Green Tint in Fuji Crystal Archive Base

Kloppervok · Jan 17, 2010

I've been using the Kodak Ektacolor ra kit and their blix to process this. For some reason, I can't figure out why my paper keeps coming out with a green base.

I've made sure that there are no problems on the dry side; my darkroom is well sealed.
Unfortunately, I'm not sure that my problems are on the wet side either.

I mixed a new batch of each chemical, and the results were identical. What is stranger is that occasionally, I get a sheet with white whites.

I bought this paper previously owned. Even if they were exposed to light, the uniform shade in both boxes is very strange.

What could be the problem?

pentaxuser · Jan 17, 2010

It may just be the scans but the middle print looks less substantially less green than the first. I take it that you are saying that you cannot get rid of the green cast even by altering the magenta filtration?

It might help if you say what your filtration is and what changes you made to try and correct the green cast and explain what you mean by white whites. Do you mean that occasionally you get whites without any green cast and if so is the rest of the print colours without the green cast as well?

pentaxuser

Photo Engineer · Jan 17, 2010

I have posted here before that CAII paper, released in 2006 or thereabouts, takes a different process than the old CA or Endura paper. Fuji changed the emulsions.

So, to test this, I suggest that you just rinse, blix, wash and dry a sheet or strip of your CA paper and see how green it is. If it is still green, it may be the tint of the paper, but if it is white, then the problem is either fog or the developer. If so, I suggest you change to the latest Fuji Hunt kit and process recomendations.

PE

Kloppervok · Jan 17, 2010

PE, I wasn't aware about such a thing before.

I've processed blank strips of the paper multiple times in order to check the integrity of my darkroom, and they've all come out green. Unfortunate.

Do you know a distributor in the states that has the Fuji Hunt Press Kits? Or am I going to have to buy their >$100 minilab replenishment kits?

Bob-D659 · Jan 17, 2010

That dark stripe along the edge looks like fogging, maybe the envelope was opened at some time and the lights were turned on.

Kloppervok · Jan 17, 2010

The fogging visible here (red) at the bottom is 100% my fault.

Photo Engineer · Jan 17, 2010

IDK any distributors. Sorry. I'm not even sure that is the problem. I just know that CA II paper is now out there and does have some differences in process.

PE

Bob-D659 · Jan 17, 2010

Are you processing at room temp or higher? Exactly which chems are you using, if processing at other than room temp are you using starter to mix your developer? The center print has some other coloured stains in the white border, that sort of points to a process problem. I don't see anything even between the three prints hanging in your pic, there appears to be quite a difference in the green casts, including a nice green blotch on the border of the center print.

nickandre · Jan 17, 2010

When I processed the fuji paper the issue was not in any base issues, but very bad crossover towards magenta, which I thought for a long time was just poor balancing of the print until I realized there was no way for me to correct it. I attributed that to the fact that I was processing at room temperature. I doubt that's the issue we're seeing here though. Nothing I got was this blatant.

bob100684 · Jan 17, 2010

Photo Engineer said:
IDK any distributors. Sorry. I'm not even sure that is the problem. I just know that CA II paper is now out there and does have some differences in process.

PE

I still doubt this. I have been working in minilab environments and when we received Fuji CAII we just needed to re balance for the new paper. No new chemistry or anything. This was using an old optical SFA with standard RA-4. Frontiers got a software update.

Kloppervok · Jan 18, 2010

Bob, I've processed sheets from the top, middle and bottom of the boxes at room temperature, 88F, and 96F, and all of them came out with the green cast.

The too sheets on the left were at room temp, and the two on the right were at 94F. Still green cast, but not as strong.

bob100684 · Jan 18, 2010

Kloppervok said:
Bob, I've processed sheets from the top, middle and bottom of the boxes at room temperature, 88F, and 96F, and all of them came out with the green cast.

The too sheets on the left were at room temp, and the two on the right were at 94F. Still green cast, but not as strong.

some of them almost look the color you get when you contaminate your developer with blix....but not quite.

Bob-D659 · Jan 18, 2010

Others have reported here that Fuji papers do not work at room temp, exactly which chems are you using and how are you mixing them and processing? Have you tried processing an unexposed sheet of paper? I assume you are doing this in total darkness.

Kloppervok · Jan 18, 2010

I've processed multiple unexposed strips, and they come out looking uniformly green, albeit, different shades.
I'm using the Kodak Ektacolor replenisher kit, mixed as per the directions. I remade a batch yesterday, and the results were more or less identical. I'm also using the Kodak RA blix kit. Both of these are new, as far as I can tell; i ordered them through my local photo shop.

Like I said before, I don't think the problem is on the dry side.

Bob-D659 · Jan 18, 2010

At normal, not room, temps required for the Fuji paper you will probably need starter to mix the developer. Which replenisher kit, they have a few. Are you using the Kodak product numbers linked to in this post? (there was a url link here which no longer exists)

Edit, try putting a piece of paper in the blix only, is it green or pure white?

Kloppervok · Jan 18, 2010

I left a strip in blix, just to see what would happen, for about 1 hour, and, there was no noticeable difference between the portion that was submerged, and the one that wasn't.

On my dev bottle, the kodak cat number is : 841 5580, on my blix, it's 830 9031, which are identical to the kits you cite in (there was a url link here which no longer exists) post. It is possible that i might need starter with Fuji paper, but I have no way to prove otherwise without first spending the money.

Photo Engineer · Jan 18, 2010

bob100684 said:
I still doubt this. I have been working in minilab environments and when we received Fuji CAII we just needed to re balance for the new paper. No new chemistry or anything. This was using an old optical SFA with standard RA-4. Frontiers got a software update.

I am reporting what Fuji announced at the International Congress of Imaging Science in May of 2006.

PE

Photo Engineer · Jan 18, 2010

Kloppervok said:
I've processed multiple unexposed strips, and they come out looking uniformly green, albeit, different shades.
I'm using the Kodak Ektacolor replenisher kit, mixed as per the directions. I remade a batch yesterday, and the results were more or less identical. I'm also using the Kodak RA blix kit. Both of these are new, as far as I can tell; i ordered them through my local photo shop.

Like I said before, I don't think the problem is on the dry side.

If you rinse, blix, wash and then dry an unexposed strip, and it is green, then the paper or blix have a problem. If it is white, then the paper or developer have a problem.

There are reports that Fuji paper does not process well at room temp. IDK, as I have never tried it based on those reports and the fact that Kodak paper is less expensive and easier to get here in Rochester.

PE

pentaxuser · Jan 18, 2010

We may get you to the right answer but I'd be inclined to write to Fuji about this as well for belt and braces to get you to an answer. It seem that raising the temp of the dev improved the cast quite a lot but even if Fuji isn't a room temp paper then at 96F you would seem to have eliminated this as a cause. Fuji paper processed correctly with good chems and colour balance will not produce a green cast which is inherent and non removeable, even if it is a less user friendly paper than Kodak.

Well if it is inherently flawed then the champagne corks are already popping in Rochester: and a lot of Fuji minilabs are right now contacting Kodak for supplies.

pentaxuser

Kloppervok · Jan 18, 2010

I called my local photofinishing lab, and their main color tech told me that kodak paper goes magenta when fogged and that fuji paper goes green/blue and that my paper might just been on the edge.

Since I can't vouch for the shipping conditions, it's possible that the paper has been fogged or was held at a high temperature for too long.

I was also told that there is a product for b/w paper that helps you take care of fogging. Is there a similar thing with ra paper?

I'm super disappointed at the results.

Photo Engineer · Jan 18, 2010

There are 3 antifoggants for color paper that handle fog layerwise.

The antifoggant for the cyan layer is phenyl mercapto tetrazole used at 1 - 2 mg / liter of developer. IDK if it works on Fuji paper.

PE

pentaxuser · Jan 18, 2010

Can you persuade your local lab to cut you a piece of its fresh Fuji paper under safe conditions. Use this and if the cast disappears then you've solved the problem. If you bought your paper new from a reputable supplier then contact it. You'd have the evidence of flawed paper of non merchandisable quality and should get fresh paper as a result.

pentaxuser

bob100684 · Jan 18, 2010

Photo Engineer said:
I am reporting what Fuji announced at the International Congress of Imaging Science in May of 2006.

PE

I don't doubt there were changes, our initial test prints with CA II were all over the place, but how is it that we didn't get new chemistry, or instructions to drain the old stuff and remix reformulated new stuff at the same time?

Photo Engineer · Jan 18, 2010

bob100684 said:
I don't doubt there were changes, our initial test prints with CA II were all over the place, but how is it that we didn't get new chemistry, or instructions to drain the old stuff and remix reformulated new stuff at the same time?

IDK. You will have to ask Fuji! Sorry, but that was the report. Some people have even said there is no such thing as CA II.

PE

AgX · Jan 18, 2010

Kloppervok said:
Do you know a distributor in the states that has the Fuji Hunt Press Kits?

The 5L working solutions "Print X Press 4 Kit" has been discontinued last summer.

Here in Europe several other small RA-4 kits ranging from 1L to 5L work.sol. are available.

Green Tint in Fuji Crystal Archive Base

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