ID-11 gone yellow

antielectrons · Feb 7, 2006

Hi,

Stock mixed from powder less than a month ago. Just opened the bottle to use but it has gone yellow and smells bad. Has it oxidized? Is it usable still?

Antonio

Marco Gilardetti · Feb 7, 2006

It usually lasts more than that. However yes, developer tends to get yellow when old.

In some cases it is still usable (I would say it is in this case, if you really mixed it one month ago), but seen the cheap price of a fresh solution, I would not risk a negative nor I would loose time to make tests.

Bob F. · Feb 7, 2006

I can't imagine why it has gone off so quickly, mine lasts for well over a year in a full fizzy drink bottle... Even partially full, it should last a few months.

Possibly the bottle was not totally clean to begin with, or it lets air in?

But I concur with Marco: it's not worth risking your negatives; make up some more.

Cheers, Bob.

antielectrons · Feb 7, 2006

Thanks. The bottle is one of the black bellows type. Seemed to be air tight but obviously not. Mind you the bottle is completely compressed and there is air above the solution as I only have about 200ml left.

Marco Gilardetti · Feb 7, 2006

antielectrons said:
there is air above the solution as I only have about 200ml left.

The sink is waiting for it

Digitaltruth · Feb 7, 2006

It should not have gone off so quickly, but if it is yellow I wouldn't risk using it. My guess would be that there was some residual dried chemical in the bottle. This often happens with accordian-style bottles as they are hard to clean. Alternatively, if it was accidentally stored near heat or in sunlight that could be the cause of deterioration.

Jack Lusted · Feb 7, 2006

Digitaltruth This often happens with accordian-style bottles as they are hard to clean. Alternatively said:
In the past I have wasted a lot of money and chemicals by using this sort of bottle. The theory sounds good, but, in my experience, the chemicals go off just as quickly as they would in conventional bottles.

Beer bottles are best.

antielectrons · Feb 7, 2006

Hi, yes, it was stored in a cold room out of direct sunlight (in a cupboard). The container had just been used once before from new to store the previous batch of ID-11. Perhaps it wasn't clean enough when I refilled it.

So the brown bottles are best are they?

Gerald Koch · Feb 7, 2006

The accordion style bottles are the very worst containers one can use for developer storage since they are made of polyethylene and are permeable to oxygen. The best containers are glass or second best PET plastic drink bottles.

srs5694 · Feb 7, 2006

Gerald Koch said:
The accordion style bottles are the very worst containers one can use for developer storage since they are made of polyethylene and are permeable to oxygen. The best containers are glass or second best PET plastic drink bottles.

I recommend two sites to check on this score:

The first site describes types of plastic bottles and their suitability for storing various darkroom chemicals. HDPE plastic is noted there as a poor choice for storing developers, although it should be fine for acids (like stop bath). Unfortunately, most or all of the "accordion" bottles are made of HDPE. The second site presents tests of developer longevity. Although the focus wasn't on storage bottles, they did note that HDPE accordion bottles actually degraded the storage life of some developers, thus providing experimental confirmation of Gerald's and the first site's claims.

Bottom line: Throw away the developer, store the replacement developer you mix in glass or PET plastic, and either recycle the accordion bottles or use them for storing stop bath.

Gerald Koch · Feb 7, 2006

As a trained chemist I would like to make the point that the quoted study at http://www.udmercy.edu/crna/agm/phenvitc.htm is full of holes and errors and is best ignored. The author starts out by making the error of attributing the instability of Phenidone to oxidation when hydrolysis is usually the cause especially in solutions of high pH. The article goes rapidly downhill from there. Addtionally, I would like to point out that solid Phenidone and its derivatives are stable under ordinary conditions. Unfortunately, the web is full of bad science.

ID-11 gone yellow

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