Giving up on the v35, back to the 23C

logan2z · Dec 8, 2019

I have both a Focomat v35 and a Beseler 23CII XL in my darkroom. I love the v35 - it really is a nice piece of engineering - but the original Philips bulbs are long out of production and the available replacements are far too dim, resulting in unacceptably long exposures. So, I've started to use my 23C again, which I would have needed anyway since I recently picked up a medium format camera. My only issue with the 23C is negative popping. I'm using the correct bulb and I have the heat absorbing glass but I still see my negatives drift out of focus as they heat up. An anti-newton glass carrier is probably the best solution but the one for 35mm from Beseler is a bit pricey and I don't see one available for 6x6.

Has anyone ever successfully converted the standard 35mm or 6x6 carriers to anti-newton glass? I assume it must be possible but I haven't found any threads that mention it.

Ian C · Dec 8, 2019

Buy the 6 x 9 carrier and use if for all formats. They can often be found used on eBay for a reasonable price.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Beseler-80...031524?hash=item1cdf099564:g:C7sAAOSwmeNd6cJo

You don’t necessarily need ANR top glass if you make a paper mask to provide space between the shiny top of the negative and the bottom surface of the top glass. This spaces the negative from the top glass and prevents Newton rings. Even with the mask, the negative stays flat enough to produce a uniformly-focused projection.

I use black construction paper of the type used for art projects for young school children. The mask is like a miniature print mat. The window can be cut out with single-edge safety razor or X-acto knife. Guide the blade with a steel ruler. You can make the layout with a soft-lead silver pencil, such as the Prismacolor Verithin Silver #735. You can make masks for each format you enlarge. The mask will block spill light when enlarging smaller formats. Just use two separate strips across the ends of the frame for 120/220 negatives.

https://www.dickblick.com/items/20509-9300/

You can also used exposed and fixed RC paper if you want a thicker mat. Position the black side upward.

bernard_L · Dec 8, 2019

I know that is an answer to a question you did not ask. Concerning the V35. Did you try replacing not only the bulb, but also the socket, and use an easily available bulb of similar size, voltage, and power. I did this on a V35 sold at my local charity, so it is possible, but unfortunately I cannot be more specific as I did not make notes. Having a V35 donated to the charity was such an extra-ordinary event that I did not expect it to repeat...

logan2z · Dec 8, 2019

bernard_L said:
I know that is an answer to a question you did not ask. Concerning the V35. Did you try replacing not only the bulb, but also the socket, and use an easily available bulb of similar size, voltage, and power. I did this on a V35 sold at my local charity, so it is possible, but unfortunately I cannot be more specific as I did not make notes. Having a V35 donated to the charity was such an extra-ordinary event that I did not expect it to repeat...

I've tried a variety of replacement bulbs in the v35 but none of them were bright enough. The replacements are similar size and voltage but my understanding is that they don't have the same beam angle as the originals so quite a bit of light is lost inside the mixing box.

I figure if I'm going to use the 23C for medium format then I may as well find a solution to the negative popping issue that also works for 35mm.

logan2z · Dec 8, 2019

Ian C said:
Buy the 6 x 9 carrier and use if for all formats. They can often be found used on eBay for a reasonable price.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Beseler-80...031524?hash=item1cdf099564:g:C7sAAOSwmeNd6cJo

You don’t necessarily need ANR top glass if you make a paper mask to provide space between the shiny top of the negative and the bottom surface of the top glass. This spaces the negative from the top glass and prevents Newton rings. Even with the mask, the negative stays flat enough to produce a uniformly-focused projection.

I use black construction paper of the type used for art projects for young school children. The mask is like a miniature print mat. The window can be cut out with single-edge safety razor or X-acto knife. Guide the blade with a steel ruler. You can make the layout with a soft-lead silver pencil, such as the Prismacolor Verithin Silver #735. You can make masks for each format you enlarge. The mask will block spill light when enlarging smaller formats. Just use two separate strips across the ends of the frame for 120/220 negatives.

https://www.dickblick.com/items/20509-9300/

You can also used exposed and fixed RC paper if you want a thicker mat. Position the black side upward.

Thanks for the suggestions. I had seen the 6x9 Universal carrier but thought that the lack of AN glass might pose a problem. Maybe I should pick one up and make a mask and see how it goes.

BMbikerider · Dec 8, 2019

[QUOTE

Has anyone ever successfully converted the standard 35mm or 6x6 carriers to anti-newton glass? I assume it must be possible but I haven't found any threads that mention it.[/QUOTE]

The short answer is yes. I have an LPL7700 with both the multiformat masking frame and the glassless 120(645) and 35mm versions. I prefer the glassless ones but like you I get the negatives 'popping'. This I have sorted on the 35mm carrier by using half of a anti Newton Ring glass from a 6x7 slide mount. I managed to cut the glass in half and then using superglue to fix it to the upper half of the glassless negative carrier with the diffused surface facing the negative. Only a very small dot of superglue is needed, but the surface where it is to be stuck needs to 'roughened up' to provide a key so the glue will stick. The surface of the glass and the carrier will benefit the adhesion if the surfaces are cleaned with something like isopropyl alcohol or methylated spirits.

I have used it like this for about 18 months with no problem at all.

ic-racer · Dec 8, 2019

The glass for the conversion of a non-glass holder may cost more than the correct glass holder unless you have spare AN glass laying around.

Until you get the glass carrier, you might try keeping the enlarger light on for 30 seconds watching with the magnifier and then re-focus when the negative heats up and put the lenscap on. Then put the paper in the easel with the enlarger light still on. Then turn the timer to "TIME" or whatever to turn the light off and quickly remove the lencap and expose. I did it that way for years until I made or acquired glass carriers for all 5 of my enlargers. I have 8 glass carriers in all.

logan2z · Dec 9, 2019

ic-racer said:
The glass for the conversion of a non-glass holder may cost more than the correct glass holder unless you have spare AN glass laying around.

Until you get the glass carrier, you might try keeping the enlarger light on for 30 seconds watching with the magnifier and then re-focus when the negative heats up and put the lenscap on. Then put the paper in the easel with the enlarger light still on. Then turn the timer to "TIME" or whatever to turn the light off and quickly remove the lencap and expose. I did it that way for years until I made or acquired glass carriers for all 5 of my enlargers. I have 8 glass carriers in all.

I've essentially been doing this, except I'm using an under-the-lens red filter instead of a lens cap. Seems to do the trick in the interim.

ic-racer · Dec 10, 2019

Not sure about your negative carrier, but on the Philips, the glassless inserts can be replaced with glass. In this case I used some scrap anti-newton glass and cut two pieces (one clear and one AN) to the corrects size to fit the negative carrier.

Hilo · Dec 11, 2019

Ian C said:
You don’t necessarily need ANR top glass if you make a paper mask to provide space between the shiny top of the negative and the bottom surface of the top glass. This spaces the negative from the top glass and prevents Newton rings. Even with the mask, the negative stays flat enough to produce a uniformly-focused projection.

I use black construction paper of the type used for art projects for young school children. The mask is like a miniature print mat. The window can be cut out with single-edge safety razor or X-acto knife. Guide the blade with a steel ruler. You can make the layout with a soft-lead silver pencil, such as the Prismacolor Verithin Silver #735. You can make masks for each format you enlarge. The mask will block spill light when enlarging smaller formats. Just use two separate strips across the ends of the frame for 120/220 negatives.

To find the right negative holder at a good price needs time and patience. But in the end you will always succeed. Save your searches and you will get automated emails when something is put online. In the mean time Ian is right: just prevent your film to touch the upper glass. That is so simple, anyone can do this and it takes 5 minutes. Use the thin-but-still rigid black carton, or black pvc sheet. In the pictures you see what I made for the Focomat Ic or Valoy II that lack the AN glass. The set up is a little different, because here the condenser presses flat the negative and Leitz made an AN glass ring that slides on to the condenser. But the principle is the same . . .

David Brown · Dec 11, 2019

We have 8 Beseler 23C's in the teaching darkroom where I teach. We have converted them all to off-the-shelf LED bulbs. These are the 23C's that use standard Edison screws mount bulbs. Some of the older ones (and yours may be one) has the smaller bulbs. Anyway, I was skeptical at first, because I didn't think the contrast filters would work properly with the LED bulbs, but they do. Your mileage may vary, and it might take some experimenting with different LEDs, but that is certainly one potential solution to the heat issue.

fiddle · Dec 11, 2019

I bought one of the glass 6x9 carriers, then replaced the top glass with anr replacement glass from

http://store.khbphotografix.com/Anti-Newton-Glass-for-Beseler-23C-6x9-Glass-Negative-Carriers.html

Was cheaper than finding an actual anr holder. All in all was probably 80$ which I thought was reasonable.

logan2z · Dec 11, 2019

David Brown said:
We have 8 Beseler 23C's in the teaching darkroom where I teach. We have converted them all to off-the-shelf LED bulbs. These are the 23C's that use standard Edison screws mount bulbs. Some of the older ones (and yours may be one) has the smaller bulbs. Anyway, I was skeptical at first, because I didn't think the contrast filters would work properly with the LED bulbs, but they do. Your mileage may vary, and it might take some experimenting with different LEDs, but that is certainly one potential solution to the heat issue.

Interesting. You might find this useful:

https://www.paulglover.net/20140108...ghtsource-part-1-investigating-possibilities/

destroya · Dec 13, 2019

i have used the new replacement bulbs and the original bulbs on my v35 and did not notice much of a difference; maybe im lucky. I think I still have 2 NOS of the origianl bulb, but had to pay a premium for them. they are very very hard to find today. I also have a 23ciii, but still prefer the v35 for 35mm negs. its just a nice piece of equipment

john

logan2z · Dec 13, 2019

destroya said:
i have used the new replacement bulbs and the original bulbs on my v35 and did not notice much of a difference; maybe im lucky. I think I still have 2 NOS of the origianl bulb, but had to pay a premium for them. they are very very hard to find today. I also have a 23ciii, but still prefer the v35 for 35mm negs. its just a nice piece of equipment

john

There are several vendors selling replacement bulbs that fit the v35, which ones do you have? I have purchased bulbs from replacementlightbulbs.com and from KHB. The ones from KHB are brighter, but I still get relatively long exposure times with them.

Like you, I enjoy using the v35 but ultimately found it frustrating, Since I've recently starting shooting some medium format film and will be using the 23C for making prints from those negatives, I figure I may as well just use the Beseler for everything. I'll probably hang onto the v35 in case I do manage to find a bulb that works well enough at some point.

Giving up on the v35, back to the 23C

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