Health effects of Pyro?

SPS731 · Jul 31, 2007

I have not used any of the Pyro developer formulas, but I keep reading about the wonderful large format negatives it produces. I am a little hesitant to experiment with it because I've heard it is very toxic.

Does it really produce superior images? What precautions should I take to use it safely?

Thanks!

k_jupiter · Jul 31, 2007

SPS731 said:
I have not used any of the Pyro developer formulas, but I keep reading about the wonderful large format negatives it produces. I am a little hesitant to experiment with it because I've heard it is very toxic.

Does it really produce superior images? What precautions should I take to use it safely?

Thanks!

Yes.

Don't use it without latex gloves if it worries you in the least. Don't mix it from raw powdered chemicals without a chemical mask.

Do I?

No. I use the solutions offered by http://www.photoformulary.com/. I don't sweat the small stuff, I wash my hands after using any chemical.

Try Wimberleys Wd2d+, Try PyroCatHD. Both amazing solutions for well exposed negatives. I use the Wd2d+ on Iso 100 4x5 films, I use the PyroCatHD on most other sheet films.

tim in sanjose

SPS731 · Jul 31, 2007

Thanks Tim. How consistent are the negatives? Is the staining effect consistant, or does it vary with each processing run?

Early Riser · Jul 31, 2007

k_jupiter said:
Yes.

Don't use it without latex gloves if it worries you in the least. Don't mix it from raw powdered chemicals without a chemical mask.

Actually latex gloves are porous to some chemistry, including selenium toner, you need Nitrile gloves if you want to be safe.

jovo · Jul 31, 2007

This has been discussed at great length on apug and the LF forum. Here's a link:

(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

SPS731 · Jul 31, 2007

jovo said:
This has been discussed at great length on apug and the LF forum. Here's a link:

(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

Thanks, it is a good info thread.

Stephanie Brim · Jul 31, 2007

Being pregnant, I'm more worried about this than normal. I wear gloves when using Diafine and Rodinal now. Could I use Pyro or should I stay away until after the baby's born? I highly doubt I'll run the risk, though.

Mustafa Umut Sarac · Jul 31, 2007

Dont risk the baby , use digital camera until your baby born .

Michel Hardy-Vallée · Jul 31, 2007

Note that hydroquinone, a very common compound of developer solutions, has a toxicity in the same range as pyro. When in dust form, these two compounds can have real bad health effects if absorbed.

k_jupiter · Jul 31, 2007

Stephanie Brim said:
Being pregnant, I'm more worried about this than normal. I wear gloves when using Diafine and Rodinal now. Could I use Pyro or should I stay away until after the baby's born? I highly doubt I'll run the risk, though.

That's a different story. Use common sense. Don't drink alcohol, don't play with fire arms, don't change the kitty litter box, don't put your hands in any chemicals. Have a great pregnancy, come back when you are finished nursing.

tim in san jose

Tom Hoskinson · Jul 31, 2007

Stephanie Brim said:
Being pregnant, I'm more worried about this than normal. I wear gloves when using Diafine and Rodinal now. Could I use Pyro or should I stay away until after the baby's born? I highly doubt I'll run the risk, though.

Safest to stay away from all developing chemicals (with the possible exceptions of Vitamin C and Instant Coffee) until after the baby is born.

Also, don't use latex gloves. Latex-Free disposable Nitrile gloves give better skin protection and avoid latex sensitivity problems.

Stephanie Brim · Jul 31, 2007

I use nitrile gloves. I'm thinking of switching to nitrile under a pair of good cleaning gloves for good measure. I'm wanting to be very, very careful. I don't mix powder chemicals (Adam does that), I don't mix my fixer to working solution (Adam does that, too), and the only thing I'll mix on my own now is Rodinal, but that's because it's one shot and Adam isn't always there when I go about my developing. I'm not wearing a mask, but there's a large window in our bathroom that's open while I develop, and I leave the door open as well. The only time I have the door closed is when I'm putting the film in the tanks.

I'm also rethinking printing while I'm still pregnant. I think that good ventilation is key here as well, and that I'll have. I could always get a mask or develop in tubes to limit my exposure to the chemicals.

I think I've limited my exposure enough that I don't have to be worried, but Pyro is out and toning is out. That's now obvious.

Oh, and so far this baby is perfectly healthy, or so the doctor tells me. It keeps telling me, too, by kicking me every so often HARD in the stomach. Moves more than I do, this kid. I'm loving the experience, but someone should tell him/her that he/she doesn't need to kick quite THAT hard.

Chris Breitenstein · Jul 31, 2007

unless you plan on drinking or inhaling Pyro all the health risks can be avoided by wearing Nitrile gloves. As far as a "superior" image is concerned it's not a silver bullet. You still need to be very precise with exposure and development. Run some film through it and if you like it use it. I use ABC I know of many photographers using Pyrocat hd. As far as PMk is concerned the stain really dose nothing but add base fog, because it doesn't stain proportionally.

Test it and see if you like it.

Yours;

Jim Noel · Jul 31, 2007

Stephanie,
I recommend that my students and my daughters who are pregnant follow this regimen.
1. No mixing of chemicals
2. Wear good nitrile gloves
3. Wear a respirator while in the darkroom
4. Work only with excellent ventilation

Some may say this is overkill - but rather that than damaging a baby. So far none of the mothers or babies have had any problems.

Have a happy and healthy pregnancy.

jn

Stephanie Brim · Jul 31, 2007

Yeah, the only thing I'm not doing in that list is the respirator, but that's only because I'm doing 35mm and 120 development in closed tanks. When I start printing I'm going to be looking into masks, methinks.

gainer · Jul 31, 2007

While you are at it, look at the table of contents of a hair dye bottle.

Snapshot · Jul 31, 2007

All this talk on precautions while handling photochemistry has raised some concerns on my practices. I often directly contact B&W chemicals (such as fixer and developer) but always washed my hands right afterwards. It seems this is not sufficient and I'm wondering if I've unduly jeopardized my health.

TheFlyingCamera · Jul 31, 2007

Snapshot said:
All this talk on precautions while handling photochemistry has raised some concerns on my practices. I often directly contact B&W chemicals (such as fixer and developer) but always washed my hands right afterwards. It seems this is not sufficient and I'm wondering if I've unduly jeopardized my health.

In all probability, if you're not drinking the stuff, or using it for spa treatments, you're fine. Now if you father a child with two heads, three eyes and a lizard's tail, don't point the finger at me

Snapshot · Jul 31, 2007

TheFlyingCamera said:
In all probability, if you're not drinking the stuff, or using it for spa treatments, you're fine. Now if you father a child with two heads, three eyes and a lizard's tail, don't point the finger at me

If I do have such a child, I'll chalk it up to my bad taste in the opposite sex.

SPS731 · Aug 1, 2007

Stephanie Brim said:
Being pregnant, I'm more worried about this than normal. I wear gloves when using Diafine and Rodinal now. Could I use Pyro or should I stay away until after the baby's born? I highly doubt I'll run the risk, though.

It is great that you are being careful throughout your pregnancy! Good luck with every thing and I hope you go the full term. You don't want an "under-developed" baby.

SPS731 · Aug 1, 2007

Chris Breitenstein said:
unless you plan on drinking or inhaling Pyro all the health risks can be avoided by wearing Nitrile gloves. As far as a "superior" image is concerned it's not a silver bullet. You still need to be very precise with exposure and development. Run some film through it and if you like it use it. I use ABC I know of many photographers using Pyrocat hd. As far as PMk is concerned the stain really dose nothing but add base fog, because it doesn't stain proportionally.

Test it and see if you like it.

Yours;

If the stain just adds base fog, what gives the negatives their wonderful qualities?

I will test it and see how I like it. Thanks.

TheFlyingCamera · Aug 1, 2007

the stain isn't base fog. The stain is proportional to exposure. The denser the silver, the denser the stain. It works like a built-in contrast mask.

MenacingTourist · Aug 1, 2007

Stephanie Brim said:
Yeah, the only thing I'm not doing in that list is the respirator, but that's only because I'm doing 35mm and 120 development in closed tanks. When I start printing I'm going to be looking into masks, methinks.

Besides the heavy lifting and foot massages your husband/partner is responsible for, you should also teach him to develop your negs

Our first baby was a kicker. He was also rather fond of bracing himself in there and pushing against my wife's ribs. Now she has one side that sticks out further on the bottom than the other. We'll guilt him on that one for as long as we can

Good luck with everything.

gainer · Aug 1, 2007

TheFlyingCamera said:
the stain isn't base fog. The stain is proportional to exposure. The denser the silver, the denser the stain. It works like a built-in contrast mask.

The original instruction in the Book of Pyro was to return the film to developer after fixing so as to intensify the stain. This procedure intensified the overall stain, but did little or nothing to the proportional stain, and is no longer recommended.

PMK does indeed give proportional stain, a fact that I proved in an article for Photo Techniques some years ago entitled "More Pyrotechnics" by bleaching the silver from a PMK-developed negative and printing the stain image on VC paper with maximum magenta.

sanking · Aug 1, 2007

SPS731 said:
If the stain just adds base fog, what gives the negatives their wonderful qualities?

I will test it and see how I like it. Thanks.

All pyro developers that I have tried, including ABC Pyro, PMK, WD2D, Pyro 510, Pyrocat-HD and Pyrocat-MC, add proportional stain. Some of these developers are more prone to general, or B+F stain, if dilution and time of development are not appropriate.

Stain is only one of the attributes of pyro staining developers. Such developers also tan and harden the gelatin of the emulsion, which can lead to a more precise reduction that increases sharpness.

Sandy King

Health effects of Pyro?

SPS731

k_jupiter

SPS731

Early Riser

jovo

Membership Council

SPS731

Stephanie Brim

Mustafa Umut Sarac

Michel Hardy-Vallée

Membership Council

k_jupiter

Tom Hoskinson

Stephanie Brim

Chris Breitenstein

Jim Noel

Stephanie Brim

gainer

Snapshot

TheFlyingCamera

Membership Council

Snapshot

SPS731

SPS731

TheFlyingCamera

Membership Council

MenacingTourist

gainer

sanking

Health effects of Pyro?

Membership Council

Membership Council

Membership Council

Membership Council

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency