Gray or darker matt board?

Recently at a Portland Photographers Forum we had Terry Thompson speaking and sharing his work. Terry's background includes an art education at the legendary School of Visual Arts in New York City, working with artists as diverse as Diane Arbus, Andy Warhol, Vido Acconci, Gary Winogrand, and Tad Yamashiro. Terry was a close friend to Imogen Cunningham.
During the lecture, Terry stated something that hit me as interesting and my memory kick in to another photographer I had met. Terry had said that he preferred to display his prints in an dark or even gray matt board. His reasons were that "White board creates a Backlight effect and takes away from the print." But, he said that museums and galleries only want white or off white boards because that is what is traditional and handed down from graphic arts. The other reason for White is that offers buyers a chance to change the window mat for their homes.
The other photographer I had met who said almost the same was Don Worth. I had seen a show of his in Palo Alto. His Black and white images were displayed in white but all is color work was matted in an 18% gray.
I took this information and looked into my photoshop program. As I'm sure you know you can change the working space from white to gray to black. I rotated one of my images and did see what both Terry and Don were aiming at.
As a color photographer, I'm thinking maybe I should start mounting images in Gray.
What do you think? Am I off my rocker or what?
I'm going to post this on several sites and cast a boarder net or thoughts

Mat with what you thinks looks best if the choice is yours. Polka dots, etc. If the choice is not yours, just take the check with a grin and let the other folks handle it.

Personally, I dry mount everything on an archival neutral white matboard. That way any overmat can be used.

Here look at this.

With excuse to APUG members. Here is a jpeg of one image, I changed that matt board digitally to get a feel of what Terry and Don were saying. I do see that my details in my darks get enhanced .

Interesting point about mat boards. I never thought about mounting on anything other than bright white rag board, probably because that is what we were taught in school. On the other hand, I chose the background color for my website as gray because it makes the images look stronger without the large expanse of white. I've also noticed that in art galleries (ie shops) the photographs stand out more if the wall is a medium shade of gray or brown instead of white.

Jon

I like black mat board. Only thing you've left out in your matt simulation is the fact that the core of the board is still white so you will have a thin border of white around the whole image to separate the colour from the image.

Akki14 said:

... the core of the board is still white so you will have a thin border of white around the whole image to separate the colour from the image.

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Actually, there are some boards made with a black core -- although the list I saw didn't include a black surface. There's also a Strathmore museum board that claims "solid color all through" that comes in black and a couple of grays. I've not personally used it (yet).

DaveT

I find that using a 50% gray board with a thin white border rather than white helps lift my photos and I see more of what is in it. It soesn't work for all of my photos though.
Mike

shades of white for me. I find the others hideous frankly. I believe that once matted and framed, the whole should be considered and not separated. whilst viewed on a table, a grey or black mount might 'technically enhance aspects of the photo,' when framed and on display I think it looks awful. There are many subtle hues of white available and I have a selection of slightly different shades from bainbridge, Colormount etc which I match to image tone/paper base etc. I usually choose frames very individually too, so the end restult is a bespoke framed 'piece' that works as a whole, of which the image is of course a vital part, but a part nonetheless. Once on the wall the entire framed entity has to create the right feel and grey is drab and miserable to me. I too have used black core at times, and it can be very effective with some images.

DWThomas said:

Actually, there are some boards made with a black core -- although the list I saw didn't include a black surface. There's also a Strathmore museum board that claims "solid color all through" that comes in black and a couple of grays. I've not personally used it (yet).

DaveT

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I had vaguely heard of the stuff I think but I think it's generally not used at framers here so when you ask for black you get black-and-white-sandwich not black all the way through.

With color imagery I think there is a wider array of choices, since there is a wider array of color in the image. Why limit yourself to to shades of gray? I saw an image mounted to aluminum. Looked really nice.

Black and white naturally limits the mat choice. I don't like the grays and black does not work with some images. I do find it interesting how an image on a black mat conveys a different feeling than that same image on a white mat.

For B&W, I think that a white board is a very good rule -- one just has to have a good reason to break the rule.

There are several other mating possibilities -- black border around the print on a white board, for example. This can be achieved with white board with a black core, or double mat (inner black), or like I mount my platinum prints, showing about 1/8" of the rebate (black) on a warm-white mat board.

Vaughn

If you frame your prints after matting them, black (or any other dark colour) board may make the glass behave like a mirror, which in some circumstances can ruin the impact of your print.

My preference is for a selenium-toned warmtone print mounted on an offwhite board - look good especially with images with a lot of dark tones, IMO.

DWThomas said:

Actually, there are some boards made with a black core -- although the list I saw didn't include a black surface. There's also a Strathmore museum board that claims "solid color all through" that comes in black and a couple of grays. I've not personally used it (yet).

DaveT

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Dave, you're correct! Strathmore museum board is solid color all through. There are shades of whites, creams, grays, and a black board that wasn't considered acid-free, initially, I think it is now. I've been using them for years.

I too, prefer neutral gray w/color prints, and sometimes with a cold bromide silver print - the warmer tone prints need white or black. Makes nice double mats.

Paul

I think you should pick a tone from the print and use the correct mount and/ or frame to help bring the whole thing together.

Forte Polywarmtone in Ilfrord warmtone dev with a low key subject I will use Colourmount Seal grey. It's like a very dark brown, but not black which looked 'wrong'.

If I used white, it would have led the eye away from the picture...too bright and a distraction.

The same can apply to colour work where I will often choose a wood stain which matches the colours in the photograph.

Gary Holliday said:

The same can apply to colour work where I will often choose a wood stain which matches the colours in the photograph.

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I do the same, but not just for color work.

I've found that certain types of wood can be made to match a monochrome print tone. Example: Polywarmtone w/slight selenium tone can be matched with Peruvian walnut (no stain) finished with dark shellac. The match is near perfect. More selenium tone would require a light mahogany or reddish walnut stain. Using an off-white mat will tie it all together.

There are many more possibilities when framing color prints.

Mat color, like many photo topics, is very subjective and you need to consider many different parameters in addition to the photo such as, target market, display environment, cost, and frame. Some photos might look great in with a particular style. For example, I low a black mat with white border with this low key portrait shot:

That style would be a disaster with other photos. Black frame with white mat pretty much works with everything. It is not always the best, but it will seldom hurt. For that reason if you are doing a gallery show you might prefer since you can avoid breaking a theme with a non stander mat and frame. If the piece is on display by itself you don’t have to worry about that.

Paper and Alpha cellulose mats are composed of core board that is laminated to provide color. Museum quality cotton rag board is generally dyed and then layered together. That is where the term ply comes from and results in the mat board having the same color all the way through. Bainbridge alpharag is composed like this. Bainbridge alphamat uses the core board but this allows black mats with white core and white mats with black core for certain effects.

Cheers,
Mark

If I submit something for my camera club's monthly shooting assignment it's mounted on black, however the 50% grey matt board brings the image colours out more.

With framed prints it's white matting all the way.

DWThomas said:

Actually, there are some boards made with a black core -- although the list I saw didn't include a black surface. There's also a Strathmore museum board that claims "solid color all through" that comes in black and a couple of grays. I've not personally used it (yet).

DaveT

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Most conservation matting will have a bright white core. If its museum rag, they are most always a solid layer of cotton and the same color from front to back. In the cheaper paper matting there is a product called Black Core. The face color could be anything but the bevel cut is black. These are not at all conservation or archival.

Looking around my room. I have 3 B+W prints with white matt's and 4 Color prints 2 with white, 1 is a medium gray and 1 is a very light gray. All the frames are a color that compliments the photo. Unless they request it, I use what looks best to me.

BusToBedlam said:

Most conservation matting will have a bright white core. If its museum rag, they are most always a solid layer of cotton and the same color from front to back. In the cheaper paper matting there is a product called Black Core. The face color could be anything but the bevel cut is black. These are not at all conservation or archival.

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You should tell cresent thier product doesn't exist then. Black core rag.

I have consistently used black mats with my work in the past and now I do about 50% with black and 50% with white. I print from infrared film and the black is very striking. But the buying public tends to think that the black might be too much for their houses. But when the same image in black is put next to the same image in white, the image in black completely out does the other. Really makes the focal point be on the image.