How to develop high contrast images like of Mario Giacomelli, which film, which dev.

[martingriffy]

Hi all,
This is my first post, I am studying BA Photography at the Arts University College Bournemouth.
I am trying to work out the best way to achieve high contrast B&W images similar to that of Mario Giacomelli.
I have HP5+ 120 film, Kodak D-19 and Rodinal.
I have heard that Adox cms20 and Rollei ATP are high contrast film, but would I need to use those with high contrast dev or visa versa.
Thank you in advance for any responses, all will be appreciated.
Martin.

 

[David William White]

First, any film can be used, with the general regiment of underexposing and overdeveloping. And then, if you need to, printed with high contrast filtration (all magenta on a colour head or #5 on B/W head).

Another way, especially if you want the same end result from any old negative, is to duplicate it onto ortho/litho film and develop it in litho developers. Attached is such an example that I made from a flat negative earlier this year. The interneg I made didn't require anything other than grade 2 to print.

 

[Vaughn]

If you have not already, find, or create, a high contrast scene to photograph. This will help a lot. Priests in black on snow -- no need for special high contrast film and/or developers there! Work out what will be in front of the camera -- that will drive the needs of what happens in the camera and in the darkroom.

But of the films I am familiar with, to greatly increase contrast, HP5+ would not normally be my film of choice. But in the D-19, it might work out very well if you need to really bump up the contrast...otherwise increased development in your other developer might be enough. Slower ISO/ASA films tend to give more contrast (FP4+ instead of HP5+, for example). The old slow Tech Pan and copy films could just pump out contrast all day.

Good luck in your explorations.

Vaughn

 

[George Collier]

I would first convince myself that I could not use printing to achieve the desired effect with normal, or maybe slightly contrasty negs, before processing film in lith chems. For one thing, it gives you more printing options and control. Much of Giacomelli's work has tones, but is printed to emphasize contrast. I have seen his work firsthand, and it doesn't always appear to have middle grays "dropped out", but is usually printed contrastier than "normal".

 

[martingriffy]

Thanks very much David and Vaughn for your speedy responses, both suggestions I will explore.
One thing, is Rodinal dev worth using for this effect, iv heard some mixed opinions so im now not to sure.
Thanks again

Martin

 

[martingriffy]

So you think maybe it can be done just in the developing stage?

 

[David William White]

Rodinal? Absolutely. Go shoot a short roll, underexpose by 2 stops and double your development time. It'll be contrasty as hell.

George makes a good point on printing options; my remarks are if you want to go to the wall with it, or in the case or duplicating, it's all an afterthought done to existing negatives.

Kodak had a nice book on the subject, both for B/W and colour, called 'High Contrast Photography' or something like that.

 

[Grif]

What's the current version of Kodalith and the associated hi contrast developer? D-19? Made a print from the negative on 4x5 kodalith, then did a contact print on to more kodalith from the resulting positive, then back in the enlarger for the final paper print.

 

[Guillaume Zuili]

Martin,

Film processing has nothing to do with Giacomelli's work.
It's on printing hard and... bleaching.

Rodinal is a terrific dev.
To reach this kind of effect you are better off with printing. if print is bad, you toss it and do another one.
If you overkill your film because of processing you might have lost some precious images.

G.

 

[Michael W]

I read that Giacomelli would over expose & over develop the film.

 

[Guillaume Zuili]

I read that Giacomelli would over expose & over develop the film.

Very common. I do too. It's called negative with meat.

 

[removed account4]

Very common. I do too. It's called negative with meat.

yeah ..


+3

 

[Metroman]

I read in a book I have that he overexposed and overdeveloped. He also played with multiple exposures which explains that some objects in his photos are not on the same scale as others.

Frank Hovat interviewed him in 1987.

I prefer Ralph Gibson's high contrast images.

 

[ooze]

You might want to compare Bill Brandt's earlier and later style printing. Earlier, he used to print more tonal, whereas in his later years the same picture is printed to much higher contrast, similar to Giacomelli's tonal range. So, you can pretty much get a very wide range of interpretations with a normally developed negative.

Having said that, I have two Giacomelli monographs, and what I understand from them is that Giacomelli was quite sloppy in film developing, in a creative way, if you like. It's very likely that a lot of his negatives were overcooked. Nevertheless, he was a great artist, and I'm pretty sure that amongst all that visible chaos he had his own kind of order.

 

[MaximusM3]

Very common. I do too. It's called negative with meat.

You know it!! Tri-X @ 100-200 and Rodinal 1:25 for 10-11.5 min has so much meat to it, it's not funny. To my taste, just perfect negatives (for those who don't mind some grain), with sparkling but never blown highlights, and more detail in the shadows than one cares to print.

 

[martingriffy]

I have some Ralph Gibson books to, he is another artist that i have been looking at. Ill also check out Bill Brant.
Would be interesting if it could be done just in the print stage, it would certainly give me more flexibility with my negs.

Thanks everyone, for the info, you have given me alot to think on and experiment with.
Cheers
Martin

 

[Jim Noel]

The slower the film, the greater the inherent contrast. faster film such as HP5+ and Tri-X do not expand well, they do contract well.
Try a film in the ISO 25-50 range and you will be much closer to the extreme range you are looking for.
Lith type films usually have an effective ISO of 3-6. If you can work with the longer exposures, they are designed to produce black and white with few or no grays in between. They can be developed to full scale with appropriate developers.