How effective is a yellow filter?

Slowshooter · Aug 22, 2014

Just started medium format black and white photography with the Pentax 67 II and I'm enjoying it immensely. However, many of my shots come out kind of flat and lacking in contrast. I used Ilford FP4 and T-Max 100 and have shot mostly on dark cloudy days. Here's one example after digital editing: https://www.flickr.com/photos/an_solas/13807485583/

The advice I've seen online and elsewhere is that a No. 8 yellow filter would provide 'normal correction'. Others say that this filter doesn't make much of a difference. Should I go for a stronger yellow filter in that case or even an orange one?:confused:

Many thanks.

Jim Jones · Aug 22, 2014

A yellow filter won't make much difference on cloudy days. The subject will be lacking in contrast. This can be corrected in developing the negative and printing. Yellow, orange, and red filters do improve the contrast between clouds and blue sky on a sunny day. I prefer a red filter to emphasize clouds.

Slowshooter · Aug 22, 2014

Would developing/printing also give greater contrast to the ground/grass? I'm going to use a graduated ND for the sky.

David Allen · Aug 22, 2014

The most effective yellow filter is a Wratten No. 12 (minus Blue). This gives much better rendition of skies and contrast increase than other darker yellow or orange filters together with only one stop loss in speed.

There is one currently on eBay:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Kodak-Gel...9400842?pt=Camera_Filters&hash=item2a419c7c0a

Very worthwhile getting one if you like to do landscape work.

Bests,

David
www.dsallen.de

Slowshooter · Aug 22, 2014

David,
I have a Lee filter holder, so it needs to fit that! Maybe Wratten have a 100 mm version?

Old-N-Feeble · Aug 22, 2014

Your example image doesn't look flat to me. The scene itself has overall low contrast but the micro-contrast looks quite nice. I like the image the way it is (slightly high-key) but if you print it darker you may gain what appears to be increased contrast. If you really want to add contrast to the neg then try selenium toner but be careful not to go too far... and make darned sure the neg was completely fixed in fresh hypo and washed to archival standards.

E. von Hoegh · Aug 22, 2014

Old-N-Feeble said:
Your example image doesn't look flat to me. The scene itself has overall low contrast but the micro-contrast looks quite nice. I like the image the way it is (slightly high-key) but if you print it darker you may gain what appears to be increased contrast.

I agree. It seems to be a pretty good rendition of a low contrast scene, you could either print a bit darker or keep the slightly high-key look and go up a half grade on MC paper. I'd go for very slightly higher paper contrast myself.

gone · Aug 22, 2014

"....many of my shots come out kind of flat and lacking in contrast. I used Ilford FP4 and T-Max 100 and have shot mostly on dark cloudy days".

Yes, there's your problem in a nutshell. You're using a formula that is guaranteed to give flat results. Shoot Tri-X, and shoot it on days w/ good light w/ a good hood on your lens. For more contrast in the skies and clouds, go w/ a red filter. Do these things and you will see a huge difference in your photos, assuming that you meter it correctly, and w/ Tri-X, that's not even that important. I personally have had lousy results w/ orange filters, for whatever reason. Red and yellow are perfect for landscapes or most anything. Green is interesting for foliage, and a green-yellow may give good portraits, depending on the complexion of your sitter.

markbarendt · Aug 22, 2014

Filters change how colors in the scene affect the film and they aren't normally a 1 fits every situation thing.

I'm speaking in very general, practical use terms here, not proper color/exposure theory.

Adding a yellow filter, you will make "yellows" in the scene more white, brighter than the other colors.

The rough opposite of yellows, oranges, and reds are in the blue neighborhood. With any of these filters the sky and shadows which are typically blue get progressively darker, more black.

Same idea works with green filters and and it's opposite color, blue and and it's opposite color ...

So to get specific, to get a significant effect with a yellow filter the scene has to have yellow or blue in it. Your example doesn't look like it had a bunch of blue sky in it so it may not have done much for you and orange or red may have been needed to get a significant effect.

These filters are often sold in sets so that you can adjust as needed anytime. The good thing is that the effect is visible through these filters and with a little practice you'll get to the point where you can pick a filter for a given situation that gets you closer to the print you want.

Xmas · Aug 22, 2014

Try PanF for dull days.
Use VC paper (or RC) pick a grade for nice midtones so you need to burn and dodge shadows and highlights split grade print if you want more.
Yellow or pola filter for blue sky with some clouds.

j-dogg · Aug 22, 2014

Be careful with red filters on landscapes, your green foliage will be super-dark.

I use red, yellow, and GND full Cokin set, makes for some cool effects. Check my gallery if you can there is a landscape with a red filter you can see what it does.

Sirius Glass · Aug 22, 2014

j-dogg said:
Be careful with red filters on landscapes, your green foliage will be super-dark.

Black skies get boring very quickly.

David A. Goldfarb · Aug 22, 2014

A medium yellow filter is probably my most used filter. It will give you better separation between clouds and blue sky than no filter without turning foliage too dark or seeming overly dramatic. It also cuts through haze, and like any strong monochromatic filter, with older lenses it reduces chromatic aberration. A light yellow filter is good just for reducing UV haze. Sometimes I'll use an orange filter for a stronger effect than a medium yellow filter. I rarely use a red filter, which will push the blue sky more toward black.

Tobacco and orange grads were designed for cheesy effects with color film, but they're actually quite handy for B&W, because they'll increase cloud separation in the sky without affecting the foreground.

Denverdad · Aug 22, 2014

Lee themselves make a set of colored contrast filters for B&W specifically for that holder. I have the Lee system myself and probably use the yellow and orange filters the most (although I really need to experiment more with the green).

Slowshooter said:
David,
I have a Lee filter holder, so it needs to fit that! Maybe Wratten have a 100 mm version?

MattKing · Aug 22, 2014

Your linked example isn't flat - it just shows a relatively narrow range of tones unless one examines the small details.

No filter is going to change that, unless the original scene had some strongly contrasting colours that might be differentiated using a suitable filter.

If you change your subject and/or change the light, you may end up with more tones.

Old-N-Feeble · Aug 22, 2014

Just try doing another print exactly the same but printed darker... heck make one a little darker and another far darker. I'll bet you're pleasantly surprised. If you do then please post your results.

If you don't mind a little cropping critique... consider cropping some from the bottom of the frame to eliminate that little bit of fence in the lower right corner... maybe 15-20 percent. The composition doesn't need any of that anyway. But leave all other sides alone. One of my staunch rules is... if something doesn't add to the composition then it detracts from it.

DREW WILEY · Aug 22, 2014

Just depends....Depends on your specific film, along with how contrasty you develop and print it, and also depends on just how blue or whatever you sky happens to be. Forget the old sterotypes. You gotta test em under your personal circumstances, and according to what
kind of look you happen to like. I do a lot of high altitude shooting, and to this day I've never gotten a "black" sky even with a deep red filter. To do that, ya gotta burn the sky in some, filter or not. Even green foliage reflects a certain amount of red light, and plenty of yellow. If you want to make green foliage really dark like back in olden blue-sensitive film days, try a blue tricolor filter like a 47B, which will of course make blue skies almost white. But there are various hypotheses about why skies aren't as blue today as they once were, especially involving the
effect of high altitude jets over the decades. My brother once entered a color photo contest back in the 60's with a shot taken in the high Sierras and was booted because the Los Angeles judges accused him of somehow tinting the skies too blue (obviously long before Fauxtoshop days, and it wasn't a dye transfer print either). In that smoghole, none of the had apparently even seen a clear blue sky, which
at times can appear almost indigo at high altitudes. Polarizers sometimes will blacken things, though I'm not personally fond of them.
Los Angeles judges

David Allen · Aug 23, 2014

Slowshooter said:
David,
I have a Lee filter holder, so it needs to fit that! Maybe Wratten have a 100 mm version?

Tiffin have the production rights to Wratten filters. They make 100mm version:

http://www.tiffen.com/displayproduct.html?tablename=kodakaccessories&itemnum=EK1496991

Please note that the Wratten No. 12 is quite different from other yellow filters.

Bests,

David.
www.dsallen.de

RalphLambrecht · Aug 23, 2014

Slowshooter said:
Just started medium format black and white photography with the Pentax 67 II and I'm enjoying it immensely. However, many of my shots come out kind of flat and lacking in contrast. I used Ilford FP4 and T-Max 100 and have shot mostly on dark cloudy days. Here's one example after digital editing: https://www.flickr.com/photos/an_solas/13807485583/

The advice I've seen online and elsewhere is that a No. 8 yellow filter would provide 'normal correction'. Others say that this filter doesn't make much of a difference. Should I go for a stronger yellow filter in that case or even an orange one?:confused:

Many thanks.

In my view both statements are correct.I also recommend the Y8 as a std filter to correct B&W tonalitybut,It won't do much for your scene.Those dark cloudy days just don't len themselves to impact-rich B&W photography.o filter in the world will darken your blue sky if there is no blue sky.If you want white puffy clouds and dark skies,wait for that condition and use an orange or red filter.contrast is in lightingor post processing not in filtering.However the yellow filteris almost never a bad idea.btw.FP4 is not a bad choice for good contrast

Slowshooter · Aug 24, 2014

Thank you all so much for a huge range of suggestions. I suppose it's really up to me to experiment and see what works.

removed account4 · Aug 24, 2014

yellow filter is great if shooting paper negatives, helps cut down the crazy contrast some papers offer

RalphLambrecht · Aug 25, 2014

jnanian said:
yellow filter is great if shooting paper negatives, helps cut down the crazy contrast some papers offer

+1,with paper negativesit's almost a must.

How effective is a yellow filter?

Slowshooter

Jim Jones

Slowshooter

David Allen

Slowshooter

Old-N-Feeble

E. von Hoegh

gone

markbarendt

Xmas

j-dogg

Sirius Glass

David A. Goldfarb

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Denverdad

MattKing

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Old-N-Feeble

DREW WILEY

David Allen

RalphLambrecht

Slowshooter

removed account4

RalphLambrecht

How effective is a yellow filter?

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