come from a negative with around 3 stops from highlight to shadow, maybe 3½ to 4 stops.

In a commercial world with B&W product photography using FP4+ and the then new T-Max 100 we shot virtually all products within a 3½ stop range for magazine reproduction.

Prints from these negatives were virtually straight prints for use on either advertising pitches or they went straight to a reprographic camera for half tone negatives for magazine reproduction.

My best negatives usually come from a low contrast day and doing portraiture, think a cloudy day situation. Usually very little manipulation is required to print these negatives.

Hope this is of some help.

Mick.

 

[Athiril]

FP4+ @ EI50, developed as per normal - Rodinal 1+100, 20c, 20min (not a pull).

The scene had a fairly wide dynamic range.

FP4+ is a very versatile film, and produces some of the most beautiful tonal quality I've seen imho

I'd recommend shooting a lot more of it.

 

[monodave]

Here is the link to the official Ilford fact sheet on FP4 on the Ilford web site.
Hope it helps, Dave

 

[Steve Smith]

I think we should stop worrying about it too much based on this line in the Ilford data sheet:

FP4+ is robust and will give usable results even if it is over-exposed by as much as six stops or under exposed by two stops.

Obviously we should still try to make the best light reading and exposure calculation we can rather than resort to sloppy technique and guesswork but perhaps worrying about a third of a stop is fairly pointless.


Steve.

 

[Anscojohn]

Hey guys. I'm getting back in photography and now I have a lightmeter so I can get serious about my exposures. Does anyone know how many stops fp4+ can hold between low-lights and highlights. Or perhaps there is a website that lists this information for various film stocks for future reference. Thanks very much. Im not sure im useing the right terminology but I think its understandable what I'm asking

*********
Welcome back. What kind of meter?

 

[Mick Fagan]

Steve, you are correct in that we often agonise too much over 1/3 of stop, but I think that is a good thing. At least stopping and thinking about what is a reasonably correct exposure for your system will teach you a lot about film exposure more quickly than putting the camera to automatic (if it has this feature) and just banging away.

For general shooting whilst walking around a street, I swing between a +- of 1 stop overall away from what I believe is correct exposure for my system. With this I have very good printable negatives.

However when you get FP4+ on the money with exposure, development and your subject has a range of roughly 3-4 stops from shadow to highlight, you can just look at the negative on the lightbox and know that it is going to sing when printed.

Mick.

 

[Steve Smith]

Steve, you are correct in that we often agonise too much over 1/3 of stop, but I think that is a good thing. At least stopping and thinking about what is a reasonably correct exposure for your system will teach you a lot about film exposure more quickly than putting the camera to automatic (if it has this feature) and just banging away.

I do agree with you that it is good to do it properly and take proper readings. I just think it's pointless agonising over it especially after you have exposed the film.

Sometimes when I am out taking photographs I have doubts about my meter readings after I have finished my film however, I have never come back with negatives which were un-printable.

So yes.... do it properly in the first place but don't worry too much if you discover that you have messed it up a bit as it's probably not as bad as you think it may be.

However when you get FP4+ on the money with exposure, development and your subject has a range of roughly 3-4 stops from shadow to highlight, you can just look at the negative on the lightbox and know that it is going to sing when printed.

This is also very true. It's a fairly rare event with me but sometimes I can look at a negative and I know it's going to print well and look good without too much manipulation.


Steve.

 

[L Gebhardt]

Jimi, Jim and/or Janis, I think what you are after is what should you be looking for in printable form on paper.

Ilford FP4+ will reasonably easily, hold printable detail over about 7 stops.

Paper (Ilford Multigrade IV RC Pearl surface) will reasonably easily, hold about 3 stops.

That is, if you do a straight print from a negative, then your best outcome is about 3 stops anywhere amongst the 7 stops on your film.

However with dodging, burning and what have you, you can virtually print that entire 7 stops that are on your film.

Are you sure on this? The way I see it the paper can only hold 3.5 stops (for a normal grade 2), but this is coming from the negative which has compressed the subject brightness range of 7 down to 3.5. So a scene with 7 stops will fit perfectly on the paper if it is developed to fit within a negative density range of 1.05 (3.5 stops). Grade 00 paper will print a negative with a density range of 1.65 (5.5 stops) and Grade 5 will print a negative with a range of only .45 (1.5 stops).

In my experience you can get a straight line curve out of FP4+ that yields 7+ stops of Negative Density, or more than enough to not be printable on a grade 00 paper. What this really gives you is lots of room to overexpose the negative and still make a print.

But I think what's not clear in your statement is that negative density range is about 1/2 of the subject brightness range with normal development.

No negative film has much room for underexposure, but most have several stops of room to overexpose, and FP4+ is no exception.

 

[Mick Fagan]

L Gebhardt, yes I’m quite sure about what I said. I’m also quite sure about what you said as well, although this late at night I read it a few times to ensure I comprehended what you were saying.

I expressed myself in very simple terms because at this stage of the thread I thought a very simple to understand answer, similar to the ones darkroom students receive from me that I know are easily grasped, seemed best for the person who asked the original question.

Mick.

 

[Tom Stanworth]

Frankly I would not worry about it too much. As you get better at printing you will tweak your development and exposure as well bringing things nicely into line. In the meantime and where you make mistakes, learning to print better, flashing etc, will enable you to deal with almost any neg and still get something decent.