Help! Lab ruined films. What to do?

pbromaghin · May 17, 2017

5 rolls of Portra and Ektar in 120 got stuck in the drier, resulting in a jumbled up knot. Kinks, tears, lifted emulsion. They re-soaked the whole mess and got them separated, so about 25-30% is in reasonably good shape.

Most of the rest of it has intact images but is all bent up and kinked. I don't know how much of those kinks are actual damage that will show up when scanned or projected and how much is simply a bend. It certainly will not lay flat in a film holder to do the projecting or scanning.

My question is, will it work to re-soak again and make another try at flattening it somehow? If so, how long to soak? In water and photoflo? How to flatten?

Oh, well. It was a good vacation, anyway. I still have the b/w.

Sirius Glass · May 17, 2017

I am so sorry to hear about what happened to your film.

pbromaghin · May 18, 2017

Thanks for the kind thoughts, Sirius.

railwayman3 · May 18, 2017

Sympathy. And it's even more frustrating when you've put time and money into trying to get good pictures and you trust a lab thinking that know what they are doing! Years ago I had two wedding C-41 films "lost" by a so-called "professional lab" and holiday Kodachromes damaged by the then Kodak UK lab. At least you still have the B&W.....

On your actual question...if the film base is really bent and kinked (as suggested by the fact that it will not lay flat in a film holder), I believe it may be very difficult to get the creases out. You could try leaving it for some time under some weight in a book or press; I'm less sure about resoaking (softening the emulsion which may already be damaged)....????

I hope that the lab is providing you with, at least some, compensation.

bdial · May 18, 2017

If they are cut, I'd try putting them in sleeves then weighting them under some books or a cool dry mount press or whatever. I had that happen to an uncut roll and had some success hanging it for a few days without soaking. If you soak them I believe you'll need to run them through a stabilizer bath so that they don't start growing things in a few years.
Hopefully the lab offered replacement rolls (not that it helps much for the one-chance images).

Jim Noel · May 18, 2017

First step, find another lab, or develop them yourself.

Huss · May 18, 2017

Sorry for your loss. Any chance in letting us know what lab did this?

MattKing · May 18, 2017

I'm sorry about your loss, and I hope you can salvage as much as possible.
I'm going to (sort of) defend the lab (maybe).
Things do sometimes go wrong in life - equipment fails, otherwise careful people make mistakes, power goes out, etc.
Does this damage appear to you to be the result of mishap or the result of carelessness??
Does the lab otherwise appear to take care when they handle your films?
Have they treated you with respect and been communicative about this problem?
Have they done good work for you before, and do they offer services that you would like to receive in the future?
Are they pleasant to deal with?
Are they convenient for you?
I ask all these questions, because I've worked in labs and know that, even with the greatest amount of knowledgeable care, stuff can go wrong!

pbromaghin · May 18, 2017

Thanks all for the tips. I didn't think about another soak encouraging bacterial growth. Dry-pressing them in sleeves seems to be the first thing to try.

As to the lab, it was the Mike's Camera Park Meadows store. They are about the biggest (or only) independent photo chain remaining in Colorado. This store is very convenient for me, just a couple miles from work and easy to drop by during lunch. They have been as good about this as they could be, very apologetic and admitting their own error. They gave me new film and free processing plus a 16x20 print when I want one.

They do C-41 in the store and send E6 and B&W to their central lab in Boulder. I've been going there for several years with good service and the occasional screw up, mainly having to do with paperwork or temporary misplacement - never anything like this. However, when I told my wife it was time to start doing my own C-41 she said "Good! You complain about them all the time." .Until Christmas, I was without scanning capability for a couple years and my main complaint has been that their scans are ALWAYS over exposed with highlights blown out but generally salvageable in PhotoShop.

Cholentpot · May 18, 2017

I sent a roll of Portra 400 that was in an Olympus Pen EEIII for almost a year for a project. 72 shots. I figured the lab would do a better job than I've been doing with expired kits and janky temperatures. They screwed it up.

I feel your pain.

Huss · May 22, 2017

pbromaghin said:
...Until Christmas, I was without scanning capability for a couple years and my main complaint has been that their scans are ALWAYS over exposed with highlights blown out but generally salvageable in PhotoShop.

If you happen to own such a thing as a 'digital camera' there is an active thread of rangefinderforum.com about scanning with it.

darkosaric · May 22, 2017

Develop yourself is the only true worry free way.

pbromaghin · May 22, 2017

Huss said:
If you happen to own such a thing as a 'digital camera' there is an active thread of rangefinderforum.com about scanning with it.

Thanks, but I finally replaced my dead computer and my wife gave me a good scanner for Christmas. I'm slowly working through the last few years of negatives, including the ones they already scanned.

pbromaghin · May 22, 2017

darkosaric said:
Develop yourself is the only true worry free way.

Yup. It sure looks that way.

trendland · May 22, 2017

First noticed : what could be wrong with
your lab? What failure could be as strange in your lab that it ruined your films?
Terrible is it the darkroom lighting?
Then as I opened this tread - I noticed :
Ahh - a comercial lab ruined your films !

That is not good - but there we have
simple the reason- you want not to know
what I have heard from lab insiders
(wistleblowers) so have you decided to have your own lab ?

This failures you will have in your own
darkroom are your own failures - you can
learn about.
The failures of others are with no profit to anybody.Because the responcibility is
ALLWAYS at yours - Because it is your
Film of personaly importance.
Never mind If they will say :
We're so sorry Sir about your films ......?
I feel sorry too.
Start your own film lab !

with regards

nosmok · May 23, 2017

If your negatives aren't kinked, a couple of weeks under a stack of 6 heavy books should flatten them out all right. I shoot a lot of expired film, and some of it curls any which way it can. In a few cases they won't STAY flat after the book treatment, but I can get even the worst into a film holder for as long as it takes to scan. Caveats:1) make sure the negs are dry to start; 2) having said that, don't dry them in a bone-dry area- about 15% relative humidity is good.

Sorry this happened to you.

pentaxpete · May 23, 2017

Years ago I was doing Weddings and one day I got home and was having a tea having dropped off C41 Ektacolor to lab in Barking Essex ( England) when i got a phone call -- " can you go back to that wedding a retake it? Unfortunatly your three films were all fogged to light" -- well of course the wedding was OVER.
What had happened a Junior they took on switched on the light just as a everyone's films were coming out of the developer in the 'Dip and Dunk'machine and when i got the negs they were black -- I had to do some B&W prints FREE for the couple but they were very understanding ----

jernejk · May 23, 2017

I remember a candid camera from almost 30 years ago... they set it up in a photo lab. When a customer brought in films to be processed, the lady would quickly change the canister, then unroll it in plain daylight saying "uh oh, but this film is empty, there's nothing on it".

Some customers were ignorant and surprised it was empty, but the others.. oh man..

Sirius Glass · May 23, 2017

I worked for Baker's Photo in Washington DC in the late 1960's. Mrs. Baker would told us that when people have a large number of rolls from a vacation or a big event that we were never allowed to have all the film processed in one batch or even in one day. We were directed to tell the customer that we would split up the film into several groups to be sent in separately and to tell the customers why.

jeffreyg · May 23, 2017

If you are looking to try a different lab, i've been using Denver Digital Imaging Center division of The Slideprinter through the mail for E6 processing. They also do C41. So far no problems. If some important negatives have creases that would affect a print, you might be able to correct and print digitally or correct and transfer to a disc or flash drive and have a lab print made.

http://www.jeffreyglasser.com/

trendland · May 23, 2017

Sirius Glass said:
I worked for Baker's Photo in Washington DC in the late 1960's. Mrs. Baker would told us that when people have a large number of rolls from a vacation or a big event that we were never allowed to have all the film processed in one batch or even in one day. We were directed to tell the customer that we would split up the film into several groups to be sent in separately and to tell the customers why.

Well Sirius Glass - Mrs.Backer (it seams so) was a wise lady - wasn't she?
But how terrible is wisdom when it brings
no profit to the wise ?
Just look above.

When I went back from Paris 2004 with
around 50 films (only 2 days).....
guess how long it has done to have all films in lab ?
One 220 Fuji Precisa came back from a
lab with a shied of paper with notes -
they are not able to develope this film !!! So I have a declaration in writing from
one lab that they are unable just to try
doing their simple work (220 Film).

THE managing director stated full of unbelief :" I have to call call the lab imediatly " Please wait a second"
I was not waiting for the call.
I stated : NO Problem at all - it's just fine.
Because I got it back - my undeveloped
220 roll - and I would not have had proved their unability in E6 process.

........

with regards

Arklatexian · May 23, 2017

trendland said:
First noticed : what could be wrong with
your lab? What failure could be as strange in your lab that it ruined your films?
Terrible is it the darkroom lighting?
Then as I opened this tread - I noticed :
Ahh - a comercial lab ruined your films !

That is not good - but there we have
simple the reason- you want not to know
what I have heard from lab insiders
(wistleblowers) so have you decided to have your own lab ?

This failures you will have in your own
darkroom are your own failures - you can
learn about.
The failures of others are with no profit to anybody.Because the responcibility is
ALLWAYS at yours - Because it is your
Film of personaly importance.
Never mind If they will say :
We're so sorry Sir about your films ......?
I feel sorry too.
Start your own film lab !

with regards

When I worked in a camera store, years ago, we had a pastor bring in some Ektachrome 35mm film for processing that he had shot in the Holy Land. We wanted to send the film to Kodak Processing but they charged more than the independent lab that we also used for Ektachrome and he wanted to save money. When his film came back everything was ruined. Lightening had hit a transformer just outside the lab and it burnt out all of the lab motors. He hit the ceiling. The lab replaced all the film and offered free processing. He talked about taking us and the lab to court until his lawyer read the fine print that protected everyone in case such a thing happened. Oh and the pastor was having none of that "Act of God" business, no way! Naturally we lost him as a customer. BUT I will guarantee that things can happen to a commercial lab over which they have NO control, no matter how diligent and smart the people who work there are..........Regards!

GRHazelton · May 24, 2017

Back in the day I left several C 41 cassettes with a local lab. I accidentally included one E 6 cassette with the order. You can see where this is going...the "lab" ran all through the C 41 line with terrible results for the lone and lorn E 6. When I mentioned the problem they refused to give me replacement film and hinted darkly that I might have contaminated their processing line. I let it go since I was the Regional Library Director in that city and the "lab" was owned by the owner/publisher of the local "newspaper" and the local radio station who was a difficult person, to put it mildly. The politics of an unfettered response to the dolts at the mini lab would have been problematical....

The films were personal shots, so I wasn't out any money nor were clients let down. As one who's done weddings, etc, professionally I can well imagine the horror of such malfeasance had I been shooting for a client.

pentaxuser · May 24, 2017

Sounds like a difficult place in which to exercise your rights, GR. I hope things are better now. Maybe someone in a fit of depression wished he'd never been born and the town became Pottersville instead of Bedford Falls

pentaxuser

Agulliver · May 24, 2017

This is why some labs offer two levels of service....one for amateurs where the limit of their responsibility is to offer free film and processing in case of disaster....and a more expensive pro option where they will compensate for lost photos.

In all my 39 years of photography I've never had a 35mm, 120 or 110 film go truly bad at the lab though my last C41 at Boots in Luton was pretty poor. I did have one super 8 Tri-X half ruined by Andec, who were very kind enough to send me the original film (about half of it was salvaged), a replacement and free processing. It wasn't important anyway, just filming work colleagues doing science experiments in a school.

Even a well run lab with staff who care and know what they are doing can have a power failure, or machine fault despite regular maintenance. Stuff happens....I guess we all hope things go well every time we drop off a roll/cartridge/spool.

mrosenlof · May 24, 2017

darkosaric said:
Develop yourself is the only true worry free way.

Well, if you are truly an error-free person! Me? *mostly* error free in the darkroom.

It's rare, but happens. You could give Denver Pro Photo a call (they're in Littleton now) and see if there is a Pro Lab down in your area, but in truth, Mike's is probably nearly identical in reliability, and it doesn't help with the damage already done.

AgX · May 24, 2017

darkosaric said:
Develop yourself is the only true worry free way.

Well, I rather screw up things myself, than to fume about others.

Sirius Glass · May 24, 2017

AgX said:
Well, I rather screw up things myself, than to fume about others.

+1

Helinophoto · May 24, 2017

Well, it's happened, time to focus on how to salvage stuff.
On the bright side, your photos weren't exposed to light, so they should be developed well.
If you can flatten them so you can scan them, then you are halfway.

Some shots will be lost if they are too creased up and kinked, however, you will be amazed how much cr@p it is possible to get rid off by churning a mucked-up negative trough Photoshop. The healing tool (not the clone tool) and content aware deletion of selections do a marvelous job in reconstructing large parts of an otherwise lost image.

So don't fret, with some time and patience, there should be a good possibility to recover a great deal of the shots that were considered lost in the past.

......I have not seen the state of your negatives off course, so these are general thoughts.

If you are not familiar or savvy in PS, try to get help from someone who are (or even ask at the lab, I am sure there are some dudes there that know their way around PS and that should IMO help you out, seeing they ruined your film, even if accidentally).

Help! Lab ruined films. What to do?

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