Grey prints from colour enlarger

Sorrycharlie · Dec 1, 2019

Hi guys. I understand I might be asking a question that is too broad and hard to answer with one answer but I’ve run into something that I’m hoping is an easy fix.

I’ve got two enlargers, a LPL 66sII

And an AGFA c-66 (Durst M 605)

Yesterday I did my fist ever printing and I used the LPL 66SII and aside from some small hiccups I was amazed with the results, they’re nothing special to most people I’m sure but I was very happy.

Anyway today I thought I’d try the AGFA and all my prints have come out really grey. Not much contrast and pretty dark. I will post some pictures here if necessary.

Same paper, same everything really just different enlarger. So I’m guessing I’m doing something wrong with the enlarger and I’m guessing it’s the colour head or something? I tried it on 0 as well as a lot of different combinations and they all just look kind of muddy grey, still nice sharpness but no real black or white?

Any insights and suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Cheers

glbeas · Dec 1, 2019

Sound like your chemicals went bad overnight. Mix fresh?

Neal · Dec 1, 2019

Dear SorryCharlie,

In addition to the above very likely suggestion, there are lots of possibilities. First, my apologies if these suggestions seem obvious. Your post made me believe you are a new printer.

Assuming the problem is due to changing the enlarger: If the Agfa is a color enlarger the filter settings or the condition could be an issue. The light source (bulb?) in the Agfa needs to be replaced. Light leaks from the enlarger could fog the paper.

In any case, you will figure it out, the vast majority of times these things are simple and in hindsight obvious.

Good luck!

Martin Rickards · Dec 1, 2019

There's also the possibility that your dichroic filters were all out of the light path. Check that there's no lever to set all filters to zero. Been there done thar

pentaxuser · Dec 1, 2019

So neither enlarger has been used by you before? The same everything which you mentions helpfully covers most of what we need to get answers about but it might help if you say if the developer used for the LPL prints was the same developer but 24 hours older for the the Agfa.

It might be worthwhile for you to use fresh developer and the same negative in both enlargers in succession then if the Agfa is still as bad tell us what the print set-up was on the Agfa in terms of contrast setting. Without wishing to be insulting can I take it you are familiar with how to set up the Agfa?

pentaxuser

mshchem · Dec 1, 2019

I think your suspicion of the head is a good place to start. As others have mentioned, make sure the filters are in place. My Beseler heads have a white light lever, that allows for focusing, with the filters removed from the light path. I'm not familiar with the Agfa unit.

Chemistry is cheap, start fresh. Try both units side by side.

MattKing · Dec 1, 2019

When you adjust the filter settings on the colour enlarger, does the colour of the light at the easel visibly change?
In particular:
1) if you start with the settings at zero, does turning up the yellow setting make the light at the easel appear more yellow;
2) if you start with the settings at zero, does turning up the magenta (purple)setting make the light at the easel appear more magenta; and
3) if you start with the settings at zero, does turning up the cyan (blue-green) setting make the light at the easel appear more cyan?

In case you don't already have it, here is a link to the manual for the Durst version of your enlarger: http://www.jollinger.com/photo/cam-coll/manuals/enlargers/durst/Durst_M605.pdf

Sorrycharlie · Dec 1, 2019

Ok, so thank you everyone for the replies, this place really is an amazing wealth of knowledge and I’m very grateful for the help. Yes I am a complete beginner, this is my first time in the darkroom as you can tell.
Anyway so after sifting through the suggestions I went back in and printed the same neg in the same way on both enlargers and still got a very grey washed out image from the Agfa (durst). The image from the LPL was wonderful in comparison. Anyway, I re read the suggestions and Neal’s idea that light leaks from the enlarger could fog the paper came up. Sure enough I turned on the enlarger and light was pissing out everywhere and it’s hard up against a white tiled wall so it’s reflecting light all over the place. In the magic of the moment I clearly hadn’t noticed this as I’m still in the awe struck stage of printing. Anyway, I started to tape up and cover all the light I could see (there’s a few sliders to select 35mm and to engage the filters, light was beaming out of these). I tried again and this was 100% my problem. The image is 100 times better, still a bit of grey that I know shouldn’t be there but the blacks were black and whites were white. Amazing! Now I have to figure out how I’m going to seal the leaks more permanently.

Again, thanks to everyone who replied. I’ll try insert some images here to show what was happening.

Sorrycharlie · Dec 1, 2019

Left was the AGFA with light leaks and right is the LPL

Sorrycharlie · Dec 1, 2019

This one is the light leak AGFA on the left and then the right is after I covered up the light leaks. Still not a great exposure but so much better, and I think was the problem

Sorrycharlie · Dec 1, 2019

Here is my ridiculous attempt at trying to stop the light. It did the job enough to show me that I was on the right track though

MattKing · Dec 1, 2019

Be careful with heat!
Try covering the tiled walls at the side and back - something like a grey towel would be perfect.
If necessary, you can add as well a small cowling just below the negative stage.
Some light leaking out the side may be okay if it doesn't reflect off anything and down to the paper.
You probably understand this already - if you have paper out, the enlarger should be off except when the paper is actually in the easel and the exposure is happening.

Sorrycharlie · Dec 1, 2019

MattKing said:
Be careful with heat!
Try covering the tiled walls at the side and back - something like a grey towel would be perfect.
If necessary, you can add as well a small cowling just below the negative stage.
Some light leaking out the side may be okay if it doesn't reflect off anything and down to the paper.
You probably understand this already - if you have paper out, the enlarger should be off except when the paper is actually in the easel and the exposure is happening.

Thanks Matt, yeah I realised straight away that this would cause an overheating issue and I will now have to figure out a way to stop the light or maybe diffuse the tiles like you mention. Yeah I’m careful to turn the enlarger off before opening the paper, made that mistake a few times !

pentaxuser · Dec 2, 2019

As others have said a white glossy tiled wall is far from the best background from a reflection aspect. I suspect that it is a kind of point reflection from such a wall that resulted in the mark on the girl's forehead. My own enlarger is a Durst 605 which essentially is the same enlarger from a light leak aspect and yes light does leak from the carriers Mine does and has since I got it . However it does not exhibit your problem. All I have is matt white wall paper on the wall behind the enlarger which isn't even painted black. My carrier is about 14 inches from the wall and when I take paper out of its box the box sits quite a few feet from the enlarger and well below the level of the leak of light

Why am I telling you all this? Well the good news may be that if you cover up the glossy tiles and then take the kind of precautions I mention this may be enough. Covering the whole head with carpet is far from ideal for the reasons already given

Incidentally if you can cover the specific light leaks from the carrier in a convenient way that does not impede the use of the enlarger then let me know. Such information is still useful to an experienced user like myself

Thanks

pentaxuser

Grey prints from colour enlarger

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