HCB Appreciation

nikos79 · Wednesday at 5:55 AM

snusmumriken said:
What were your sources, in fact?

It was from a book I read from an HCB exhibition in Greece so perhaps misinformed

gary mulder · Wednesday at 8:27 AM

koraks said:
Oh, I agree with that. I just wasn't aware we were discussing depth of field. Is there something similar going on with depth of field as with saturation and contrast?

Yes I think we misunderstand each other. I was talking about fashion in print character. Maybe we are expecting more than fifty years later a different print than HCB ment it to be. That includes contrast and sharpness. Over the later we know HCB had an distinct view. By enhancing the contrast, you also mask lack of depth of field. I have seen quite a few original prints from HCB and they have softness we now easily call flat grey.
I don’t think HCB is well-known for his color work. So color saturation does seem to be a bit off topic.

koraks · Wednesday at 8:37 AM

gary mulder said:
By enhancing the contrast, you also mask lack of depth of field.

OK, now we're on the same page again. I can see how that might influence a preference towards higher contrast today. It could be part of the reason we see these differences in renditions.

MattKing · Wednesday at 2:05 PM

koraks said:
For me, an exchange like this is similar to comments (amateur) photographers sometimes make about each other's work - "you should have cropped half an inch here" or "it would have been better if that element wasn't included in the frame" etc. Such remarks always make me think "then it would have been a different photograph and we're now looking at this one - so go out and make your own version of it if you feel it should be done differently." I've said it before in threads like this one - you like the image or you don't. Maybe you can express a little why you think you like it, but the response is primarily an emotional one. At the very least, if you try to rationalize an emotional response, a lot is lost in the process. At worst, you totally miss the point.

I think those amateur photographer remarks are fine, if they are accompanied by an explanation as to why the suggestion is made. Something like: "if you remove that, it tends to increase my attention to this".
Photography being a communicative art, it is often helpful to know what others are getting from the communication.
Particularly when the original photographer may themselves not have considered the option.

Don_ih · Wednesday at 4:18 PM

The online representations of photographs often give no indication what the source was. I have numerous old books that have pretty lacklustre reproductions of photos in them. If you scanned one of those, you'd get a more soot-and-chalk representation of a print than perhaps you should. I like the copies made for auctions and exhibits and often search for one when I see a photo posted in a thread like this.

nikos79 · Wednesday at 4:36 PM

It would have been very interesting to see a contact sheet of HCB. To reveal the way he worked and his "success" rate. Was he really that selective in the so called "decisive" moment or part of his skill was a clear and sharp judgement afterwards in the selection process?
I would be very curious to see them

Arthurwg · Wednesday at 4:53 PM

I've always had a question about one of HCB's pictures, the one of a French women being chastised by another woman as a NAZI collaborator after the liberation of Paris. That apparently identical frame exists in a film he made at the time, making me wonder if it was taken from the film.

Don_ih · Wednesday at 4:53 PM

nikos79 said:
Was he really that selective in the so called "decisive" moment or part of his skill was a clear and sharp judgement afterwards in the selection process?

This has been talked about endlessly. It's well-established that he would take numerous photos, change position, wait for something to happen, etc. - the same as everyone else - and pick the ones he liked best after. Why would anyone expect any different?

MattKing · Wednesday at 5:13 PM

I would never put myself in the same class as HCB.
But I would expect that we shared at least a little bit of the process - photography with a 35mm camera is often a process.
You work a scene: observe how things change as you, your camera settings, the light, and the subjects change.
And you let the observations made by you each time when you release the shutter inform you as you move toward adjusting to those observations before releasing the shutter again, and then again, and continuing until you are satisfied that you have at least one and preferably several photographs with strong possibilities. All with a mind toward the printing or post-processing stage.

Alex Benjamin · Wednesday at 5:34 PM

Arthurwg said:
I've always had a question about one of HCB's pictures, the one of a French women being chastised by another woman as a NAZI collaborator after the liberation of Paris. That apparently identical frame exists in a film he made at the time, making me wonder if it was taken from the film.

Already answered here :

Robert Doisneau

I have a few of his books. I was looking at ........ 3 Seconds From Eternity. It really strikes that a lot of his (and many other photographers) pics were of "immediate" post-war Paris and France. Sort of that 1945-1949 period. I am sure there was all kinds of rubble, desperation, struggle...

www.photrio.com

Don_ih · Wednesday at 6:26 PM

A major part of what Cartier-Bresson did was when he did it. To a great extent, it's impossible to do what he did now.

Arthurwg · Wednesday at 7:13 PM

Alex Benjamin said:
Already answered here :

Robert Doisneau

I have a few of his books. I was looking at ........ 3 Seconds From Eternity. It really strikes that a lot of his (and many other photographers) pics were of "immediate" post-war Paris and France. Sort of that 1945-1949 period. I am sure there was all kinds of rubble, desperation, struggle...

www.photrio.com

Wow! Thanks for posting. These days it can seem like all this is forgotten.

Arthurwg · Wednesday at 7:17 PM

Pieter12 said:
The fact that he is wearing white socks with his loafers says everything.

I did notice that, but can't figure out what it says.

snusmumriken · Thursday at 4:06 AM

cliveh said:
I could write a 500 word essay about this image and how it compares to a painting by someone I can't quite bring to mind at present.

Have you remembered yet? I am intrigued to know. There are any number of Adoration paintings to choose from, but I can’t find one that compares. So it’s likely something else. Joseph Wright of Derby came to mind, but I drew a blank there too.

nikos79 · Thursday at 4:50 AM

snusmumriken said:
Have you remembered yet? I am intrigued to know. There are any number of Adoration paintings to choose from, but I can’t find one that compares. So it’s likely something else. Joseph Wright of Derby came to mind, but I drew a blank there too.

maybe El Greco?

nikos79 · Thursday at 4:52 AM

Don_ih said:
This has been talked about endlessly. It's well-established that he would take numerous photos, change position, wait for something to happen, etc. - the same as everyone else - and pick the ones he liked best after. Why would anyone expect any different?

Because films cost money too
But HCB was a very wealthy man

P.S. He also said that his photos are always a "Yes" never a "maybe". So I am curious to see if that was true

koraks · Thursday at 5:02 AM

Selection is part of the process. You can select at various stages; before pressing the button, when deciding what to print, when deciding what to publish etc. There's no reason to assume that HCB exclusively selected at one particular point in the process. Like any other mortal, he did it at all stages. I think there's also nothing inherently interesting or valuable about selecting at one particular point. The "x% of my shots are keepers" is more about bragging rights than anything else. Who cares how you got there; the question is what you have to show by the end of it.

nikos79 · Thursday at 5:07 AM

koraks said:
Who cares how you got there; the question is what you have to show by the end of it.

Exactly! For us viewers and admirers of photography this is what matters.
Who cares if he gathered and staged the whole crowd, sat there all day long, or whether it was his last photo on the roll.

It could be interesting though if we want to follow some advice on the "process", to study how the masters did it.

Don_ih · Thursday at 5:11 AM

nikos79 said:
He also said that his photos are always a "Yes" never a "maybe". So I am curious to see if that was true

And does that mean any more than every photo of his that you see is the one he wanted to show you?

Firing a shutter only results in a photo when he shows you the print.

koraks · Thursday at 5:11 AM

'Interesting' - sure, I guess. Anything can be interesting. Whether it's very relevant in finding your own voice, I really doubt it.

Don_ih · Thursday at 5:18 AM

nikos79 said:
how the masters did it

The most important aspect to what he did was to be there. The second was to watch.

nikos79 · Thursday at 5:27 AM

Don_ih said:
The most important aspect to what he did was to be there. The second was to watch.

I would really question the first statement. Being there would give you a raw material. But HCB gives me the impression (as other photographers too) that even if he was locked in a prison cell he would make interesting photos

nikos79 · Thursday at 5:35 AM

koraks said:
'Interesting' - sure, I guess. Anything can be interesting. Whether it's very relevant in finding your own voice, I really doubt it.

I know you want me to find my own path koraks

Don_ih · Thursday at 5:40 AM

nikos79 said:
But HCB gives me the impression (as other photographers too) that even if he was locked in a prison cell he would make interesting photos

Did he during the three years he was in prison? I'm sure he could have if he'd had a camera. Not many if he was just locked in a cell all day and night long every day.

nikos79 · Thursday at 6:12 AM

Don_ih said:
Did he during the three years he was in prison? I'm sure he could have if he'd had a camera. Not many if he was just locked in a cell all day and night long every day.

Didn't know he really went there!

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