Graflex RB Series D Shutter Curtain repair

[robert.raymer]

Copying from my post on RF Furums...it has been suggested I post here as well...

I have recently come across a Series D that I was able to obtain at a great price. Originally I was going to try and take it apart and refurbish it from the ground up, but surprisingly, aside from some peeling leather everything is in great shape except for the shutter curtain, which has enough pinholes to effect the image on some, but not all settings, including one section that is about 2mm wide across more than half the width of the shutter that is missing quite a bit of rubber. Now Im toying with complete refurbishment, just replacing the curtain, or attempting a temporary repair until I make up my mind what I want to do long term.

I have heard a number of solutions, ranging from sharpie markers to fabric markers to elmers glue mixed with acrylic paint to liquid/spray electric tape. My concern is that I usually see these offered as solution to fix pinholes in either bellows or much smaller format cameras (it seems to be a popular fix for Leica's with burn holes from the sun), but I haven't seen anyone mention using them for large format focal plane shutters like speed graphics or Graflex SLR's.

Does anyone have experience good, bad, or otherwise with this type of curtain repair on a Graflex? Any tips or advice? Or should I just replace it completely?

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

[shutterfinger]

Have you heard of http://www.graflex.org/ ? On the helpboard Reflex Help section is a lengthy thread on curtail repair. https://graflex.org/helpboard/viewtopic.php?t=5624
Download this Graflex Shutter Repair article https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1sPJkp-MdghRkRId1EwT0dpNkk/view?usp=sharing
With the shutter removed, soak the deteriorating rubber sections in lacquer thinner for 1 to 3 minutes then scrape the rubber off with a rigid blade putty knife held 90° to the material. Wash the stripped area in warm soapy water then rinse.
Paint the stripped area with Golden Heavy Body Acrylic Artist paint #1040 Carbon Black diluted 50% with water with a fine bristle artist brush in 2 to 3 thin coats until the fabric is light tight.
The original thickness of the curtain was .007 inch. The rubber can swell and cause the curtain to become too thick to wind into the cavities in the body. Most bodies will tolerate .015 inch curtain thickness and some .025 inch thick.
Tears can be patched by gluing new fabric over the tear/break but equal amounts have to be added to each side of the curtain to keep it winding evenly.
Pin holes can be painted over without stripping the curtain.

What is the serial number of your camera?

 

[mshchem]

Copying from my post on RF Furums...it has been suggested I post here as well...

I have recently come across a Series D that I was able to obtain at a great price. Originally I was going to try and take it apart and refurbish it from the ground up, but surprisingly, aside from some peeling leather everything is in great shape except for the shutter curtain, which has enough pinholes to effect the image on some, but not all settings, including one section that is about 2mm wide across more than half the width of the shutter that is missing quite a bit of rubber. Now Im toying with complete refurbishment, just replacing the curtain, or attempting a temporary repair until I make up my mind what I want to do long term.

I have heard a number of solutions, ranging from sharpie markers to fabric markers to elmers glue mixed with acrylic paint to liquid/spray electric tape. My concern is that I usually see these offered as solution to fix pinholes in either bellows or much smaller format cameras (it seems to be a popular fix for Leica's with burn holes from the sun), but I haven't seen anyone mention using them for large format focal plane shutters like speed graphics or Graflex SLR's.

Does anyone have experience good, bad, or otherwise with this type of curtain repair on a Graflex? Any tips or advice? Or should I just replace it completely?

Thanks in advance for your help.

Does it have the rotating back? If it's a nice piece I would pay someone to clean it up. Cool old camera.

 

[robert.raymer]

Have you heard of http://www.graflex.org/ ? On the helpboard Reflex Help section is a lengthy thread on curtail repair. https://graflex.org/helpboard/viewtopic.php?t=5624
Download this Graflex Shutter Repair article https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1sPJkp-MdghRkRId1EwT0dpNkk/view?usp=sharing
With the shutter removed, soak the deteriorating rubber sections in lacquer thinner for 1 to 3 minutes then scrape the rubber off with a rigid blade putty knife held 90° to the material. Wash the stripped area in warm soapy water then rinse.
Paint the stripped area with Golden Heavy Body Acrylic Artist paint #1040 Carbon Black diluted 50% with water with a fine bristle artist brush in 2 to 3 thin coats until the fabric is light tight.
The original thickness of the curtain was .007 inch. The rubber can swell and cause the curtain to become too thick to wind into the cavities in the body. Most bodies will tolerate .015 inch curtain thickness and some .025 inch thick.
Tears can be patched by gluing new fabric over the tear/break but equal amounts have to be added to each side of the curtain to keep it winding evenly.
Pin holes can be painted over without stripping the curtain.

What is the serial number of your camera?

Thanks for all the info. I think I will try to paint over the pinholes first. Hopefully that will work.

Serial number is 294269 which should place it around 1941. None of the serial number lists I have seen show 4x5 Series D's being made then, however it would match the "EA" on the lens and would make sense with the US Navy sticker on it that is partly unreadable ("US Navy Pr**p 000095).

 

[shutterfinger]

Serial number is 294269 which should place it around 1941.

Its about the middle of an order for 200 4x5 RB Series D posted July 2, 1941. The next order was larger and posted 2 months later.

 

[robert.raymer]

puts it right there with my speed graphic #296588

 

[shutterfinger]

296588- about 1/3 the way into an order for 1500 posted 8/1/1941.

 

[removed account4]

Have you heard of http://www.graflex.org/ ? On the helpboard Reflex Help section is a lengthy thread on curtail repair. https://graflex.org/helpboard/viewtopic.php?t=5624
Download this Graflex Shutter Repair article https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1sPJkp-MdghRkRId1EwT0dpNkk/view?usp=sharing
With the shutter removed, soak the deteriorating rubber sections in lacquer thinner for 1 to 3 minutes then scrape the rubber off with a rigid blade putty knife held 90° to the material. Wash the stripped area in warm soapy water then rinse.
Paint the stripped area with Golden Heavy Body Acrylic Artist paint #1040 Carbon Black diluted 50% with water with a fine bristle artist brush in 2 to 3 thin coats until the fabric is light tight.
The original thickness of the curtain was .007 inch. The rubber can swell and cause the curtain to become too thick to wind into the cavities in the body. Most bodies will tolerate .015 inch curtain thickness and some .025 inch thick.
Tears can be patched by gluing new fabric over the tear/break but equal amounts have to be added to each side of the curtain to keep it winding evenly.
Pin holes can be painted over without stripping the curtain.

What is the serial number of your camera?

shutterfinger,

you rock !
thanks for this information !

i have a series d without this issue but
its wonderful you post the link AND
how to do it...
thanks for being so open and helpful
on how to fix these old and beautiful cameras !!

avid graflex user since 1988
john

 

[EdSawyer]

Agreed with the above. I have fixed pinholes in Graflex shutters with black acrylic paint, it works fine. Never stripped a full curtain but have read of others who have, with good luck.

 

[choiliefan]

I have an ancient 5X7 Press Graflex which appears to have had a thick coating of black acrylic paint applied to the curtain. It's light-tight, flexible and still aligns well with the slits vs tension settings. Seems to be an old repair.

 

[robert.raymer]

Decided to go the liquid electric tape route. Covered one of the larger areas on one curtain with the thinnest possible coating and it is now definitely light tight in that spot. Dried to touch in moments but seeing how it says it takes 24 hours to fully cure I will be waiting a day in between each curtain to make sure it doesn't stick when rolled and cause me more problems. Then it will be a matter of deciding which pinholes are large enough to effect the image and which can be left alone. After Im done and have some film through it Ill let everyone know how it turned out.

In the mean time I will be trying to figure out how to mount my Dallmeyer 8" Pentac (Currently mounted to a graflex "c" lens board to work with my speed graphic) to the camera with the smallest amount of modification possible.

 

[shutterfinger]

All pin holes will fog the film regardless of size.
I question if the liquid electrical tape will be flexible enough for the shutter curtain, probably won't be.

 

[Sirius Glass]

I hope liquid electric tape works, otherwise it will be a pain to remove.