Heresy?

[davidst]

Hi, I'm new...love eveything photographica and B&W. Cameras, chemistry...adore it all.

The Quest...
After a huge move across Australia, and downsize which cost my darkroom, I want to start again with my 35mm, medium and large format stuff.

The Experiment...
So have been collecting odds and sods to start developing film.

Purchased secondhand (good old ebay to the rescue) a sima roller and a three spiral Johnson tank. Loaded some old films which have been in my Pentax 645, and a Voitlander Bessa II,for more than 4 years. And mixed up a cold 13deg centigrade, developer of Ilford LC29 @ 1:29, loaded the tank and started rolling. Rolled two films in the tank for 18 minutes...TMax 100iso and Agfa APX100iso; both 120format, old as hell! LC29 is new to me but single shot concentrate will help me for the time being.

Spiral loading was easy, even with very old and springy rolled films. Remembered the old methods quickly and especially to use VERY clean dry reels (hairdryer).

I want long dilute developing, hence the roller. Also want to work at ambient temp to avoid tooling around with temperature control. Stop, fix, washed with 5 minute roll of refreshed water, and final slow dunk in water with a splodge of hand detergent, and squeegee with fingers. Very hard water here in Adelaide, South Australia.

Results...
Not yet scanned and PS'd, but the negs look beaut. Very even smooth long tonal scale, near no grain, and detail in the shadows and highlights. No dichroic fog, or pink yuck from Tmax. No dry marks, a couple of film crimps though, luckily on end of roll.

All in all, the magic is still there for me, and a nice encouraging start again.

Hope to contribute a lot to the forum and APUG, and to help each other enjoy the wonderful world of photography, its art and science.

 

[Andy K]

Ditch the 'scan and PS' bit, and complete the process properly, and you'll be even happier!

Welcome to the forum!

 

[Jeff Kubach]

Hello from Richmond Va. I'm glad your back to processing your film, but like Andy said you'll be happier if you complete the process!

Jeff

 

[Joe Lipka]

Don't forget the hybrid photo forum which is specifically for folks here that develop film, scan and print digitally.

 

[Jeremy]

There are lots of us who go the hybrid route (for a variety of reasons) by shooting film and scanning, but Joe is right that those topics are for Apug's hybrid photo sister site.

Welcome!

 

[davidst]

Thanks for the welcome Andy, Jeff, Joe and Jeremy.

Yes, of course you are right. The scanner thing is really to see how they scan (new scanner Canon 8800F).

The darkroom thing was huge for me for 10 years, and an enormous number of chemicals...loved toners, Farmers Reducer, selenium and many developer brews. But I just can't bring myself (at the moment) to start a dark room again, and don't really have the space..

My plan is to produce perfect negs, and then have them printed on unsurpassable silver, as digital B&W just does not make it. Yes, have to find a fine printer and pay a fortune. I suppose this only makes me half a photographer, as printing is the most important part in B&W work. Perhaps I'm to be like an artist with a disability, can I rise through the ignominy of someone else printing for me????

 

[Sirius Glass]

davidst,

I went that route and I was unhappy with the results and the cost. I was cheaper, more fun and I had better results setting up a darkroom.

Good luck with that.

Steve

 

[Rick A]

Dont stop there!!!!! Complete the process!!!!!! Nothing can compare with REAL PRINTS on PHOTO PAPER!!!!!! Silver is the ULTIMATE display medium -- no scaned and ink can come close to the real thing, plus there is the satisfaction(and frustration) of putting in the hours in the darkroom tweaking a great neg into a perfect finished print!!!!!! If you get the sense that I am yelling at you, I AM!!!!!!!!! Stick with tradition please.
Rick
ps: Welcome back to the real world!

 

[davidst]

Hi Rainphot and Sirius Glass

Sirius what exactly were you unhappy with going this route?? Forewarned is forearmed..
Resulting prints just didn't turn out as you previsualised?

 

[eddym]

davidst,

I went that route and I was unhappy with the results and the cost. I was cheaper, more fun and I had better results setting up a darkroom.

Good luck with that.

Steve

Ditto on that. I spent several years, thousands of dollars on printers, ink, paper, programs, profiles, etc., etc., until at last I realized how much easier it was to just walk into my darkroom and make prints - and how much more enjoyable. Nothing that I ever printed with an Epson ever came close to my worst print on Ilford Galerie.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Hi Rainphot and Sirius Glass

Sirius what exactly were you unhappy with going this route?? Forewarned is forearmed..
Resulting prints just didn't turn out as you previsualised?

1) The cost. The ink was expensive and the printers ran through the cartriages like a college fraternity through a beer keg.

2) The results. Using the best inks and the best paper, it still never had the look of a optical-chemical print.

Steve

 

[Wyno]

Hi David,
welcome to the forum.
There's a guy in Adelaide who used to be a member here but now only goes on the Large format photography website called Steve Nicholls. He has posted some of his work on that site and it is very good. You might want to contact him and see if he would be willing to help you out.
Every now and then we have a get together. The last one was a few weeks ago in Melbourne for the Apuggers living in or near Melbourne, but we had one a few years ago that we held at the Grampians. Steve came from Adelaide with his wife and Graeme Hird drove over from Kalgoorlie. It looks like we might have to organise one in Adelaide as there are a few members there.
cheers
Mike

 

[wogster]

Ditch the 'scan and PS' bit, and complete the process properly, and you'll be even happier!

Welcome to the forum!

Not everyone can print their results, for me it would take an hour to set up the enlarger and everything else, the only room suitable is the kitchen which is the only way from one end of the house to the other, so I need to make sure that nobody else is home, Completing the process digitally is the only option for a lot of people.

 

[wogster]

There are lots of us who go the hybrid route (for a variety of reasons) by shooting film and scanning, but Joe is right that those topics are for Apug's hybrid photo sister site.

Welcome!

That would be an option, but sometimes I wonder if anybody actually goes there. Sometimes you can look at some of the areas and see the last posting was weeks or months ago. The last posting in the darkroom forum for example was November 25, so over 6 months ago.....

 

[gainer]

We also have the problem that conveying visual information about photos to APUG pretty well has to be by digital means. Even audio signals are likely to be digitized somewhere along the line.

 

[steven_e007]

Most people who print digitally do so on printers which are limited to A4 - so about 10 X 8 ish if you like. A3 printers are a huge step up in purchase price, running costs and space.

I used to have a book about setting up your own darkroom. It was a 1950s thing, with some ingenious ideas in it for 'temporary darkrooms'. If limiting yourself to A4 / 10 X 8 then you can create a viable 'darkroom' in very little space. There were photographs of unfoldable wet benches that fitted over the bath, darkrooms in closets and 'cupboards under the stairs' with the dishes mounted above each other and small set-ups in tiny garden sheds. In those days you had to get around the space problem somehow if you wanted to print - and it could be done. Where there is a will there is a way!

Alas, these days it is all too easy to say 'Darn it, I haven't got a spare 12 foot by 18 foot room with running water and no windows... oh, I'll sit here behind the computer instead'

Just like I'm doing now, when I should be putting the results of last nights developing session into negative envelopes before they get dusty...

 

[Aurum]

I use hybrid workflow at present whilst I'm trying to get an enlarger that will handle 120 film shot at 6x9.
As a way of seeing what you have shot, and sorting the duds from the keepers, a scanner does have its plus points.
You can then use proper paper and chemicals to print the stuff thats worth it

 

[davidst]

Hi Mike
I'd be interested in catching up for a session. Perhaps an outing into the Adelaide Hills, some pics over the City. Some Hysen type tree photography??Cheers Dave S

 

[davidst]

Steve,
I'm not one for tiny cramped make-do darkrooms. Balancing trays on washing machines. Some people do it, I know, but the dark room has to be something inspiring for me. It's either something proper with good wet areas, and easy work flow, or probably nothing.


There is also the option of hiring dark rooms. The O'Halloran Hill TAFE, here in SAust, evidently hires its dark room. Also when I was at Uni the dark room was always available. I think that's the go. I used to let people use my dark room, so I'm sure I can find something out there.

Cheers

 

[davidst]

I use hybrid workflow at present whilst I'm trying to get an enlarger that will handle 120 film shot at 6x9.
As a way of seeing what you have shot, and sorting the duds from the keepers, a scanner does have its plus points.
You can then use proper paper and chemicals to print the stuff thats worth it

That's a pretty tricky size film to find an enlarger for. Let us know how you get on.

 

[Ian David]

I use hybrid workflow at present whilst I'm trying to get an enlarger that will handle 120 film shot at 6x9.

I would recommend a DeVere 504 with glass negative holder. There were a few of these machines floating around in the UK when I left a couple of years ago (after I snaffled one myself) - more casualties of closing-down darkrooms. They are built like tanks so not a bad item to own. Big enough for 5x4, so will do 6x12cm too.

Ian

 

[Aurum]

I would recommend a DeVere 504 with glass negative holder. There were a few of these machines floating around in the UK when I left a couple of years ago (after I snaffled one myself) - more casualties of closing-down darkrooms. They are built like tanks so not a bad item to own. Big enough for 5x4, so will do 6x12cm too.

Ian

I have seen one or two enlargers on ebay, but they are the full-on size of a house jobs that have to be bolted to a wall and take three people and a box luton van to shift. They also went for quite princely sums as well.

It does puzzle me why 6x9 enlargers are so rare as it is a format that is very popular. Certainly for cameras manufactured from the turn of the last century up to the 50's..
presumably contact printing was the key for these
I might get my DIY tools out and start building my own. Once I get past the neg carrier and optics holder, illumination could be easily handled with a LED array for not too much money

 

[Chazzy]

6x9 enlargers by Beseler are relatively common here in the USA. Maybe with a little searching you will find a Beseler over there.