Good 35 mm SLR for teaching photography?

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Stevopedia

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Hello, everyone.

I was wondering what 35 mm SLR you would suggest for somebody who was just starting in photography and learning about its basic principles. We all know about the Pentax K1000, the ubiquitous student's camera which many of us (including myself) cut our photographic teeth on, so to speak, but there must be other suitable bodies.

My question is, what are those cameras?
 

magic823

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My favorite to teach with is the Fujica ST-801. Tough, great meter (Silicon Blue instead of CdS) and uses LEDs instead of match needles - which are fragile. About the only thing you'll have to do with them is change the light seals and mirror bumper (easy, cheap job). Fujica glass is pretty darn good, but they take any M42 lenses, which are easy and cheap to find. A warning though, the Fujica glass isn't cheap - the collectors grab them up for rediculous prices on ebay.

I use one for my 35mm Infrared film.
 

MattKing

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Olympus OMG/20 - Inexpensive and takes all the OM lenses, while using easily obtained G13/SR44 batteries.

Also with LEDs in the viewfinder.

I would recommend the OM1 as well, although the battery issue is slightly more complex.

Matt
 

Paul Sorensen

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I have a few favorites from when I taught. I tended to recommend something pretty good, what with how low used prices are on these things.

Nikon FM or FE
Pentax K1000, MX or KX
Minolta SRT

I agree about the battery issue with the OM-1, it can make things challenging for the learner. The OM-2 rocks, however.

I am less fond of the Canon AE-1, becuase I find it infuriating to use for manual exposure. I know that many people disagree.

Actually, an inexpensive auto focus is okay as well, an EOS, a Nikon N65 or such, any of those. They are really lousy for manual focusing, but the exposure systems work well. Of course, they usually come with a lousy zoom lens, but that is a different story.
 

Pinholemaster

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My favorite camera I tell my students to get is the Pentax K-1000. Well built, simple in design, and fine optics.

My classes run the range of gear, though. We've had some break downs of Canon AE-1s. Everything else seems to work fine, except for batteries. I find those cameras that rely on batteries, instead of mechanical operations, then to frustrate the students.
 

jmcd

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My recommendation is to get a recently serviced camera, so it works properly and dependably, under warranty. For example, one can buy an AE-1 fully serviced and in great condition for around $100 from someone like Joe at slr35.com. Joe use to work for Canon. He will service other cameras for a reasonable fee.

The OM1 is a great camera, and K&S Camera Repair will fully service one for about $80, and for a little more convert it to use modern batteries. Ken there used to work as an Olympus repair tech.

364 W. Shaw Ave
Fresno , CA 93704
559 222 3686
 

Paul Goutiere

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I'd consider the Pentax Spotmatic or Canon FTB. Dirt cheap (don't seem to be collectible yet) and reliable (not much to go wrong)

Still very nice cameras.
 

GeoffHill

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EOS1n maybe. Can be had for not too much second hand. Very tough for student use, and is nice to use in manual mode, set up with the dial on the top for speed, and the dial on the back for aperature, yet still has Fast AF and good metering.

Has the flexibility of 3fps if you need it, but can switch it off if you dont. A camera that you probably wont need to replace, and has a good selection of glass available, which is interchangeale with dSLRs as well
 

mcgrattan

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P-series Pentaxes are also good. P30 or P50.

They can be used fully manually, or in program or aperture priority mode. Also, depth of field preview, which some of the others mentioned lack.
 

srs5694

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A model that's still in production is the Vivitar V3800N. It's similar to the Pentax K1000 in basic features, and takes the same K-mount lenses. I've got one and like it, although I generally opt for a camera with auto-exposure for most purposes. I can't say how rugged the V3800N is, though; it might not stand up to abuse.

Concerning the Fujica ST-801 mentioned earlier: It takes M42 screw-mount lenses, so if you don't insist on using Fuji lenses, you can get a good variety of used (and even a few new) lenses at decent prices. When using most non-Fuji lenses, though, you lose the open-aperture metering that Fuji's lenses provide. (Fuji had a unique lens aperture coupling system to enable open-aperture metering.)
 

bjorke

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Any. There are so many that can be had for a song, and all are fine.
 

srs5694

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Any. There are so many that can be had for a song, and all are fine.

I disagree, although admittedly mostly about some fairly unusual cameras. For instance, the Zenit AM and AM2 cameras (and I'm sure some others) lack manual exposure modes -- they can be used only in aperture-priority auto-exposure mode, with a fixed flash-sync shutter speed, or in bulb mode. You can't even tell what shutter speed the camera has chosen. This would make it harder to learn about the relationships between shutter speed and all the things it affects (motion blur, camera shake, etc.). IMHO, a good learning camera has a full-manual mode, ideally with a built-in meter (just as a convenience factor, to minimize the number of things a student must carry around).
 

Whiteymorange

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Any. There are so many that can be had for a song, and all are fine.

What he said..., though I tend to think that a K mount (Pentax, Ricoh, Sears, etc.) or an FD (Canon) mount system will get you maximum access to a lot of inexpensively priced lenses.
 

Steve Bellayr

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Let me put this in another perspective: When I purchased my second camera for my first film class I paid $200. In today's dollars it would be $1,129. Most of the cameras mentioned are under $200 with lens. Though all of them are very good & their optics fine. If the camera is for you or a member of your family I would, if economics allow, go higher. I'd go for the Nikon F3HP or the Canon F1 or the OM-4 (but there are fewer lenses here). They are relatively new and lenses are plentiful. Truth be spoken, this is not a cheap hobby.
 

tom_bw

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The K1000 has no depth of field preview if I remember correctly... If just learning, me thinks that having a DOF preview will help the 'student' get a feeling on what the affects of the aperture are (for a given focal length) without having to wait for the negatives to be developed.

Watch out for AE-1's, AT-1's, A-1's - with age the shutters start 'wheezing' - slowing down the whole mechanism. If I remember correctly (again), I believe this is a pre-cursor to a not-so-uncommon shutter failure.

Though you could get others cheaper, my preference is for a Nikon FM (or derivative). Just think of lenses - lots available, and the new AF ones work!
 

phenix

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I had Pentaxes, and still have one I gave to my wife because it is small, light, and has a very bright viewfinder (ME-Super). As for me, I cannot concieve a SLR without a matching needles system, and in Pentax there are few choices and some very expensive or rare. So I went to Ricoh, I also could buy here in Canada under the name of Sears (which saved me 100$ for the pro XR-2s rebranded).

What can give you a Pentax K1000 that its equivalent, the Ricoh KR-5 super (or A-50 super) cannot give? Yes, the speeds 1/4, and 1/2, as the KR-5 super stops at 1/8. But what it brings that Pentax doesnt, are: a selftimer, mirror lock-up (when using the selftimer, like with ALL Ricohs), a vertical metal courtain, and as result a X-synchro speed of 1/125, and I'm sure I've forgot other 2-3 features. Oh, but Ricoh has the uper and the bottom leads in plastic... Yes, so what? There are simple leads, and their plastic isn't more fragile than Pentaxes fine metal leads. As for the chasis, Ricoh's always metal ones are build like tanks (in part if not more rought than Pentax).

And you have choices: You want a total mechanical pro body, matching needles style, go for the Ricoh XR-1/XR-1s (the "s" means hot shue, if I recall). You want a pro body with aperture pryority, go for the XR-2/Xr-2s (with metal needles) or for the XR-7 (with LCD needles). You want a basic matching needle body, like the Pentax K1000, go for the KR-5 super ("super" is important, because the earlier KR-5 doesn't goes shorter than 1/500). And if you want to save money, buy the Sears branded equivalents - see Butkus page for K-mount bodies other than Pentax (it is the no. 1 resource):
http://www.butkus.org/chinon/index.html

And I forgot: besides the mirror lock-up feature all Ricohs have when using the selftimer, the bodies with electronic shooters have continuous shooting speeds, which means it does not jump, let say, from 1/125 directly to 1/250 or 1/60 by the smalest light variation! Does afordable Pentaxes do so? My wife's ME-Super doesn't! And like with electronic Pentaxes, Ricohs have a mechanical shooter speed for the X-synchro, in case the batteries leave you (mines keep already since 5 years, and still work, and I've shoot all this time about 50 rols per year per camera).

Finally, if you want a really cheap Ricoh, buy it "defective": with the mirror friesed in upper position. Almost no seller on eBay knows that when electronic Ricohs have no batteries anymore, the mirror locks-up. They think it is defective and sell it for nothing. All you have to do is to change the speed to the X-synchro or to B (both mechanical), and the mirror will come down. Put new batteries and all will work like new.

Really, Pentax always takes your money for every single feature it ads, while Ricoh gives you twice as much for nothing.

As for Vivitar/Cosina, they are great cameras, but with the 3-LED system, I don't recommend. Chinon might be a viable alternative, but I don't know much about. Look on Butkus' site.

Good luck!
 
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bjorke

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Zenit? You must be kidding. It would be only a student who was already a photo hound who would even know how to find such a beast.

But a week or so ago I saw an AE-1 selling for less than a the cost of shipping -- a big 51p
 

Chan Tran

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The Nikon FM because it's better and less expensive than the highly recommended Pentax K1000
 

aparat

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I second all recommendations to buy a Nikon camera. They're ususally really good (even the lowly FG) and their lenses can be used on even the most modern cameras. I have an FM2n, and I think it would make a great starter camera, as would the much cheaper FG.

There are so many options. It's a pity that most of these cameras are out of production, so the student can't just go to a photo store and pick out a camera that suits them. I guess only Nikon (FM10) and Vivitar have new manual cameras still available. I have read that Kodak might soon be introducing a student manual camera.

aparat
 

Mark Antony

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I would buy one of two systems
Nikon
F2, F3, or FM, FM2 all good solid manual cameras the F2 (I have one) can use the older cheap lenses (non AI) and is very rugged and simple.
I bought this lot for a little over £200
60980100.jpg

Rough as hell but works like a swiss watch- mechanical.

Canon
F1, F1n
I had an F1n for years and must say its a very underrated camera. Viewfinder thats so bright it seems to intensify and is better than most modern cameras.
Electro-mechanical shutter, that is with a battery you get a very accurate smooth action shutter, sans battery you get a manual camera with speeds 1/60-1/2000.
The F1 gives you access to the cheap but great FD lenses like:
24mm f1.4L
50mm F1.2L
85mm F1.2L
135mm F2
Of course there are cheaper still non L FDs with normal apertures a great lens is the 100mm F2,8 which is a great performer for £50
59819421.jpg

Mark
 

srs5694

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Zenit? You must be kidding. It would be only a student who was already a photo hound who would even know how to find such a beast.

You did say "any." That's a strong word. Besides which, my mention of those two Zenit models was an example. I'd be shocked if there weren't others with the same lack of manual-exposure ability, although I can't name any others.
 

Akki14

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Praktica BCA is A-priority too. i learned partly on one and my dad's Nikon FG which i still use (but doesn't have DOF preview). And my Zenit EM kit came from a charity shop window. Common as muck over here as far as I can tell.
 
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