Have you come across a well researched (HUMAN) resource that lists the exact films famous photographers were using?

I am trying to determine the exact color film stock Ernest Cole used in New York.

Several months ago, I was trying to determine the exact color film stock Gary Winogrand used for some beach photographs. I never found an answer with concrete evidence.

It’s not the sort of information that gets publicized by artists, or galleries, or curators, or historians. It’s largely irrelevant to the kind of conversation happening in art.

The kind of people who would need to know what specific materials an artist used would be conservators or archivists. People personally working hands on with the materials in a technical capacity.

But an audience member asking what kind of developer a photographer used to achieve a certain effect is sort of like asking who manufactured the canvas Van Gogh used to paint The Starry Night. It’s the wrong line of questioning to follow when interrogating the work.

And for an artist looking to take inspiration from the decisions contained in the work, it’s the wrong aspect of the work to be inspired by. Emulating the techniques of another artist is one thing but when it gets down to the level of what materials they used it becomes an unintentional attempt at either parody or forgery. Either way not really something of interest to art. Better to make your own decisions based on the needs dictated by the conditions of your own ideas.

_T_ said:

It’s not the sort of information that gets publicized by artists, or galleries, or curators, or historians. It’s largely irrelevant to the kind of conversation happening in art.

The kind of people who would need to know what specific materials an artist used would be conservators or archivists. People personally working hands on with the materials in a technical capacity.

But an audience member asking what kind of developer a photographer used to achieve a certain effect is sort of like asking who manufactured the canvas Van Gogh used to paint The Starry Night. It’s the wrong line of questioning to follow when interrogating the work.

And for an artist looking to take inspiration from the decisions contained in the work, it’s the wrong aspect of the work to be inspired by. Emulating the techniques of another artist is one thing but when it gets down to the level of what materials they used it becomes an unintentional attempt at either parody or forgery. Either way not really something of interest to art. Better to make your own decisions based on the needs dictated by the conditions of your own ideas.

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So then you don't know what the OP asks? I don't think forgery is the goal here.

mshchem said:

So then you don't know what the OP asks? I don't think forgery is the goal here.

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Not only do I not know, I don’t know of any commonly available resources that could help answer the question.

The only way I can think of to find out would be to contact the people involved in the technical handling of the materials in question. Which I alluded to above. Maybe their publisher or the publisher’s print shop would know. Or if the work is in a publicly funded art museum you could ask their staff and they might be willing to investigate or allow you to schedule time with the materials to investigate yourself.

Even those might not be fruitful lines of investigation.

The idea of photographers sharing the materials and techniques involved in the process of creating a specific work is relatively new, around the time of the resurgence of film, as people wanted to show that their work was in fact made through an analog process thus differentiating them from digital photographers.

Unless the artist wrote a book about their process like ansel adams or the choice of material was integral to the work like Richard Mosse, there was a long period where people didn’t publicize much more than maybe what kind of camera was used, if that.

Presumably Ernest Cole worked in New York in the 1960's, and some of that work has been retrieved from a newfound stash of his old negatives. But was everything a negative? And if it has come to light just recently, it was probably scanned and digitally cleaned up. The odds of actual color prints that old surviving in decent condition, by someone with a limited income, are low. And most color negs that old wouldn't be in great shape either. So did they find some slides; and if so, the trend of the times would be Kodachrome. He wasn't known for color work, so there's little to go on. Maybe you should contact the research project dedicated to him directly.

This is a lot of chitchat to say “I have no idea.”

C-22, C-23 whatever it takes!

Certain Exposures said:

I am trying to determine the exact color film stock Ernest Cole used in New York.

Several months ago, I was trying to determine the exact color film stock Gary Winogrand used for some beach photographs. I never found an answer with concrete evidence.

Click to expand...

Probably the film that they could get the best deal on at the time.
Or if they used a quote in support of an application for a grant, it may have been that film.
Although if they used someone else to make prints for them, that may have been who made the decision for them.
The same applies to work that was commissioned by a magazine - their printers may have had requirements.
In most cases, if a photographer hasn't made their preference public - and some did/do - they probably changed what they used whenever it made sense.
And there is almost no reason for anyone other than an archivist with negatives or slides in hand to care.

Plenty of photographers have publicized the materials they use(d). Did OP really need this 101 lecture or are you interested in becoming a moderator here?

_T_ said:

It’s not the sort of information that gets publicized by artists, or galleries, or curators, or historians. It’s largely irrelevant to the kind of conversation happening in art.

The kind of people who would need to know what specific materials an artist used would be conservators or archivists. People personally working hands on with the materials in a technical capacity.

But an audience member asking what kind of developer a photographer used to achieve a certain effect is sort of like asking who manufactured the canvas Van Gogh used to paint The Starry Night. It’s the wrong line of questioning to follow when interrogating the work.

And for an artist looking to take inspiration from the decisions contained in the work, it’s the wrong aspect of the work to be inspired by. Emulating the techniques of another artist is one thing but when it gets down to the level of what materials they used it becomes an unintentional attempt at either parody or forgery. Either way not really something of interest to art. Better to make your own decisions based on the needs dictated by the conditions of your own ideas.

Click to expand...

Certain Exposures said:

I am trying to determine the exact color film stock Ernest Cole used in New York.

Several months ago, I was trying to determine the exact color film stock Gary Winogrand used for some beach photographs. I never found an answer with concrete evidence.

Click to expand...

Ernest Cole's archives, including his negatives (60 000 of them, found in a Swedish bank after his death), are managed by his nephew, Leslie Matlaisane. Magnum also has parts of it. Someone there would either know the info you are looking for, or could give you the contact of Matlaisane.


Winogrand's archives are housed at the Center for Creative Photography in Arizona. If you write at the people managing the archives, they should be able to give you the answer. Or you can go to Arizona and check it youself .

I'm betting that they shot whatever color film was common at the time, and available in their location. And over their body of work, they likely shot multiple types of film, both color and black and white. Once you glean this information (if you ever do), what are you going to do with it?

In this case, the individual in question is known almost exclusively for his black and white work. I could find only a single color image over the web, with no specifics. Alex gives the appropriate links for further inquiry.

DREW WILEY said:

In this case, the individual in question is known almost exclusively for his black and white work. I could find only a single color image over the web, with no specifics. Alex gives the appropriate links for further inquiry.

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Yeah, I did look at his black and white work, and I'm putting my money on Tri-X for that...

shot in US post 1966. likely Kodak...

• If color neg, Kodacolor-X
• If color transparency, Ektachrome-X, Kodachrome-II
• If B&W neg, mostly Tri-X or Plus-X (or maybe Verichrome Pan if rollfilm

but being of South African origin, it could have been that he preferred a European emulsion from Agfa or Ilford.

Just FYI, I might not reply for a bit. However, I am slowly going through all the responses to the threads I made this weekend. I read everything.