Holga Panorama 6x12 Or BelAir X 6-12?

[Andrew O'Neill]

Took these two out for a spin to help decide which one I should take with me to Japan this Summer...

 

[TheFlyingCamera]

I think it depends very much on two things: your goal for the nature of the images, and if you have the Russian glass lenses for the Belair or not. With the plastic lenses on the Belair, the difference between the two is down to do you need the more accurate exposures the Belair gives with its built-in meter, or do you want the spontaneity/serendipity of the Holga? If plastic fantastic is the goal, the 58mm on the Belair in some ways out-Holga's the Holga. The Holga is also a more true 6x12 frame - the Belair is more like a 5.2 x 10.5-ish. It's millimeters, but they do count. I've actually thought about cannibalizing one of my spare Belairs and putting the front standard with the meter and shutter on the body of my HolgaPan. The Russian glass lenses are a game-changer, to me - I have both of them, the 90 and the 117, and they are every bit as good as some of the Zeiss glass I have on other cameras. With them, the difference becomes much more pronounced, and they become two very different tools.

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

Interesting! Thank you for sharing, TheFlyingCamera.

 

[250swb]

I've had both and neither are actually 6x12. The simplest is the best, so the Holga. I sold my BelAir pretty soon after getting it, too finicky and neither here nor there, the lens is ok but that leaves it in a no-mans-land where it's not quite sharp and not quite characterful. The Holga lens is bad but we accept that for what it is. And even though I don't strictly have the Holga 120Pan anymore it lives on in spirit after I converted it to my Holga-gon by mounting a 90mm Angulon on the front with a helical mount (and with many other modifications). But as the basic camera goes the Holga 120Pan is the fun one.

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

I've had both and neither are actually 6x12. The simplest is the best, so the Holga. I sold my BelAir pretty soon after getting it, too finicky and neither here nor there, the lens is ok but that leaves it in a no-mans-land where it's not quite sharp and not quite characterful. The Holga lens is bad but we accept that for what it is. And even though I don't strictly have the Holga 120Pan anymore it lives on in spirit after I converted it to my Holga-gon by mounting a 90mm Angulon on the front with a helical mount (and with many other modifications). But as the basic camera goes the Holga 120Pan is the fun one.

I'm actually quite pleased with the Holga lens... I ran some Rollei IR through it with a 720 filter a few months back... Sharp enough in the middle, with the typical softness at the edges... Here's the video. Go to 5:07 mark to see images...

 

[IMetodiev]

I've played around with both, much prefer the Belair, the Holga is a little too much of a toy.

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

I've played around with both, much prefer the Belair, the Holga is a little too much of a toy.

That's because it is a toy Toys aside, the Holga negatives were sharper...and bigger. I appreciate the Belair's built in exposure metre, and 58 and 90mm lenses, though. If I can source one of those Russian glass lenses at a reasonable price...

 

[xya]

... If I can source one of those Russian glass lenses at a reasonable price...

Forget it. I try since 10 years...

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

Forget it. I try since 10 years...

Yes, I know it's a rare but someone will let one go eventually...

 

[xya]

Yes, I know it's a rare but someone will let one go eventually...

That's what we both hope for...

 

[blee1996]

Or adapt some large format lenses for them, like Super Angulon 90/6.8?

 

[xya]

Or adapt some large format lenses for them, like Super Angulon 90/6.8?

Good idea. Funny enough, that I did not think about it. I have a mofified 6x12 Holga with that lens https://www.oddcameras.com/holgamods_612_pan.htm and I have additional lenses in their mounts for the belair, which could be a good basis to start with. Thank you very much!

Any ideas for an even wider lens? The 65mm Angulon hardly covers 6x9. A Super-Angulon would not be adaptable because of its rear lens block...

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

No, I don't want to butcher the Belair... I do have a Super-Angulon, that I bought specifically for the TravelWide 4x5, but sadly the helical broke on it (I turned it into a pinhole).

 

[xya]

I wouldn't butcher the Belair either. I bought spare lenses years ago, in their Belair mounts. I would butcher one of these lenses only...

 

[blee1996]

Agree that I will also leave the Belair intact. But the Holga Pan 612 seems to be born to be hacked.

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

Agree that I will also leave the Belair intact. But the Holga Pan 612 seems to be born to be hacked.

I would hack it before the Belair, but if I did hack the Holga, it would lose it's Holga charm. Maybe I'll buy another body...

 

[blee1996]

I finally got a Belair X 6x12, as well as (gasp) the elusive Belairgon 114/8 glass lens! Ran a test roll recently, and this combo is as good as everyone claimed to be! Now that the lens is super good, the camera is compact and doing auto exposure well, I need to find some way to keep the film more flat.

Do you have any tricks or tips in keeping the film as flat as possible across the 10-12cm gate? Thank you!

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

I finally got a Belair X 6x12, as well as (gasp) the elusive Belairgon 114/8 glass lens! Ran a test roll recently, and this combo is as good as everyone claimed to be! Now that the lens is super good, the camera is compact and doing auto exposure well, I need to find some way to keep the film more flat.

Do you have any tricks or tips in keeping the film as flat as possible across the 10-12cm gate? Thank you!

My Belair fat rolls, which can affect sharpness (and can fog the film!). To counter that, I stuck a strip of weather stripping inside the camera at the film spool end and take up spool end. No more fat rolls.
One day I will find a Belairgon...

 

[xya]

I put a piece of foam into either side of the film compartment. Works like a charm. See https://www.plastikcam.com/lomo_belair.htm towards the bottom of the page.

Same for me, I want a Belairgon one day, the 90mm variant...

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

The 90 is also what I want...

 

[TheFlyingCamera]

I've been lucky enough to find both the 90 and the 117 back when they were merely uncommon on Ebay. I would never go back to the plastic lenses on the Belair now. I do have a spare Belair body I could sacrifice the front standard off of to graft it onto a HolgaPan, but I lack the skills/knowledge to get the flange-to-focal-plane distance right.

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

Because of the scarcity of these Belairgons, I can see myself fixing a 90mm LF lens...like an older Schneider... to a Holga Panarama body...

 

[xya]

Because of the scarcity of these Belairgons, I can see myself fixing a 90mm LF lens...like an older Schneider... to a Holga Panarama body...

I had one made by Holgamods on a Holga Pan body. Not convincing so much https://www.oddcameras.com/holgamods_612_pan.htm. I will try again with a more modern lens...

 

[xya]

I've been lucky enough to find both the 90 and the 117 back when they were merely uncommon on Ebay. I would never go back to the plastic lenses on the Belair now. I do have a spare Belair body I could sacrifice the front standard off of to graft it onto a HolgaPan, but I lack the skills/knowledge to get the flange-to-focal-plane distance right.

Lucky you. Would have cost me about $600 in Europe...

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

I had one made by Holgamods on a Holga Pan body. Not convincing so much https://www.oddcameras.com/holgamods_612_pan.htm. I will try again with a more modern lens.

What a coincidence! I was just viewing that website!