Heresy--adding grain to digital images

jtk · Jul 2, 2022

Note that Pentax K70, when it is set to make its HDR files actually makes and blends 3 exposures... click click click. The end result is literally one larger file. Conceptually similar to dye transfer printing but done in-camera.

One of the alternative K70 versions is theatric, another might be ideal for catalog/website that wants white backgrounds with full conventional tonality. And of course the normal Auto file print wonderfully thanks to NIK and PS.

jtk · Jul 3, 2022

How do you distinguish your version of fake grain ('add grain") and everybody else's fake grain?

Do you presume that viewers peek at your pixels when prints are large?

The finest Cone prints I've seen have been gigantic, with zero grain.

Its unfair to mention Cone as if it's an enlarging service.

Why not learn to print color at home?

Pieter12 · Jul 3, 2022

jtk said:
How do you distinguish your version of fake grain ('add grain") and everybody else's fake grain?

Do you presume that viewers peek at your pixels when prints are large?

The finest Cone prints I've seen have been gigantic, with zero grain.

Its unfair to mention Cone as if it's an enlarging service.

Why not learn to print color at home?

"My" version of fake grain its whatever looks like film grain or dye clouds to me. I don't give a rat's ass about anyone else's. Whatever floats their boat.

I am not sure why you think I refer to Cone editions as an enlarging service. They are digital printers with a process they have developed that produces very good black and white prints. They may do color as well, I haven't looked into that. Any grain in the prints they have made for me is something I have introduced, not them.

Are you referring to analog color for home printing or digital? I make digital prints at home. I am leery of outsourcing color since I have pretty much calibrated my monitor and printer and know how the prints will turn out. Getting color right from a third party can be a dicey and expensive endeavor when making prints over 20x30.

Analog color printing has too many variables to deal with as compared to digital--at least for me at the moment. And I have zero interest in shooting analog and scanning to print digital, either black and white or color.

jtk · Jul 3, 2022

I don't understand how Cone came up in this thread, the purpose of which was to address how to produce fake grain.

It's fine with me anyone wants "grain", fake or real. It ain't talmudic. Me, years ago I did point-source enlargement and I've never liked grain softening (e.g. d 23) and I've always avoided enlargers with diffusion sources. My go-to B&W film developer is Rodinal 1+50. I've developed literally thousands of rolls of Ektachrome and do understand dye clouds as well as giant images (projections).

Different strokes.

Pieter12 · Jul 3, 2022

jtk said:
I don't understand how Cone came up in this thread, the purpose of which was to address how to produce fake grain.

It's fine with me anyone wants "grain", fake or real. It ain't talmudic. Me, years ago I did point-source enlargement and I've never liked grain softening (e.g. d 23) and I've always avoided enlargers with diffusion sources. My go-to B&W film developer is Rodinal 1+50. I've developed literally thousands of rolls of Ektachrome and do understand dye clouds as well as giant images (projections).

Different strokes.

Cone Editions came up when you lead the discussion to paper types. I cited Cone because I had used their service with Hahnemuhle paper.

I only process B&W film in Rodinal and use a condenser enlarger, so grain is part of what I like and expect in a print. Thus the attempt to get something similar in adigtial file intended for inkjet printing.

jtk · Jul 4, 2022

Pieter12 said:
Cone Editions came up when you lead the discussion to paper types. I cited Cone because I had used their service with Hahnemuhle paper.

I only process B&W film in Rodinal and use a condenser enlarger, so grain is part of what I like and expect in a print. Thus the attempt to get something similar in adigtial file intended for inkjet printing.

I don't understand why someone who likes Rodinal/condenser would want something less authentic when switching to inkjet. Inkjet isn't naturally grainy...closest inspection doesn't reveal grain or dye clouds, it reveals inkjet dot patterns (assuming the paper is inclined to high-enough detail resolution).

Pieter12 · Jul 4, 2022

jtk said:
I don't understand why someone who likes Rodinal/condenser would want something less authentic when switching to inkjet. Inkjet isn't naturally grainy...closest inspection doesn't reveal grain or dye clouds, it reveals inkjet dot patterns (assuming the paper is inclined to high-enough detail resolution).

What I want is consistency. My darkroom prints have grain. I would like my inkjet prints (at this point confined to color) to have grain (well, dye clouds), too. Thus the topic posted about adding grain to digital files.

wiltw · Jul 4, 2022

Next thing we know, someone will have developed the look of painting with oil paints, but using acrylic paints!

Or simulate the noise seen in early dSLRs (vintage 1995-2004) in mirrorless images.

Pieter12 · Jul 4, 2022

wiltw said:
Next thing we know, someone will have developed the look of painting with oil paints, but using acrylic paints!

Will the treachery ever cease?

Chuck1 · Jul 4, 2022

Dunk the computer in warm water, then cold water

Pieter12 · Jul 4, 2022

Seems like that would cause reticulation, not grain.

grat · Aug 27, 2022

Not to mention a Deep Purple song.

Pieter12 · Aug 27, 2022

wiltw said:
Next thing we know, someone will have developed the look of painting with oil paints, but using acrylic paints!

I dare you to be able to tell if a painting has been done with acrylic, alkyd or oil from casual inspection.

Heresy--adding grain to digital images

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