HARMAN technology Acquires Kentmere Photographic

Bob F. said:

Interesting is that Kentmere's management has shown good business sense in the past, being privately owned, and selling off to Ilford to me sounds like they are not confident they could continue in the long term and are selling up while they can get a reasonable price.

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The local newspaper, in Kendal, on the 5th Oct indicated Harman approached Kentmere with a view to taking them over. So perhaps you are reading things entirely the wrong way.

Ian

Bob F. said:

P.S. Cate & others: yes: Cooltone developer is no more - Simon G. confirmed in another thread ((there was a url link here which no longer exists)).

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Pity. It's frustrating and disappointing when you find combinations that work for you. Should be used to it by now, I suppose! Thanks for the info and link, Bob.

Harmilfordmere

Sounds British enough.

I wish everything would stay the same long enough for me adjust. After a long hiatus from B&W, I settled on Kodak Polymax FA and Forte Polywarmtone papers. That combo did not last long. Now I use Kentmere FP and my stock of PWT.

At least this is progress. We could be reading another business obituary. Please don't change the Kentmere papers or drastically increase the price.

Kentmere just started selling Kodak formula chemistry through Freestyle. I wonder if that will continue or be redundant eg, Kentmere RST plus the new Ilford selenium toner.

Ironically I just tried my first kentmere paper last week (fineprint FC fibre). Nice stuff; the glossy coating kind of feels like RC paper which is weird, but the prints look good.

Marc Leest said:

I don't like it. Here is the construction of a monopoly going on and that means UNLIMITED price increases.

-M-

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Face it; traditional B&W is becoming a fringe market. I wouldn't be surprised if eventually we do just have a single supplier - probably Ilford.

It's an artistic niche that's not going to disappear by any stretch, but it's nothing like it would have been 30 years ago.

Consolidation of the marketplace is inevitable and, in many cases, a good thing. I would rather have more photographic choices but I want viable producers/manufacturers more. Struggling vendors who are cutting corners and making unreliable products isn't good for anyone, not that Kentmere or Ilford currently fall into this category.

That's bad news; another good business swallowed.

Kentmere AND Ilford...

...not Ilford eats Kentmer for breakfast. If the papers currently being produced by Kentmere as well as Ilford continue to exist side-by-side, how can this be a bad move?

Perhaps with new distribution channels in the US and other parts of the world, Kentmere paper can be made available to more customers, not necessarily via mailorder. Except for Fotokemika Varycon and Emaks, I purchase all of my paper at the local store. If they add Kentmere to the line-up, I'll purchase Fineprint VC and Bromide paper from them too. Currently they only have Ilford paper.

I do see how competition from others might see difficult times with Bergger having their paper produced by Harman. That leaves Fotokemika, Foma, Slavich, and Fotospeed as the contenders for the rest of the market share (please fill in if I missed any of significance).

It certainly appears Simon thinks it's good for Harman, so congratulations to them. Joint effort and shared intellectual property might actually benefit both camps.

- Thomas

Snapshot said:

Consolidation of the marketplace is inevitable and, in many cases, a good thing.

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It may be inevitable, but I'm not convinced it's a good thing, I've always enjoyed and seen value in diversity. Although it may have to be a part of the process which is the last ditch attempt to save darkroom ways - successful I hope - being an idealist I have difficulty seeing things always in purely economic terms.

I suppose we are eventually heading towards a narrow range of goods, as less and less items become economically acceptable propositions to producers (which I do think is part of the process and will happen later if not sooner. If there comes a time when there is only one paper and one developer left I will probably give up printing).

It may be the way to go, and best accepted, just as Kentmere's future may be better as part of Ilford - but I'm not going to hail it with enthusiasm.

Look on the bright side of life, Kentmere products have a chance of surviving instead of becoming extinct. POWER TO HARMAN! Support a winner use Ilford products, feed the business.

It looks to me that Ilford and Kentmere will a good match, Kentmere for high end fiber with different surfaces and Ilford for RC and film. I wonder about the rebranded chemistry marketed under Kentmere by Freestyle.

Simon, any chance that the Art Classic and Art Document papers will be resurrected? I know they wouldn't be exactly the same as the old papers, but a similar replacement would be wonderful.

Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit

Paul Howell said:

It looks to me that Ilford and Kentmere will a good match, Kentmere for high end fiber with different surfaces and Ilford for RC and film. I wonder about the rebranded chemistry marketed under Kentmere by Freestyle.

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I would use Ilford Warmtone if it was on a white base. Ilford Gallerie is by far the best Bromide(Bromo-chloride) fibre paper on the market, Kodak could never make anything to match it.

Kentona's really nice but only available in one grade, in the UK.

Kentmere's RC papers are excellent.

There's plenty of choice but not always what we want, which is why I use(d) Record Rapid, then Agfa MCP, followed by Polywarmtone.

Somehow I feel the Ilford/Kentmere/Bergger offerings will give us far more choice.

Ian

Sad as the news that Kentmere is being taken over is, better they be taken over than die and better they be taken over by a photography materials producer than venture capatalists.

Haveing gone without a holiday this year to finance a secondhand Devere enlarger I for one will be printing to the bitter end, candidate No1 for last man standing here.
If it has to be then I wish the new venture every success.

On a brighter note, does this mean we can have 2 factory tours next year please and will you sign me up for both of them. One is impresive, two will be AWSOME.

Regards Paul.

Simon R Galley said:

...we report our daily sales down to the exact dollar...
Simon ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :

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Do you really report your daily sales in Dollars?

Barry

Phew! After reading through this thread all I can say is photographers sure do like looking at the negative! And in this case even before anything has developed.

I wonder if this is the reason my local photography outlet has started stocking kentmere papers? Last time I went in they had a huge shelf of brand new boxes of kentona and Fineprint VC and a couple of others in a nice variety of sizes. This is why I decided to give it a try - local availability

There are always going to be moments of terror for us stalwart traditional photographers, but eventually we'll find a happy equilibrium once the quakes from the global digital shift die down.

Raise prices?
In a shrinking, er, not growing very much market?
What are they trying to do- stay in business??
The bastids!!!

Ian,
How are you keeping? Hasn't Ilford Warmtone fibre been on a white base for the last couple of years?
But I take your point. It's a better paper than anything made by Kentmere.

Alan Clark

AlanC said:

Ian,
How are you keeping? Hasn't Ilford Warmtone fibre been on a white base for the last couple of years?
But I take your point. It's a better paper than anything made by Kentmere.
Alan Clark

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Hi Alan, a lots happened since we met Unfortunately both Ilford Warmtone and Kentmere's still aren't good alternatives to Agfa MCP or Forte's Polywarmtone which is a shame.

Both are let down by minor trivialities, it's the Ilford base colour, and the Kentmere surface. The Ilford base colour was still sickly cream, and still is as far as I know.

Maybe the merger will produce a warm tone paper that people really want.

Ian

One or two suggestions in the thread that Kentmere was in, or must have been in, some sort of trouble.

As far as I am aware Kentmere is in excellent financial state and an extremely well run and prudent company. The fact that there has been such a take over is, I think, a major vote of confidence in the traditional market. Somone approved the finance to buy a healthy company, not one in trouble.

The other very useful aspect is, as some have mentioned, the additional production plant and capacity which I would imagine will give the new company greater flexibility, and most importantly, economies of scale.

I like the comments from Ilford about Kentmere remaining largely independent - contrary to some remarks, I see this happening quite a lot and brand identity is very important. As an example, Aston Martin cars were until recently owned by Ford. The company can benefit greatly from the economies of scale, improve it products and ultimately make more money.

In addition, geographically, Ilford and Kentmere are not all that far apart.

I think that this, coupled with the statement from Ilford about continuing to expand through acquisition, may mean that they will one day become the largest producer of traditional photographic products in the West.

On a really positive note, it means that I can now admit to Simon that I prefer Kentmere VC Select RC to Ilford MG IV as my everyday standard RC paper!

Final thought - when are you going to bid for Kodak's traditional division?

The other aspect you have to look at is purchasing power. With the increase in silver prices plus the minimum orders required for paper rolls etc. this merger will give Ilford/Kentmere more leverage when buying raw product. In addition it will allow them to meet minimum quantity requirements for common materials.

Dear Simon,

Does that mean that from now on Kentmere papers are going to be (not) imported by the Greek importer of Ilford in my country ??? If that is so, then this is really bad news for Greek photographers...

George Papantoniou said:

Dear Simon,

Does that mean that from now on Kentmere papers are going to be (not) imported by the Greek importer of Ilford in my country ??? If that is so, then this is really bad news for Greek photographers...

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I think nothing will change on the level of supplies. I don't think it's Ilford's intention to force there products to buyers, in that case they would not do a joint venture with Kentmere but instead of that they would make sure that their suppliers would only sell Ilford products.

I think this is good news. The alternative would probably be Kentmere disappearing altogether.

Usually when one company is taken over by another, there is not a sudden change in policies and products. So long as the company is being run properly by it's management, they are usually left to get on with it with minimal interference from the parent company.

The company I work for has been bought and sold a few times and we still have the same management and product lines. It's only when you start reporting massive losses that things start to change.

Anyway, good luck to both Ilford and Kentmere.


Steve.