How should you properly care for Mamiya medium format lenses for the RB67 system?

Certain Exposures · Sep 1, 2023

Questions:

1. What can I change my about storage and handling to prevent fungus and haze from building on the lenses?

2. How can I prevent lens separation from happening?

3. Do lens wipes like these damage the coating on Mamiya Sekor C and KL glass? Those lens wipes contain isopropyl alcohol (unspecified concentration), but the manufacturer claims they do not damage antireflective lens coatings.

Context

I purchased a Mamiya RB67 earlier this month and a few lenses. I noticed that fungus, haze, and lens separation were common issues while I searched through listings on eBay. I have seen many lenses listed at high prices and high grades ("EX +++!") with several flaws. I have not noticed as many issues in 35mm systems like the Nikon F lineup or TLRs like Yashicas. I want to prevent my lenses from developing problems.

I already know the basics. For example, I won't leave my lenses in a hot attic or outdoor garage. However, are there less obvious things we can do to keep lenses blemish-free?

Alan Edward Klein · Sep 1, 2023

What part of the country are you from? A lot depends on that I would think.

Sirius Glass · Sep 1, 2023

Certain Exposures said:
Questions:

1. What can I change my about storage and handling to prevent fungus and haze from building on the lenses?

2. How can I prevent lens separation from happening?

3. Do lens wipes like these damage the coating on Mamiya Sekor C and KL glass? Those lens wipes contain isopropyl alcohol (unspecified concentration), but the manufacturer claims they do not damage antireflective lens coatings.

Context

I purchased a Mamiya RB67 earlier this month and a few lenses. I noticed that fungus, haze, and lens separation were common issues while I searched through listings on eBay. I have seen many lenses listed at high prices and high grades ("EX +++!") with several flaws. I have not noticed as many issues in 35mm systems like the Nikon F lineup or TLRs like Yashicas. I want to prevent my lenses from developing problems.

I already know the basics. For example, I won't leave my lenses in a hot attic or outdoor garage. However, are there less obvious things we can do to keep lenses blemish-free?

Welcome to ~~APUG~~ Photrio!!

xkaes · Sep 1, 2023

As Alan asked, if you live in a dry area, fungus is not a problem. In humid areas, store lenses with desiccant.

As to cleaning, this should basically never happen. You should have a 77mm UV filter on the front of every lens for protection. Clean the filter if something happens -- not the lens. The rear should always have a cap on it -- unless on the camera.. If a little dust gets on the rear, use a camel hair brush.

A lot of stuff is sold with fungus, scratches, etc. BECAUSE it has fungus, scratches, etc. The gear itself is not PRONE to fungus, scratches, etc. Just take good care of your gear and you won't need to sell it.

There's nothing you can do to prevent separation, but I've never heard that this is an issue with Mamiya lenses.

Alan Edward Klein · Sep 1, 2023

I have four Rb67 lenses for around 35 years. I don;t see any problems with them, fungus, mold, etc.. I keep them in the camera bag with the Mamiya caps on each lens's ends. I often leave the case in the trunk of my car. I live in NYC area which has hot and humid days but not as bad as the South.

Certain Exposures · Sep 1, 2023

Alan Edward Klein said:
What part of the country are you from? A lot depends on that I would think.

Alan Edward Klein said:
I have four Rb67 lenses for around 35 years. I don;t see any problems with them, fungus, mold, etc.. I keep them in the camera bag with the Mamiya caps on each lens's ends. I often leave the case in the trunk of my car. I live in NYC area which has hot and humid days but not as bad as the South.

I'm on the east coast of the USA like you.

Interesting, thanks. That is encouraging. It makes me question why the lenses on eBay are in such poor condition.

Sirius Glass said:
Welcome to ~~APUG~~ Photrio!!

Thank you!

xkaes said:
You should have a 77mm UV filter on the front of every lens for protection.

A lot of stuff is sold with fungus, scratches, etc. BECAUSE it has fungus, scratches, etc. The gear itself is not PRONE to fungus, scratches, etc. Just take good care of your gear and you won't need to sell it.

xkaes said:
There's nothing you can do to prevent separation, but I've never heard that this is an issue with Mamiya lenses.

I've debated getting a filter because these lenses are much more expensive than what I've used until now. I do not own any UV filters yet.

The lenses for sale online, in particular the 140mm KL that I'm hunting for, often suffer from separation.

xkaes · Sep 1, 2023

The lenses are expensive and that's why it's important to protect them all with a UV filter -- cheap insurance.

I don't know anything about the 140mm KL lens, but I've never heard of Mamiya lenses having separation problems. If this is a problem, it will either show up through this discussion, or you can start a separate discussion with that in the title, such as "DO MAMIYA LENSES SUFFER FROM SEPARATION?"

Sirius Glass · Sep 1, 2023

Since you are in an area with higher humidity, I recommend not storing cameras or lenses in leather cases or closed containers. I store mine on a bookshelf in my study and move them to a camera bag only when I am going to take the out to use them.

reddesert · Sep 1, 2023

I don't have an RB67. Here's my guess: the RB67 lenses on ebay are all in poor condition because they got put away in 2003 or so in a humid climate when their owners stopped using film, then taken out 15-20 years later and put on ebay. Then, the lenses that are in good condition nevertheless are selling quickly due to a moderate uptick in demand, so when you look at ebay at any given time, there's like 1 good lens and 15 bad lenses that have been sitting unsold.

There are some minor differences in lens construction between types, such as RB67 lenses have a shutter while Nikon lenses don't, leading to possibly a bit more oil inside the lens body to evaporate, but really I think what you're seeing is related to increased demand/supply ratio for medium format gear and not any intrinsic property of lenses. If you want a good lens, there are suppliers with a guarantee (KEH, Roberts, etc). If you want to take care of the lenses you have, usual ideas about avoiding humidity and heat should be adequate.

Marcelo Paniagua · Sep 1, 2023

I've been using Mamiya lens for a long time, for their different systems, from 4x5, 6x6, 6x7 and even 6x9 and never had separación issues. Probably lucky but I think Mamiya lens quality is top notch.

As for the question about why some many RB lenses in poor quality on ebay, remember this where professional lenses that where abused, not amateur lenses that where barely used. Also probably most of the best had already been bought and only the Bad ones are left.

Alan Edward Klein · Sep 2, 2023

Certain Exposures said:
I'm on the east coast of the USA like you.

Interesting, thanks. That is encouraging. It makes me question why the lenses on eBay are in such poor condition.

Thank you!

I've debated getting a filter because these lenses are much more expensive than what I've used until now. I do not own any UV filters yet.

The lenses for sale online, in particular the 140mm KL that I'm hunting for, often suffer from separation.

I should have mentioned that three of my lenses I bought new 45 years ago and the other was pretty new when I bought it from a friend. So I started with lenses that were in new or prime condition, not something you can count on when buying off the web.

Alan Edward Klein · Sep 2, 2023

Don't be afraid to ask the seller the exact condition before you buy. Have him provide detailed pictures. Check the seller's ratings. I wouldn't buy from anyone less than 98% favorable rating. Also, make sure they guarantee a full return policy for any reason. It also doesn't hurt to negotiate price. Offer them less. The worst they can say is No.

Alan Edward Klein · Sep 2, 2023

Marcelo Paniagua said:
I've been using Mamiya lens for a long time, for their different systems, from 4x5, 6x6, 6x7 and even 6x9 and never had separación issues. Probably lucky but I think Mamiya lens quality is top notch.

As for the question about why some many RB lenses in poor quality on ebay, remember this where professional lenses that where abused, not amateur lenses that where barely used. Also probably most of the best had already been bought and only the Bad ones are left.

Stay away from 127mm RB67 lenses. This was a popular one for weddings taken by professionals who beat the heck out of them. I started with a 90mm and then use the 2x methods of selecting others. Picking lenses that doubled or halved from the others. Going in between just isn;t enough change to be worth it. So my other lenses besides 90mm are 50mm, 180mm and 360mm. I use the 360 the least. I really like the others for landscape photography especially using the 90 and 50 the most. I don't shoot portraits much.

Alan Edward Klein · Sep 2, 2023

Use lens cleaner made for optical lenses. I buy from B&H Photo. I use Zeiss.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1081869-REG/zeiss_2096_686_lens_cleaning_solution.html

Get a little blower with brush to blow off the dust first. Then use the liquid and cloth if you need to. In a pinch, I'll breathe on the lens and use my cotton handkerchief or T short. If you get grease on the lens, I use ROR. Put a drop on a lens clothe, then wipe the lens. Don;' put the cleaners on the lens as they may penetrate it around the edges.

Don't overdo any of this cleaning.

blower brush | B&H Photo Video

Shop B&H's in stock, large inventory for fast shipping, great service and everyday low prices on blower brush. For more info, please call 800-947-4415

www.bhphotovideo.com

ror | B&H Photo Video

Shop B&H's in stock, large inventory for fast shipping, great service and everyday low prices on ror. For more info, please call 800-947-4415

www.bhphotovideo.com

Sirius Glass · Sep 2, 2023

Alan Edward Klein said:
Use lens cleaner made for optical lenses. I buy from B&H Photo. I use Zeiss.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1081869-REG/zeiss_2096_686_lens_cleaning_solution.html

Get a little blower with brush to blow off the dust first. Then use the liquid and cloth if you need to. In a pinch, I'll breathe on the lens and use my cotton handkerchief or T short. If you get grease on the lens, I use ROR. Put a drop on a lens clothe, then wipe the lens. Don;' put the cleaners on the lens as they may penetrate it around the edges.

Don't overdo any of this cleaning.

blower brush | B&H Photo Video

Shop B&H's in stock, large inventory for fast shipping, great service and everyday low prices on blower brush. For more info, please call 800-947-4415

www.bhphotovideo.com

ror | B&H Photo Video

Shop B&H's in stock, large inventory for fast shipping, great service and everyday low prices on ror. For more info, please call 800-947-4415

www.bhphotovideo.com

Rubbing a lens hard with a lens cloth or tissue even with lens cleaning fluid will damage the coatings!

Alan Edward Klein · Sep 2, 2023

Sirius Glass said:
Rubbing a lens hard with a lens cloth or tissue even with lens cleaning fluid will damage the coatings!

So what do you do?

Sirius Glass · Sep 2, 2023

Sirius Glass said:
Rubbing a lens hard with a lens cloth or tissue even with lens cleaning fluid will damage the coatings!

Alan Edward Klein said:
So what do you do?

Either with or without cleaning fluid, lightly wipe the lens with a lens cloth in a circular motion. Do not rub hard.

xkaes · Sep 2, 2023

Sirius Glass said:
Either with or without cleaning fluid, lightly wipe the lens with a lens cloth in a circular motion. Do not rub hard.

And then never get your lens dirty again.

Sirius Glass · Sep 2, 2023

xkaes said:
And then never get your lens dirty again.

Hence the need for Skylight or UV filters to protect the lens front elements.

xkaes · Sep 2, 2023

But they're so expensive!!!

AnselMortensen · Sep 2, 2023

Remember that Japan has high humidity, and other weather issues when considering Ebay purchases from there.
Some folks say they are the "gold standard" for online lens purchases, but I have found otherwise.
"MINT +++++" doesn't seem to mean "no fungus, haze or scratches".

Sirius Glass · Sep 2, 2023

Sirius Glass said:
Hence the need for Skylight or UV filters to protect the lens front elements.

xkaes said:
But they're so expensive!!!

Those filters put the cost of stop bath with indicator to shame!

Certain Exposures · Sep 4, 2023

xkaes said:
The lenses are expensive and that's why it's important to protect them all with a UV filter -- cheap insurance.

I don't know anything about the 140mm KL lens, but I've never heard of Mamiya lenses having separation problems. If this is a problem, it will either show up through this discussion, or you can start a separate discussion with that in the title, such as "DO MAMIYA LENSES SUFFER FROM SEPARATION?"

Thanks, I may do this another time.

Sirius Glass said:
Since you are in an area with higher humidity, I recommend not storing cameras or lenses in leather cases or closed containers. I store mine on a bookshelf in my study and move them to a camera bag only when I am going to take the out to use them.

Thanks. I was debating purchasing a pelican case. Maybe that would not be ideal then.

reddesert said:
I don't have an RB67. Here's my guess: the RB67 lenses on ebay are all in poor condition because they got put away in 2003 or so in a humid climate when their owners stopped using film, then taken out 15-20 years later and put on ebay. Then, the lenses that are in good condition nevertheless are selling quickly due to a moderate uptick in demand, so when you look at ebay at any given time, there's like 1 good lens and 15 bad lenses that have been sitting unsold.

There are some minor differences in lens construction between types, such as RB67 lenses have a shutter while Nikon lenses don't, leading to possibly a bit more oil inside the lens body to evaporate, but really I think what you're seeing is related to increased demand/supply ratio for medium format gear and not any intrinsic property of lenses. If you want a good lens, there are suppliers with a guarantee (KEH, Roberts, etc). If you want to take care of the lenses you have, usual ideas about avoiding humidity and heat should be adequate.

This would make sense. You're right: the larger suppliers do have lenses listed in high quality. Naturally they sell them at a premium. I have to admit that I am looking for "deals!" I use my equipment often so I always fret about replacement cost.

Marcelo Paniagua said:
I've been using Mamiya lens for a long time, for their different systems, from 4x5, 6x6, 6x7 and even 6x9 and never had separación issues. Probably lucky but I think Mamiya lens quality is top notch.

As for the question about why some many RB lenses in poor quality on ebay, remember this where professional lenses that where abused, not amateur lenses that where barely used. Also probably most of the best had already been bought and only the Bad ones are left.

Thanks, it seems true.

Alan Edward Klein said:
I should have mentioned that three of my lenses I bought new 45 years ago and the other was pretty new when I bought it from a friend. So I started with lenses that were in new or prime condition, not something you can count on when buying off the web.

That definitely makes a difference!

Alan Edward Klein said:
Don't be afraid to ask the seller the exact condition before you buy. Have him provide detailed pictures. Check the seller's ratings. I wouldn't buy from anyone less than 98% favorable rating. Also, make sure they guarantee a full return policy for any reason. It also doesn't hurt to negotiate price. Offer them less. The worst they can say is No.

Thanks, I do. I probably drive sellers crazy. I try to be reasonable.

Alan Edward Klein said:
Stay away from 127mm RB67 lenses. This was a popular one for weddings taken by professionals who beat the heck out of them. I started with a 90mm and then use the 2x methods of selecting others. Picking lenses that doubled or halved from the others. Going in between just isn;t enough change to be worth it. So my other lenses besides 90mm are 50mm, 180mm and 360mm. I use the 360 the least. I really like the others for landscape photography especially using the 90 and 50 the most. I don't shoot portraits much.

Thanks for this tip. I bought this camera to do environmental portraits. I have the 250 and I love the focal length. However, it's abusive because you have to be as accurate as Deadshot with the focus. I can't imagine 360.

Alan Edward Klein said:
Use lens cleaner made for optical lenses. I buy from B&H Photo. I use Zeiss.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1081869-REG/zeiss_2096_686_lens_cleaning_solution.html

Get a little blower with brush to blow off the dust first. Then use the liquid and cloth if you need to. In a pinch, I'll breathe on the lens and use my cotton handkerchief or T short. If you get grease on the lens, I use ROR. Put a drop on a lens clothe, then wipe the lens. Don;' put the cleaners on the lens as they may penetrate it around the edges.

Don't overdo any of this cleaning.

blower brush | B&H Photo Video

Shop B&H's in stock, large inventory for fast shipping, great service and everyday low prices on blower brush. For more info, please call 800-947-4415

www.bhphotovideo.com

ror | B&H Photo Video

Shop B&H's in stock, large inventory for fast shipping, great service and everyday low prices on ror. For more info, please call 800-947-4415

www.bhphotovideo.com

Thanks.

Sirius Glass said:
Rubbing a lens hard with a lens cloth or tissue even with lens cleaning fluid will damage the coatings!

Copy, thanks.

Alan Edward Klein said:
So what do you do?

At first I misunderstood him too. He does both things but he doesn't do it "hard."

AnselMortensen said:
Remember that Japan has high humidity, and other weather issues when considering Ebay purchases from there.
Some folks say they are the "gold standard" for online lens purchases, but I have found otherwise.
"MINT +++++" doesn't seem to mean "no fungus, haze or scratches".

Agreed. However, I heard a rumor that many of those listings with exaggerated titles aren't truly Japanese sellers.

Alan Edward Klein · Sep 4, 2023

Use the magnifier on the waist level viewfinder to help in focusing. If you're using the eye level finder, there is a magnifier attachment that I use as well.

Certain Exposures · Sep 4, 2023

Alan Edward Klein said:
Use the magnifier on the waist level viewfinder to help in focusing. If you're using the eye level finder, there is a magnifier attachment that I use as well.

Yes, I need to try a few different diopters for the waist level finder. The one I have isn't sharp enough for me. They're expensive though.

How should you properly care for Mamiya medium format lenses for the RB67 system?

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency