Glassless for Durst M600?

I am enlarging in my bathroom, and I am back to using my old M600. I have a Besseler M45 that I purchased because I wanted to print from 4x5" negs. That is where I fell in love with glassless carriers. However, I don't have the room to set up the M45 at the moment. I am just happy to be printing again. Do they make a glassless for the M600. Any tips to cut down on dust and Newton's rings if there is not such a critter?

Thanks,
Chris Maness

They did make glassless inserts for the neg carrier, but good luck finding them these days. You should be able to make one yourself fairly easily. It is simply a chunk of metal with the proper size window cut out (but you could use any material of same thickness as glass plate now in carrier). You can get the outer dimensions from the glass in the carrier now.
I have only the 35mm mask, have been meaning to make up some for 4x4 and 6x6 but haven't gotten around to it yet.
I also have the glass insert, but dust and newton rings (I do not have the AN glass and can't find it) have been a problem so only printing 35mm as of now.

This carrier has the little mask blades that are adjustable. I was thinking about just trying it without the glass. If that doesn't work, I have a friend that teaches a fabrication class that might be able to help me make one.

Chris

I don't think you would be able to use the blades to hold your negs, they are below the "film plane", focus would be an issue, and I doubt they would be kind to your neg even if focus were possible.
Fabrication is your only option if you wish to go glassless. You might try some mat board, may be sufficient, if not you're only out a piece of mat and 10 minutes work.

Yes, I realize that I can't use the blades for a holder, but I was thinking about the masking that you were referring to only to block the extra light from the negative. That way you would not need a different mask for 35mm. You would be able to use the same carrier for both. I think that is how it is designed as the glass does not need to be changed when you use 35mm.

Chris

Maybe I'm not understanding correctly, but I don't see how one mask could be used for multiple neg sizes. If you tried to mount a 35mm neg on a 6x6 glassless carrier it would simply fall through the 6x6 opening.
I am not familiar with other glassless carriers, maybe they have a different design. With the M600 the glassless carrier is a sheet of metal with an opening slightly smaller than the negative size.

Ok, now I understand the issue. I was thinking if I had longer strips of film it would not be such an issue, but then again, I could imagine that the film would be sagging in the middle causing focus issues.

Chris

Ahh, I was able to score a 35mm and 6x6cm glassless carrier on ebay so they do exist. I had to buy the whole head to go with it, but it was still cheap.

Chris

You should go buy a lottery ticket, I've been looking for years for the 6x6! Figures the one week I don't look one pops up...but what I really want is the 4x4...will probably show up 3 days after Efke anounces they are stopping 127 production.
Nice find, and enjoy!
Now off to scour ebay...

Do NOT go stock---what you do is put a spacing plate in the indentation where the negative carrier goes (the one with the glass)---I used that foam tape--you can use cardboard--THEN--get yourself a couple of OMEGA holder for the little one---the b-2 I think...the one for medium format---I use the durst for 6x6 and 35mm using the omega neg carriers--you need the extra spacer because the omega carriers curve at the edges and will let light leak otherwise---otherwise, you can fit anything else in there---I've been doing this since I got it and one month later (about 20 years ago) got sick of newton rings---after that i's been the omega carriers--never a problem EXCEPT for popping....so use glassless omegas BUT pre-heat the negative--I use a cardboard in the below lens filter holder to keep light from hitting the paper...I pre-heat---focus the pre-heated negative on the easel, then put the cardboard below the lens to block the light to the easel--I pout the paper in the easel and I put my hand below the lens--remove the cardboard...wait for any vibration to die down and remove my hand and start counting at that point...works amazingling well and you can get the omega carriers cheep---or anything else that fits....

I have recently acquired a Durst M600 and a F30
the M600 came missing some parts and lenses, i since ordered the lenses but cant find the o"opal glass plate" anywhere. I however am a glassblower by trade and can prepare a square of borosilicate glass for it. My question on that is does any one know the exact size and thickness?
The F30 came with no lens at all, but im hoping they are interchangeable?

I have not used an enlarger since High School and am grateful for any help you can provide.

Thanks Karl T

Lensboard on the F30 looks like it is threaded for "Leica" thread or M39 thread. Lenses will screw into in to the board on that one, and yes, you could share the lenses. However, the M600 might also have a lensboard with threads, but many of the larger Durst enlargers could be fitted with a number of different lensboards with different threads or special rapid interchange mounts.
I don't have the M600 manual... the M700 manual does not mention the opal glass plate.
Leigh saw Edmund's assortment of opal glass and and posted a link to it on another forum:
https://www.edmundoptics.com/optics/windows-diffusers/optical-diffusers/Opal-Diffusing-Glass/

I found a pdf of the manual, But it does not stat the actual size of both the clear and opal glass plates, I assume they go in the slide out carrier so I can get the size from that,
But not the thickness.
I also saw a complete set for sale of the whole enlarger and sent an email to the person whom posted it asking for assistance in measuring the glass.

Thank you for your reply ic-racer

Ok, I found the M600 manual. So do you know if it has the SIXTUB and or the SIXPLA lensboard? It will make a difference as to which lens (50 or 80) you get. Also, the lens boards could be the small M25 mount or the M39 mount.
So, to enlarge 120 format (6x6cm) you need the SIXPLA and you need an 80mm lens threaded for the lensboard, either m25 or m39. Sometimes M25 is a blessing, because the lenses can be cheap. I got a M25 Schneider Componon (six element) 80mm for $5.

Best way to get the size is to measure your enlarger and see what size glass it takes. If you can make your own opal glass that is great.

Hi, I will attach some photos so you can see what i have and what i ordered.

Karl Termini said:

Hi, I will attach some photos so you can see what i have and what i ordered.

Click to expand...

the f30 came with no lens board or lens

i assume that the glass fits in this?

The M600, M605, M605, and the M670 use the same carrier inserts. The 6x7 inserts will only work with the M670, etc but all the others are the same. As Durst originally intended you would leave the glass plate in the top or the anti-Newton ring replacement glass and use a metal insert plate in the bottom, later folks would buy two glassless and use top and bottom and even later Durst came out with a slightly larger insert intended for the top position, hint if you use two of the larger inserts you can print full frame with the borders. The rarest set might be the 645 set, it took me years to find a set. You can make your own sets from cheap carriers a saw and a file, make them from small metal plates or print with a 3d printer. https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1828189

Karl Termini said:

i assume that the glass fits in this?View attachment 193602

Click to expand...

That looks like a filter holder.