I need help with C41 processing at home!!

tnabbott · Feb 12, 2011

I have been processing C41 film at home using the Photographer's Formulary Kodak Flexicolor kit. Occasionally, my negatives show vertical pink bands on an edge of the film when scanned. In the example below the condition can be seen on the left vertical edge of the image and is most easily seen against the blue sky.

Does anyone know what is causing this to occur? Thanks for your help!

The Hospital by Thomas N. Abbott, on Flickr

hpulley · Feb 12, 2011

What sort of tank and reel are you using? How much solution? What agitation time and method?

tnabbott · Feb 12, 2011

hpulley said:
What sort of tank and reel are you using? How much solution? What agitation time and method?

Paterson tank and reels (the tank holds 2 120 reels). I use 1L of solution per the guide on the base of the tank. I agitate according to the guidelines set out for small tank processing on page 2 of Kodak publication CIS-211 (i.e., 30 sec initial; 2-5 second subsequent every 15 seconds).

markbarendt · Feb 12, 2011

Maybe 1-liter isn't quite enough?

Try filling the tank from the faucet with empty reels and no cap until the reels are well covered. Pour that water into a graduated container and see how much you get.

tnabbott · Feb 12, 2011

markbarendt said:
Maybe 1-liter isn't quite enough?

Try filling the tank from the faucet with empty reels and no cap until the reels are well covered. Pour that water into a graduated container and see how much you get.

Thanks. Even before seeing this problem, I've tried that out of curiosity to see whether the amounts stamped on the base were accurate; they are, as 1L of fluid entirely covers two 120 reels.

hpulley · Feb 12, 2011

1L should be sufficient, I use that in my Paterson 3 (holds two 120) tank with a pair of 120 rolls.

Is there a scratch on the negative there or is it just in the color? Could be a scratch in the red layer? I don't know.

Did both rolls do this or just one?

nyoung · Feb 12, 2011

if the streaks are visible outside the picture area and align with the areas between the sprocket holes its probably weak/contaminated fix or short fixing time or some combination. Try extending the fix time.

tnabbott · Feb 12, 2011

Thanks all for the responses!

Harry: I cannot remember if it occurred on both rolls. I use the Paterson 3 as well and I am pretty sure I processed two 120 rolls when this occurred, but I noticed it with this one shot because of the blue sky.

Nyoung: I will try extending the fix time. If I may ask, what are the risks of running the bleach or fix a little longer (e.g., instead of 6:30, 6:45)?

Thanks!

carlosmccosta · Feb 12, 2011

No problem for extending the bleach and fix time.
Are you sure the problem is with the negatives and not with the scanner?
You can try to scan upside down and confirm.
I remember to read about a problematic scanner doing like this.
Regards.

markbarendt · Feb 12, 2011

tnabbott said:
Thanks all for the responses!

Harry: I cannot remember if it occurred on both rolls. I use the Paterson 3 as well and I am pretty sure I processed two 120 rolls when this occurred, but I noticed it with this one shot because of the blue sky.

Nyoung: I will try extending the fix time. If I may ask, what are the risks of running the bleach or fix a little longer (e.g., instead of 6:30, 6:45)?

Thanks!

Developer time is critical because it doesn't normally go to completion, more time gets you more development and vice-versa.

The rest of the steps do normally to go to completion in the specified time so extra time doesn't hurt.

gmikol · Feb 12, 2011

At the risk of going off-topic...this may be a scanner artifact, especially if the edge in question is at at cut edge of a film strip. The OP can PM me and we can discuss it off-line.

--Geg

Athiril · Feb 12, 2011

Reels can also slip upwards on the centre column too when doing inversions.

hpulley · Feb 12, 2011

Athiril said:
Reels can also slip upwards on the centre column too when doing inversions.

They can but two 120 reels fit perfectly in the Paterson 3 tank so unless the funnel wasn't on right I think this is unlikely.

In the Universal tank (holds 2 135 or one 120) it is easy for this to happen however, unless you have a spacer the 120 reel can ride up a fair bit so it is safer to use the Paterson 3 with an empty reel instead if you don't have the spacer.

fschifano · Feb 12, 2011

A rubber band wrapped tightly around the core above the top reel will prevent any slippage and does not interfere with the chemistry at all. So if you need a dry reel for another go around, there is no need to use empty reels as spacers.

tnabbott · Feb 12, 2011

Thanks All! I can rule out movement of the reels (I've had this problem before :-/ ) and the amount of fluid. It seems the a cause related to the scanner might be most likely, but I must admit that is not a satisfying answer to me because the problem does not always occur. I suppose I can send out the negative in question to Chrome for scanning to see whether the issue replicates (then it's my handling of chemicals) or not (then it's the scanner). What do you guys think?

2F/2F · Feb 12, 2011

Not to digress too much, but is this the kit you used: http://stores.photoformulary.com/-strse-965/Flexicolor-C-dsh-41-Developer/Detail.bok? Just curious, as I had not seen the new Website (or the $30/L price) yet.

If it is, does it come with everything needed, and good instructions? It is slightly confusing that they name the product "Flexicolor C-41 Developer," but also call it a kit.

rphenning · Feb 12, 2011

dude. its your scanner.

Ed Sukach · Feb 12, 2011

markbarendt said:
Developer time is critical because it doesn't normally go to completion, more time gets you more development and vice-versa.

Nowhere near as "critical" as some would believe. I've mistakenly neglected to stop the developer by as much as a minute and a half, with the greatest effect being a mild shift in overall color - not beyond usual variations.

The more I think of this, the more suspicious I become of the scanner. Try a different negative orientation and look for a change in the banding location.

markbarendt · Feb 12, 2011

Ed Sukach said:
Nowhere near as "critical" as some would believe. I've mistakenly neglected to stop the developer by as much as a minute and a half, with the greatest effect being a mild shift in overall color - not beyond usual variations.

I agree, completely.

Ed Sukach said:
The more I think of this, the more suspicious I become of the scanner. Try a different negative orientation and look for a change in the banding location.

This may be a topic for a thread on DPUG.

hpulley · Feb 13, 2011

Rubber band to hold the reel on the tank? Thanks, I'll try that.

Can you put the negative in an enlarger or use a magnifier to check for the line?

Mark Antony · Feb 13, 2011

Looks like a scanner artefact. I get them when the little glass part at the top of the holder on my V500 is dusty.
Flip the neg upside down (so the band should appear on the opposite side) if its still on the LHS its the scanner.
Mark Antony

hpulley · Feb 13, 2011

Clean and calibrate your scanner I guess.

tnabbott · Feb 13, 2011

rphenning said:
dude. its your scanner.

Thanks, that seems to be a consensus that has developed based on the characteristics of the image I posted. Any idea if there are setting I can change to avoid this result? I should never have sold my Nikon 9000!

tnabbott · Feb 13, 2011

2F/2F said:
Not to digress too much, but is this the kit you used: http://stores.photoformulary.com/-strse-965/Flexicolor-C-dsh-41-Developer/Detail.bok? Just curious, as I had not seen the new Website (or the $30/L price) yet.

If it is, does it come with everything needed, and good instructions? It is slightly confusing that they name the product "Flexicolor C-41 Developer," but also call it a kit.

Yes, that's the one. I'm not too suspicious of the kit because I've developed other rolls with it that do not exhibit the pink stripe. FWIW, it's not a bad kit, but I find that getting the SM chemistry from Liberty is a better deal per roll.

I need help with C41 processing at home!!

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