HP Combiplan T 4" x 5" Dev Tank

UKJohn · Mar 9, 2006

Hi Folks,

I have recently purchased a Dev Tank (as mentioned above) for developing my 4" x 5" negs and have experienced a few irratating problems. The main one being that on a number of occasions the sheets move from its slots (within the film holder assembly), although apart from having a slightly bent or twisted sheet development appears to be ok. On other occassions the sheets have come out totally and stuck together, again developement appears ok (perhaps I have been lucky in these instances).

There is a top clip that holds the sheets firmly into the slotted film holder and this always seems to be on as one would expect. I have adjusted the tank inversion (aggitation) in case I was being to keen and that this was forcing the sheets to 'pop' out but with no luck. Also, although the instructions state that upto six sheets can be developed at any one time I have errred on the side of caution and put no more than four in, the norm is generally two. I would estimate that every third use of the tank this problem reoccurs.

So my question is has anyone else used a similar tank and if so have you experienced a similar problem? If so how did you rectify it?

Cheers

John

fschifano · Mar 9, 2006

I've had this problem. First, it can be a bit daunting to get the sheets down in the grooves correctly. Check the bottom by feel after you load it. There should be a space between each sheet. It is all to possible to force the clip down too tightly. That will cause the film sheets to bow out too much and jump the track.

UKJohn · Mar 9, 2006

Hi fschifano,

I did find it pretty difficult to guide the sheets into the slots but using the two loose guide sections helped somewhat but hasn't cured the problem. I am never to sure how far down to push the top clip as two much as you said applies to much pressure and bows the sheets, whilst if not down far enough I worry about the sheets coming out.

Thanks for your reply.

fschifano · Mar 9, 2006

Take some 4x5 sheets of RC paper and practice.

UKJohn · Mar 9, 2006

Never thought of that so will give it a try. Its one of the problems where practice makes perfect I think.

papagene · Mar 9, 2006

I have the HP Combi Plan tank and not had any problems developing 6 sheets at a time. As fs says, take some 4x5 sheets of RC and practice.
Good luck and don't give up.

gene

L Gebhardt · Mar 9, 2006

How are you inverting the tank? Make sure you rotate it around the short axis so the solution doesn't knock the film out.

haziz · Mar 9, 2006

UKJohn said:
Hi Folks,

I have recently purchased a Dev Tank (as mentioned above) for developing my 4" x 5" negs and have experienced a few irratating problems. The main one being that on a number of occasions the sheets move from its slots (within the film holder assembly), although apart from having a slightly bent or twisted sheet development appears to be ok. On other occassions the sheets have come out totally and stuck together, again developement appears ok (perhaps I have been lucky in these instances).

John

I too have had the same problem but the development and fixing always seem perfect despite 2 sheets being stuck together. On rare occasions I have noted what appears to be scratches on the base side of one of the sheets which I have wondered if it was due to the rubbing/contact of the two sheets but even there it has generally been minor. Overall I have been very happy with the tanks. If you figure the perfect way to avoid the displacement of the sheets however I would be interested to know.

Thanks.

Sincerely,

Hany.

agGNOME · Mar 9, 2006

The visual practice as mentioned should help. I haven't had any issues with film staying put. I think the trick with the top clip is to be very light on the touch . All you have to do literally is have the clip make contact with the film. Overall, I've been impressed with the design. It does seems a bit messy in practice ( the draining, and agitating if you do not have the caps screwed tightly enough). It actually fills much faster than I expected based on other users' impressions. Good luck.

UKJohn said:
Hi fschifano,

I did find it pretty difficult to guide the sheets into the slots but using the two loose guide sections helped somewhat but hasn't cured the problem. I am never to sure how far down to push the top clip as two much as you said applies to much pressure and bows the sheets, whilst if not down far enough I worry about the sheets coming out.

Thanks for your reply.

Papa Tango · Mar 9, 2006

I have used these tanks for several years, and what Lawrence says about inversion is almost mandatory. Rotating front to back will dislodge the film. I use a 4 tip halfway agitation, reversing the direction every other minute. Gentle and slow...

Also, make sure that you have assembled your holder correctly. The curved guides face inward, the straight outward. The straight guides are for glass plate film only. Check that the two blue spacer washers are on the inside of the rod between the shaft stop and the guide.

When you apply the retention holder, wiggle the top of your films. If they are loose, click it down just one more until they are firm in the holder.

When placing the loaded holder in the tank, you will note that the top "grip" and holder are off-centered. Place the short end (the one with the screw on nuts) toward the drain end, and cap with the inlet on the same side as the drain. This causes the solutions to drop into the tank directly over the guide, and not onto the film.

UKJohn · Mar 10, 2006

Well thanks guys you have provided quite a lot of useful info and suggestions all of which i have take on board, especially the tank inversion. I did think this could be part of the problem so did slow it down but I will adjust the axis through which it is rotated.

Many thanks

John

Baxter Bradford · Mar 10, 2006

John

There has been a lot of discussion about combi-plan tanks in the last year or so, usually by people first using them. They can be quirky and a number of variations to overcome this are available and have been reported here on APUG. I suggest doing an archive search and having a read, you should find it very beneficial.

regards

Poco · Mar 10, 2006

I bought a combitank for color work and broke it within 5 minutes of unpacking it. I was all excited (and, being a guy, had no use for the directions) and managed to snap the upper clip that holds the film in place -- not my proudest moment. But it turns out that was the best thing that could have happen because it forced me to use it as a dip'n dunk tank which made the whole anxiety of fill time and temp control mute. For color I just lift the sheets out twice every 30 seconds and then go directly to bleach and fix held at the ready in separate containers. I rarely have film slip out of the grooves and if that's possible without any top clip...

The point is, if, after following all the good advice above, you still can't get it to work for you as intended, consider going dip'n dunk with it. Works great.

PhotoBob · Mar 10, 2006

UKJohn said:
Never thought of that so will give it a try. Its one of the problems where practice makes perfect I think.

At first I thought maybe the sheets were not in their slots which seems to be easy enough to do with this particular design. What I do after using the orange guides that came with my tank is feel the sheets to ensure there is a definite space between each of them.
I wouldn't recommend pushing down too hard on the clip. I think it is just to stabalise the sheets and keep them in order.
Perhaps the suggestion to experiement with RC might help with the process as you re-trace your procedures.
Hope it works out for you, I have found this tank to be a real straightforward one, although the loading design does leave something to be improved.

df cardwell · Mar 10, 2006

The Combi tank lends itself to reduced agitation methods: I use mine when traveling, and a little rodinal goes a long way. Agitating every 5th minute does wonders.

d

UKJohn · Mar 10, 2006

Baxter Bradford said:
John

There has been a lot of discussion about combi-plan tanks in the last year or so, usually by people first using them. They can be quirky and a number of variations to overcome this are available and have been reported here on APUG. I suggest doing an archive search and having a read, you should find it very beneficial.

regards

Hi Baxter (& everyone else )

I have spent the past hour or so looking through the archives and re-reading the posts here and have come across loads of useful tips, suggestions and guidence. Further practice is required along with a change in how I agitate, from what I have read this could be the driver behind my problem.

Also, early on I did'nt like the slow fill rate when pouring in the developer and so changed to pouring this in by taking the tank lid off (in the dark) replacing it then doing the initial agitation before turning the light on. I use the same approach for dumping the developer and adding the stop. The fix is added through the funnel/nossel. I do achieve even developed negatives I must say, its just that they have a habit of popping out!

Well once again many thakns to you all.

John

fschifano · Mar 10, 2006

If you keep your development times to 10 minutes or better, the fill and drain times become an insignificant part of the total. Dilute developers and cooler processing temps help here as you well know.

ggriffi · Mar 10, 2006

John,

I too have one of these tanks and love it. One of the things that I have done is to stop using the orange guides and only develop four sheets max at any given time. More time than not, I would have the contact between two adjacent sheets. So now I just load the inside slot and the outside slot. The reason that I stopped using the guide was that I could tell by feel whether I had the sheet is the slot. Last thing, as mentioned earlier, use gentle agitation. I no longer use inversion but a kind of "tipping motion". I tip the tank to about a forty five degree angle on both axis' (?) this has worked very well for me.

g

L Gebhardt · Mar 11, 2006

One issue I have had with the Combiplan is with air bubbles on the film. At first I was hessitant to give it a couple sharp raps on bottom after agitation because the tank is plastic. After getting air bubble marks twice I started rapping the tank on the bottom of the simk and this fixed the problem. I still think it is going to break when I do it, but so far it is fine.

Papa Tango · Mar 11, 2006

L Gebhardt said:
One issue I have had with the Combiplan is with air bubbles on the film. At first I was hessitant to give it a couple sharp raps on bottom after agitation because the tank is plastic. After getting air bubble marks twice I started rapping the tank on the bottom of the simk and this fixed the problem. I still think it is going to break when I do it, but so far it is fine.

Try using one of those Rubbermaid sink pads. It softens the contact.

HP Combiplan T 4" x 5" Dev Tank

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