I got a set of Autochrome plates today!!

htmlguru4242 · Sep 25, 2006

My set of two 4"x5" Autochrome plates arrived in the mail today. I washed the emulsion off of one of them, to see the starch mask. The first thing that struck me was how easily the emulsion washed off of the plate; with some warm water and rubbing, it detached very easily.

So anyway, the screen plate is very interesting. It has a very easily visible random set of grains, and has a reddish-purple-gray look to it; it is NOT quite neutral. The plate almost looks like it was done on an inkjet printer; it is perfectly smooth, though vertical lines are visible on it.

The plate is translucent; it is quite far from transparent, so that answers one of my questions.

I'm going to try to coat it with some liquid emulsion; I know that this isn't going to give great results (no red), but we'll see.

toothschmidt · Sep 3, 2007

autochrome plates

Hi,

Did you find a couple of old, original plates? Or is there somewhere to buy new ones?

Dave

htmlguru4242 · Oct 3, 2007

They are [very] old and quite original!

Unfortunately, they're exposed :-(

DarkroomExperimente · Dec 16, 2007

wow this is fascinating...

I wonder what kind of results you could get using a mask made just using ektachrome...or printing a transparency out from your computer...might be easier than starch grains...

AgX · Dec 16, 2007

In those days systems with separate grid masks had been developed. However the integrated grid mask systems (Lumiere, Agfa and Polaroid) were more versatile.

DarkroomExperimente · Dec 16, 2007

thanks...I'm just trying to think of a way to experiment that's not tooo much of a pain for a basement tinkerer like me

Kino · Dec 16, 2007

Look up Jolly or Dufay Color; it used a RGB reseau (matrix) printed on clear base by a greasy-resist method.

You might be able to recreate the reseau with clear mylar and a very high resolution dot matrix printer, but that is pure speculation on my part...

In any event, here are some good resources; http://www.infography.com/content/112904364761.html

Also, the best reference I ever found on Dufay was the 1936 edition of "Colour Cinematography"

Be prepared to say "OUCH" when purchasing...

AgX · Dec 16, 2007

Yes DarkroomExperimente, I just threw in a historic remark.

But keep in mind that those grids are really miniature. Recently I held a separate grid screen in hand (about 6x9 cm, Finlay I guess). With the unaided eye just a very,very faint rose tint was to see. I had to look at the cutting edge to realize the tint was caused by some sort of varnish. Even with the aid of a loupe I took me a lot of strain to see a, regular, grid structure, only then realizing what I held in hand!
One figure I got on a different grid screen is 1,800 grid-points per mm²...

DarkroomExperimente · Dec 16, 2007

that's amazing

after making developers from plants from the garden, it somehow seems appropriate that I should try to work with potato-based color film...doesn't seem easy, but it's tempting

AgX · Dec 16, 2007

Don't forget the edible lens...

And when bying film we should no longer ask for speed but for taste.

Photo Engineer · Dec 16, 2007

The photo course given at George Eastman House includes making a resau on transparent support using an ink jet printer. This is placed in contact with a sheet of film and the film is exposed thorugh the resau. After development, if the resau is registered with the resulting positive, a color picture is obtained.

I've seen the results!

PE

DarkroomExperimente · Dec 16, 2007

Eureka!

I've been trying to think of an excuse to go back up to Rochester

how did the images look?

I must try this

DarkroomExperimente · Dec 16, 2007

I have a few sheets of 8x10 SO-132 direct positive film left...this might be a good use for them

Photo Engineer · Dec 16, 2007

DarkroomExperimente said:
Eureka!

I've been trying to think of an excuse to go back up to Rochester

how did the images look?

I must try this

The images were fair. They did not try to get a micro resau, but it did work.

PE

DarkroomExperimente · Dec 16, 2007

sounds like my kind of experiment....I'm a "proof of concept" kinda guy

Photo Engineer · Dec 16, 2007

There is no proof needed. I have seen many Dufay Color slides and I have a box of Autochrome Stereo pairs sitting here next to me as I type. And, I saw the low resolution results obtained at GEH.

PE

DarkroomExperimente · Dec 16, 2007

I don't mean "proof" in a boraxological way...

I mean in a "hey I made it work" kinda way

re-inventing the wheel is my role in life....my old boss once said "I think you're trying to acquire the set of skills such that 10,000 years ago you would have been revered as a god"

htmlguru4242 · Dec 16, 2007

Ah. Good to see that someone has resurrected this discussion.

There were, as I recall, suggestions here on using an ink jet printer or Ektachrome for a screen-plate mask. It started as a discussion between Donald Qualls and I (any idea where he dissappeared to?), and then others joined in. The topics were in "Alternative Processes" somewhere.

I tried printing a reseau and exposing it in front of a sheet of 4x5 film. It worked, but not well, as the lines were huge, and I didn't make too much of an effort to line things up.

I was thinking about lining up the autochrome plate (without emulsion) with a piece of film, but the dot's are so fine, it would be near impossible to re-register after development. It's not quite as fine as the other masks mentioned here; you can see grains if you look closely.

And, DarkroomExperimenter, I'm a big fan of re-inventing the wheel myself, so I see exactly what you mean.

DarkroomExperimente · Dec 16, 2007

I'm thinking even a coarse reseau like I'd be likely to make might look cool -- like an impressionist painting

maybe it can be done in a bastardized way....use a digitally generated reseau in the camera...then "re-register" digitally it after scanning the negative...perhaps if you have alignment marks that show up on the negative iit might not be too horrible

using the computer is cheating, but might still be fun

Photo Engineer · Dec 16, 2007

DarkroomExperimente said:
I don't mean "proof" in a boraxological way...

I mean in a "hey I made it work" kinda way

re-inventing the wheel is my role in life....my old boss once said "I think you're trying to acquire the set of skills such that 10,000 years ago you would have been revered as a god"

I know. I meant to put a smiley in my answer but forgot. I agree, no boraxological proofs needed.

I think that a fine resau could be made by using Pictorico and the smallest dot pattern possible and then by using registration a fine transparency could be made.

PE

DarkroomExperimente · Dec 16, 2007

OK, smile all you want, but I still want to be revered as a god

for a few years I had my brothers kids trained to call me "Most revered Uncle"

but...they eventually grew out of it

Photo Engineer · Dec 16, 2007

Saw through you, did they? Muahahaha.

PE

DarkroomExperimente · Dec 16, 2007

the older one is unimpressed, the younger one now says "you're so weird"

I have no idea why she says that....hey, gotta run...time to take my film out of the parsley-developer

Photo Engineer · Dec 16, 2007

Now, take the parsley and mix with butter and garlic and spread over Escargots. Add one jigger of burgundy wine. Bake in the oven until done. Eat with a crusty French bread. A sprig of dill, chopped, is optional.

PE

DarkroomExperimente · Dec 16, 2007

well...maybe I should've eaten the parsley

it ain't worth a damn as a developer

kinda ruins my whole "parsley, sage, rosemary, and thyme" developer concept

"peppermint, sage, rosemary, and thyme" might work, but it doesn't fit the lyrics

I got a set of Autochrome plates today!!

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