Ideas about what may have happened with this negative??

stradibarrius · May 20, 2013

This 6x7 negative has the swirls you see. I don't think the are tiny ghosts or sprites.
Any Ideas of what I may have done wrong here? This happened to 2-3 of the negative off the roll. They were all in sequence.

131802 · May 20, 2013

Reel loading error; I get those swirls when there's film-on-film contact in the reel.

stradibarrius said:
This 6x7 negative has the swirls you see. I don't think the are tiny ghosts or sprites.
Any Ideas of what I may have done wrong here? This happened to 2-3 of the negative off the roll. They were all in sequence.

Thomas Bertilsson · May 20, 2013

The film got bent and creased in those areas, usually due to film loading.

It happened to me a few times when I used plastic reels and there was high humidity. The film emulsion stuck to the reels and bent/creased as I attempted to twist the reel and advance the film.

I solved that problem by using stainless steel Hewes reels, but there are other solutions, such as insuring your reels are dry enough to avoid this from happening, or keep the humidity sufficiently low for the same reason. There may be other solutions that I'm not aware of.

AgX · May 20, 2013

Yes, fogging induced by mechanical stress.

Of course, I can't exclude some spector in your darkroom...

ROL · May 20, 2013

It looks to be typical "half moon" emulsion damage. I've written about this (obliquely), with example here. I hope that you are at least using stainless steel reels, where you have a chance at avoiding further occurrences, rather than those loathsome, problematic, plastic wind-up reels.

MattKing · May 20, 2013

ROL said:
I hope that you are at least using stainless steel reels, where you have a chance at avoiding further occurrences, rather than those loathsome, problematic, plastic wind-up reels.

For 120, I only get those now when I try to use my stainless steel reels - the AP plastic reels behave much better.

For 35mm, I prefer (slightly) my stainless steel reels.

When it comes to loathsome and problematic, YMMV.

jumbosilverette · May 20, 2013

Yes, difficulty loading 120 on a stainless reel or wet plastic reel will give you those crescent shapes.

Noble · May 20, 2013

Examine the film very closely. Is it "dented"? I got little semicircle marks like that when loading Acros on metal reels. You kind of have to gently longitudinally fold negatives to get them onto a metal reel and at the same time curve them in the transverse dimension. Well all that folding and curving can result in little "dents" prior to development. I switched back to plastic patterson reels and the problem disappeared. It seems like Acros is sensitive to rough handling. I'm actually surprised at the difference in bases between brands. I think Rollei Pan 25 is thinner and I didn't have the problem and TMAX 100 is thicker if my memory is correct and I also didn't have that problem. Of course I am paranoid now and when I use any reel I am much more careful. But no more steel reels and Acros for me. That is not a good combination in my hands.

Steel or plastic use what works for you. I found different emulsions tended to "dent" more than others. This is something I have never seen mentioned by anyone else. But it might be the reason person X uses steel reels and never has a problem. They may just use an emulsion that isn't prone to that type of thing.

Alan W · May 20, 2013

Looks to me like bends on the film.This only happens on my plastic Patterson reels to the last frame as it can be bent during agitation(sometimes I get a little excited!)

kevs · May 20, 2013

I concur with the others, those are dents from rough handling and/or careless loading of the film onto the spiral. When you load the film, only touch it very gently with your fingertips to guide it into the spiral. If the film sticks at any point whilst loading, there's probably some moisture in the track. The spiral must be dry.

Cheers,
kevs

whlogan · May 20, 2013

Those are mwhat we call a**holes.... they are caused when the film gets a fold in it and sort of "pops" This actually causes a small exposure on the film due to a small slip of speed across the surface of the film.I get them some. One needs to see this by making a fold in a piece of paper and trying to pull the fold out. Sometimes you can see one of these at he end of the fold just before it comes out. Kind of hard to explain....try this and see if will work for for you.
Logan

Sirius Glass · May 20, 2013

ROL said:
It looks to be typical "half moon" emulsion damage. I've written about this (obliquely), with example here. I hope that you are at least using stainless steel reels, where you have a chance at avoiding further occurrences, rather than those loathsome, problematic, plastic wind-up reels.

I have had it with Hewes reels when I have had problems loading the 120 film.

brucemuir · May 20, 2013

Is that a 5 string Violin???

I agree, you kinked the film when loading for development.

stradibarrius · May 20, 2013

Th everybody, I am pretty sure It happened while loading the film on the dev reel. I dropped the reel while loading the film on.

pgomena · May 20, 2013

You also can get these by putting a roll of 120 film in your pocket with your keys for a couple of hours.

ROL · May 20, 2013

ROL said:
I hope that you are at least using stainless steel reels, where you have a chance at avoiding further occurrences...

Pay attention to the wording folks. If you can't load reels safely without problematic mechanical intervention, then you need to look to basic technique and practice. At least then you have a choice of tools.

Thomas Bertilsson · May 21, 2013

ROL said:
Pay attention to the wording folks. If you can't load reels safely without problematic mechanical intervention, then you need to look to basic technique and practice. At least then you have a choice of tools.

True.

Except if you live in an area that gets very humid in the summer (like Minnesota), it can be really tough to get plastic dev reels dry enough for safe loading. Especially if using a changing bag where hands get sweaty, etc. Wanted to bring that angle of it up too, since it pertains to the subject matter.

Sirius Glass · May 21, 2013

ROL said:
Pay attention to the wording folks. If you can't load reels safely without problematic mechanical intervention, then you need to look to basic technique and practice. At least then you have a choice of tools.

I am able to replace reels. I am not able to replace hands.

Ideas about what may have happened with this negative??

stradibarrius

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Ideas about what may have happened with this negative??

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