HP PhotoSmart M22 compact digital camera

[David Lyga]

KEH had ten of these M22 cameras for 69 cents each (!), so I decided to have fun and not have a 'Starbucks' but, instead, to order them with my other things. At $6.90, less 20% coupon discount for the ten, I had nothing to lose, but much fun to gain.

Something very interesting happened: they did not work ... but sort of worked. Testing was easy, as they take two AA cells and a standard SD Card. The definitive result was not so predictable.

First, I made certain that the alkalines were brand new by testing on another digital camera (a Canon Powershot) which indicated the batteries as being 'full'. On EACH of the HP PhotoSmart M22 cameras the following happened: it powered up, but a message stated that new batteries were needed, as these were exhausted and could not be used for taking pictures. BUT ... the sign then said that I could still review and check menus, etc, (less power needed) and so I did. I wanted to get a feeling for how the protocols were and how to navigate (as many here already know that I am not exactly Bill Gates). I did this for a few minutes and, then ... the battery indicator measured that the batteries were a little better! A few minutes later the indicator measured about half full. Then three-quarters full!

With this newfound power largess, I decided to try to take a picture and ... I was actually able to do so. The battery indicator seems to govern how much power is 'assumed to be' in the camera even though more power is there (in an absolute, not 'indicated', sense). Yet, even though more power is really there, the camera will not let you take pictures unless the indicator gives it permission to do so!

I find this rather fascinating but, a bit frustrating, because if the camera is turned off even for a few seconds, we are back to the 'no power' sign and it takes a few minutes, maybe up to ten, to be able to take pictures even with absolutely new batteries. (I did not try rechargeable or lithium batteries.) Of course, I do not want a camera that will have to be 'warmed up' for ten minutes before I get to take the shot that got away.

Perusing all menus, I could not find a place to indicate which batteries I had installed: i.e., 'alkaline', 'lithium', 'rechargeable MiNH' like you will find on most digital cameras.

I would be very interested with comments concerning this digital quirk. - David Lyga

 

[shutterfinger]

The "slow to read adequate charge" is a capacitor being slow to charge resulting in a low voltage condition. It may improve with usage.
I have a PhotoSmart something somewhere (or did) and possibly a charger/external AC power adapter. I'll give the camera away for shipping minus the power adapter. I also have a Fuji Finepix 2650 and a Power Shot A580 for next to nothing.

 

[choiliefan]

A multimeter is a great little tool for troubleshooting electrical problems and makes a terrific battery tester too.
Oftentimes you will find coupons for "Horror Fright" in magazines and newspapers offering a free multimeter with any purchase.
Buy a tarp or a microfiber cloth and you get an $8 multimeter for free.

 

[Jim Jones]

That is one thing Harbor Freight is good for. Some of their other products are worth the price for occasional use. A multimeter does not load a battery down properly for a reliable test. Cheap dedicated battery testers may be little better. A battery level test in one camera may yield quite different readings than a battery test in another. Different types of batteries have different normal voltages. I apologize for complicating a relatively simple situation, but that's the way life is.

 

[Billy Axeman]

I agree with Jim, and to explain what happens is the following.

A multimeter (set as voltmeter) is designed to influence a measurement as little as possible, so it has a high input resistance to minimize the current flow from the voltage source (in this case a battery).

On the other hand, when you want to test a battery you must load it with a current to simulate working conditions. So a battery tester is in fact a simple voltmeter with a relatively low input resistance.

When you have a multimeter, and not a battery tester, you can still use it by putting an extra resistor across the terminals of the battery (which are also the terminals of the multimeter), for example a 100 ohm resistor to load a battery of 1.5V with 15 mA (Current = Voltage / Resistance).

Battery testers can have different input resistances which explains why they can give various results. Ideally the load resistor (input resistance of the tester) should also be adapted to the type and capacity of the battery, or even better made variable to be set by the user, but that's mostly not the case.

Additionally, what shutterfinger said might be right (post 2). Other similar possibilities are that the internal backup battery in the camera isn't working properly (if there is one), or that an electrolytic capacitor is dead (the cheaper ones are vulnerable to aging).

I guess the previous owners of these camera's did the right thing; get rid of them because it's a time consuming endeavor when you have no service manual.

 

[David Lyga]

Thank you all. Sometimes there are genuine bargains, but, in this case, the 'bargain' was certainly not 'usability'. But maybe there was a 'bargain' in beholding a bit of fascination and intrigue.

Electronics has a personality of its own. But I wonder why the ten offered bodies were so similar? Their history would be interesting to discover. - David Lyga

 

[Billy Axeman]

Because all these camera's have the same fault, it looks like a design failure. For example when cheap electrolytic capacitors are used they might be at the end of their life (sometimes the backup 'battery' is also a high capacity capacitor). This camera is from 2005 so that is a possibility.

When you can figure this out without a manual you need some luck and insight. In this case it is potentially efficient because you can quickly repair 10 of them en sell them for good money.

 

[REAndy]

In case you haven't found a manual yet... It's available on HP's website: http://h10032.www1.hp.com/ctg/Manual/c00297347.pdf

 

[Billy Axeman]

Thanks REAndy. This is a user's manual, but it has a 'Problems and Solutions' section (resetting the camera, memory cards, type of battery).

 

[choiliefan]

I used to have a digital camera which wouldn't take SDHC cards.
Only the plain old SD cards would work in it.

 

[shutterfinger]

Google search for HP Photosmart M22 service manual turned up http://www.fixya.com/support/t2467657-hp_photosmart_m22_turn

 

[David Lyga]

In case you haven't found a manual yet... It's available on HP's website: http://h10032.www1.hp.com/ctg/Manual/c00297347.pdf

Thank you for this very informative user manual. Of course, it assumes that all is well with the particular camera, but if I get one up and running, this will be very useful. - David Lyga

 

[David Lyga]

Google search for HP Photosmart M22 service manual turned up http://www.fixya.com/support/t2467657-hp_photosmart_m22_turn

This link has informed me that I am not the only person with this, or similar troubles with this model. How different digital is from analog! With analog, if the batteries are partially used, the camera still performs. With digital, the first 10% of battery life is all that counts. After that, the batteries are used for other things, like radios, hair trimmers, etc. This link has exposed me to similar problems to my own. Thank you. - David Lyga

 

[REAndy]

Have you tried lithium batteries yet?

 

[shutterfinger]

In Digital +5V and 0V are the two states for logic. +5V is usually programed for a 1 and 0 for 0.
3V is considered a float and the system may read it as a 1 or a 0 and not be consistent in doing so.
To help eliminate errors the system is fixed so that it will not operate with a logic voltage less than 4V.
Each pixel in a camera gets recorded as a 1 or 0 in the saved to memory image.

The 3V battery voltage can easily be stepped up to 5V for logic usage.