Help with 617 buying

luvcameras · Sep 12, 2005

After researching all the 617 cameras out there - I think the Art Panorama is the probably the best out there for me ( focuses close etc ) but used for $ 2000-2500 is steep and they only come up for sale rarely.

What do you all think about buying a Da Yi 617 back ( $ 550 ) for 4x5...buying a Calumet 540 4x5 monorail camera ( $ 160 ) and a Fujinon 125mm 5.6 with about 204 image circle ( $ 350 )..

Since I will only shoot ocassionaly - I dont mind the set up or weight...Total cost would be about $ 1100.....versus spending $ 1900-2100 on a Fuji 617 with a 105F8 and no movements and it doesnt focus close...

thanks

Dan

John Cook · Sep 12, 2005

I owned a Linhof for a while. Nicely made. Huge price tag.

But absolutely worthless without a rising/falling front.

It was impossible to frame up a shot and simultaneously keep the camera level. Thus, intolerable distortion. Buildings and trees leaning all over the place. Nothing in the entire frame was plumb.

So I sold it at a huge loss.

I now use a view camera (with movements) and crop accordingly for panorama format. Either sheet film or roll film back work well.

steve simmons · Sep 12, 2005

You can not put a 6x17 back on a 4x5. The 4x5 will only accept a 6x12 back.

Do you know about the Fotoman 6x17 camera. View Camera did an article about them a couple of issues ago.

steve simmons

Ole · Sep 12, 2005

The Da Yi back is an extension back, made for 4x5" cameras. Which of course limits the choise of lenses, and especially makes it difficult if not impossible to use extreme wide angles.

Tom Hoskinson · Sep 12, 2005

steve simmons said:
You can not put a 6x17 back on a 4x5. The 4x5 will only accept a 6x12 back...

Steve simmons

Not true. The DA YI 6x17 roll film back fits 4x5 cameras whick have Graflock (or Graflock-like) backs. I own one. Included as part of the DA YI 6x17 package is an extension back and 6x17 ground glass.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7544780326&rd=1&sspagename=STRK:MEWA:IT&rd=1

larrymendenhall · Sep 12, 2005

The Dayi 6x17 back is a functional entry into 6x17 format, particularly if you already own a 4x5 and don't mind the restricted selection of lenses.

They work on 4x5 because the back on the film holder is extended, kind of like the 5x7 extension back for the Tachihara 4x5. The View Camera issue from Sept./Oct. 2004 has a great article by Kerry Thalman about the back. Try and get a copy of that if you can.

The set-up you describe should work fine if the camera you mention will accept Graflok (sp?) backs.

There are 2 downsides. Because of the extended back, the Dayi is severely limited in the range of lenses it can use. I'm having a bit of trouble finding one around 90 to 105 that's in my price range for my Ebony RW45. It's also a weight/space hog because it also comes with a viewfinder.

Functionally, they work as designed and are pretty robust and simple to use. I like mine, but have considered replacing it with a 6x12 back instead because of the lens and space issues. Steve Simmon's suggestion about the Fotoman camera is also a good one.

Good luck!

David A. Goldfarb · Sep 12, 2005

Steve, there was a good review of the Shen Hao 6x17 back for 4x5" cameras by Kerry Thalmann in a magazine, I think, called _View Camera_ ... ah yes, the Sept-Oct 2004 issue if I'm not mistaken. You should subscribe. There are also a lot of useful free articles on their website too, if you're new to large format photography.

Kidding aside, Dan--a few of us have posted about the Shen Hao, DaYi, and KangTai 617 backs for 4x5" here and on the forum at lfphoto.info, so a search should turn up a few relevant threads. They have their advantages and disadvantages, but I think they're a great way to get into 6x17, and the DaYi back on a 4x5" camera makes for a very versatile system.

j_landecker · Sep 12, 2005

David A. Goldfarb said:
Steve, there was a good review of the Shen Hao 6x17 back for 4x5" cameras by Kerry Thalmann in a magazine, I think, called _View Camera_ ... ah yes, the Sept-Oct 2004 issue if I'm not mistaken. You should subscribe. There are also a lot of useful free articles on their website too, if you're new to large format photography.

Dan, what focal length(s) are you planning on using?

Since the Da Yi back offsets the film plane about 40mm behind its mounting surface, that only gives you about 60mm from the Graflok back to the lensboard of a 90mm lens. This will give you very scrunched-up bellows which will be hard to get any movements out of. Keep this in mind when you're looking for a camera for the back to go onto, and look for something that will take short lenses and a bag bellows. If you're not concerned about movements, something like a Crown Graphic will work with a 90mm lens.

Jim

luvcameras · Sep 12, 2005

thinking about using a Fujinon 125mm 5.6

mark · Sep 12, 2005

David A. Goldfarb said:
Steve, there was a good review of the Shen Hao 6x17 back for 4x5" cameras by Kerry Thalmann in a magazine, I think, called _View Camera_ ... ah yes, the Sept-Oct 2004 issue if I'm not mistaken. You should subscribe. There are also a lot of useful free articles on their website too, if you're new to large format photography.

ooohhhh that stings

Dave Parker · Sep 12, 2005

mark said:
ooohhhh that stings

Be nice Mark, Steve has had a bad year, at least from the feedback I read!

Dave

Donsta · Sep 12, 2005

There are some other options:

1. There's a very nice 617 camera which was made a while ago by a well known photographer by the name of Chett Hanchett. It was basically a monorail with a 6X17 back. No rear movements, but full front movements. I owned one for a time - it's a very functional camera and seemed to hold film perfectly flat.

2. If you really want to do 6X17, I'd suggest you consider a Walker XL 5X7 with a Canham 6X17 back - a very nice functional outfit.

Like others here, I found a lack of movements with the Fuji G617 I had to be very limiting.

Tom Hoskinson · Sep 12, 2005

luvcameras said:
thinking about using a Fujinon 125mm 5.6

Sweet lens! I just got one (125mm EBC coated f5.6 Fujinon W). Haven't developed anything taken with it yet...

ddolde · Sep 12, 2005

steve simmons said:
You can not put a 6x17 back on a 4x5. The 4x5 will only accept a 6x12 back.

steve simmons

Absolutely wrong. Shen Hao and Dayi both make 617 backs for a universal 4x5 mount.

kjsphoto · Sep 13, 2005

I used to own the Linhof 617 and it is very expensive especially if you want lenses. I ended up selling it for a Canham with a 617 back. Best thing I ever did. Unless you are extremely rich do not buy the Linhof. If you have $10K to blow on the camera and two lenses it is a nice camera but I really prefer the LF camera with the back as I have control over the movements.

I would really look at the Canham with a 617 back; both are just extremely well made.

Kev

Early Riser · Sep 13, 2005

kjsphoto said:
I used to own the Linhof 617 and it is very expensive especially if you want lenses. I ended up selling it for a Canham with a 617 back. Best thing I ever did. Unless you are extremely rich do not buy the Linhof. If you have $10K to blow on the camera and two lenses it is a nice camera but I really prefer the LF camera with the back as I have control over the movements.

I would really look at the Canham with a 617 back; both are just extremely well made.

Kev

My Canham DLC45 tends to tilt out of focus with a Sinar zoom back, it would seem to me that this could be a problem even with the 5x7 Canham and a 6x17 back. Is the camera rigid enough, the back light enough?

I have a fuji gx617 system, and I don't find the lack of movements a problem too often, then again I tend to shoot with the 180mm and 300mm lenses and less often with the 105mm and find that movements are far less critical with tele type shots.

If you want a 6x17 that is capable and affordable, the Fotoman is a great deal.

claytume · Sep 13, 2005

I have a Fuji 617 and find the lack of rise and fall the major defect of this system. Horsemans new SW617 has fixed that problem and has interchangeable backs too!

Clayton

scootermm · Sep 14, 2005

steve simmons said:
You can not put a 6x17 back on a 4x5. The 4x5 will only accept a 6x12 back.

Do you know about the Fotoman 6x17 camera. View Camera did an article about them a couple of issues ago.

steve simmons

arent you the editor of a magazine that just did a review of the Dayi 617 back?

Eric Jones · Sep 14, 2005

The Horseman SW617 looks very promising but release date and pricing still seem pretty tentative. I have bad luck though, manufacturers always seem to announce something I would really purchase but then they fail to deliver and it disappears into obscurity. So, I must say that I'm not interested in the Horseman SW617, at all.

But here is a link if others are interested:

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