Grey 8x10 with Vivitar E34 enlarger.

[Ko.Fe.]

I'm using the E34 Vivitar enlarger for couple of years now.
I have Nikkor 50 and Fuji 75 quality lenses.
The enlarger itself was given to me as in new, all original parts condition.

With old Agfa Brovira FB 5x7 it is quick and simple. Same settings, same timing with normal negatives. 135 and 120 films.
Smaller size RC paper also gives me OK results. I'm using this enlarger as the light source for contact prints up to 4x5 and results are fine on RC paper.

But 8x10 RC (Kentmere and Ilford) gives me grey, not BW images.
I have tried it with two different safelights, all possible contrast filters, split printing. It comes not bw, but grey. I have tried it at two different locations as well.

One wierd thing I noticed from very beginning. I'm using Ilford developer diluted 50-75 mg per 550 mg in tray which is close to 8x10 size.
First hour or so, developing times are short, but after one hour (about ten 8x10) developing gets longer and stays like this for two, three hours.

I have 200+ sheets of 8x10 and almost ready to cut it for smaller sizes.

 

[dasBlute]

Could be your paper is fogged, what happens when you run an unexposed piece of the RC through fresh developer?

 

[Ko.Fe.]

I never did this test. Paper is fresh from the store as not expired and developer is fresh mix always.
I have some PM exchange and it looks like I'm using wrong safelight. It seems to be OK for small prints where total time of exposure it short. But with 8x10 it is longer or/and more.
I have yellow, light amber old Kodak Brownie safelight shown on the photo. But for modern RC I need "OC" filter, not the red one...

 

[Rick A]

You need either a dark red or OC safe light filter, you most likely have an OA filter on that old safe light. I prefer dark red, it may be harder to see in the dark room, but I can use it with different papers and ortho film.

 

[Ko.Fe.]

Thank you, Rick.
Where are no OC filters sold locally at this moment, but I have seen red ones.
How do I know if it is really dark red? Camera store sold me bright red bulb, but it is fogging my RC paper.

 

[Paul Howell]

As important as how dark the filter is, is the wattage of the bulb and distance from the safelight to the paper. You can use a sheet of paper to see if your safelight is fogging your paper. Put a test strip in your easel and use heavy card board and count down, first strip 10 seconds, then add 10 each exposure until you get to a least a mint. Do not turn on the enlarger and develop the test strip to see if you get fog and when. I have 2 safelight in my dark room, one with OC the other a red filter, I used back gaffer tape to seal around the filter to make sure no white light escapes. As my darkroom is small, a master bath, I point my lights up towards the ceiling and let the light reflect down towards the trays. Last year I had to replace the OC fliter as over the decades it was no longer safe.

 

[Ko.Fe.]

We made it!
I followed advice to get correct safelight, but did it Q&D way for now.
Instead of white light in my Brownie light I installed purple one. With combination of yellow cap it gave amber light. I tested with paper, no fogging!
Printed seven 8x10 this evening. Never seen it so crisp and clear before
Thanks! Ko.

 

[MattKing]

You could probably get a fair bit more usable light out of your safelight with an amber bulb instead.

In any event, you could definitely benefit from performing a Kodak safelight test - which is usable with all safelights: http://wwwca.kodak.com/global/en/consumer/products/techInfo/k4/k4TestSafelite.shtml

The crucial thing to note is that a good safelight test relies on paper that has been exposed to a threshold level of light before you perform the test.

 

[Ko.Fe.]

Yes. The only question is - where do I get amber bulb?

Results from yesterday.

 

[Paul Howell]

That is a good question, with the new rules limiting tungsten bulbs I don't know if there is a LED replacement. I have a red 25 watt bulb that I use in the Kodak safelight, the filter is very old and has a small scratches, so red bulb insures that it is safe. I tired the red bulb without the filter and it fogged my paper, I used the Kodak for Slavish paper. I must have bought the bulb 10 or so years ago at the local hardware store. I would look on line, maybe you can find an LED.

 

[Rick A]

I used to have an E-34 enlarger, what lens are you using? I have a Yashica 40/3.5 you can have for postage.

 

[Ko.Fe.]

I used to have an E-34 enlarger, what lens are you using? I have a Yashica 40/3.5 you can have for postage.

Sorry to be late. I have original kit lenses. They are OK. But I added EL-Nikkor 50 2.8 and Fuji 75 for 6x6.

 

[RobC]

We made it!
Printed seven 8x10 this evening. Never seen it so crisp and clear before

So you've been getting fogged prints for a couple of years and never noticed. We live and learn.

everyone should do a safe light test to find out if AND how long their paper is safe for under their safelights. And every paper type used should be tested as they're not all the same.

Take a piece of paper and place it on baseboard. Give it a short exposure of 3 seconds (no negative) with safe lights on. This fogs the paper a little getting you past the paper inertia point. Then place a coin on one edge of paper. Then every minute place another coin on paper without moving first. And then every minute again untill you have 20 coins in a line. Wait the last minute and then develop, stop and fix.

Counting back from the last coin you will see how many minutes of safety you have with your safelight. If all is well you should have several of the last coins added which don't show on the paper and then you'll start to see them getting progressively worse.

In one college darkroom I tried this in, the safe time was less than 30 seconds. i.e. NONE !!!

 

[Ko.Fe.]

Actually, I went through my prints few days ago and they were good until few months ago and for recent 8x10 RC only. I was printing on very old 5x7 FB instead and no issues.
My Brownie plastic safelight cap burned out, I think. It was opaque at beginning, now yellow and it is also not secure in the thread anymore.
I need to find replacement ASAP.

 

[Ko.Fe.]

It appears the reason for getting grey prints on old Agfa RC Premium paper was the Ilford developer. In Arista lith developer borders stay white after long developing time. In Ilford developer developing time should be less than 30 seconds to avoid grey borders and image.