Getting Ready for First Time: Paterson Tank Question

RattyMouse · Dec 27, 2013

Ok, I have my stock solutions, I have my first roll of film ready to go, almost ready to develop it for the first time. However, now that I look closely at my Paterson tank, some questions arise.

1. Is the lid supposed to snap on and hold by itself? Mine does not, it just lays on the top. If I invert the tank the lid will fall right off if I dont hold it on. Seems like a horrible design unless I'm missing something.

2. Does everyone use the provided agitator? I never read about anyone using this so I'm wondering if just inversions provide enough agitation. Yes, no?

Thanks for your help!

R.Gould · Dec 27, 2013

Turn the patterson tank lid until it locks, I often use the twiddle stick for agitation, it works for me as well as inversion, for 5 seconds turn 5 times, for 10 turn ten times Ect, but remember to turn a few turns one way and then as few the other

TheToadMen · Dec 27, 2013

What model of tank do you have?

RattyMouse · Dec 27, 2013

R.Gould said:
Turn the patterson tank lid until it locks, I often use the twiddle stick for agitation, it works for me as well as inversion, for 5 seconds turn 5 times, for 10 turn ten times Ect, but remember to turn a few turns one way and then as few the other

Thank you! I re-looked at my tank, trying to follow your directions and found that it does not turn at all to lock. Rather, I just need to push down a lot harder for the seal to form. Not sure how I missed this the first time. I guess I am nervous!!

Do you think it is OK I skip using the agitator and just use inversions as my source of agitation?

Thanks again!

RattyMouse · Dec 27, 2013

TheToadMen said:
What model of tank do you have?

Super System 4.

nsurit · Dec 27, 2013

I've never used the stick for agitation. Inversion is fine. Remember you aren't making a martini. You don't have to shake it to within an inch of its life. Think gentle. Bill Barber

RattyMouse · Dec 27, 2013

nsurit said:
I've never used the stick for agitation. Inversion is fine. Remember you aren't making a martini. You don't have to shake it to within an inch of its life. Think gentle. Bill Barber

Thanks Bill!

Newt_on_Swings · Dec 27, 2013

Make sure the inner funnel lid is locked in by turning until it clicks, or the 1st time you dump your developer out it will fall out too! The top lid is pressed on with a little bit of force, I like to also press the top center area of the lid to get excess air out before i seal the edge. This helps especially for fixing, as it allows for a bit more gas buildup when fixing, and you wont have fixer being forced out the edges. Keep the lids off these when not in use, as if you keep them locked on they deform faster and start leaking quicker that way.

K-G · Dec 27, 2013

1 . Be SURE that the inner funnel is locked before inverting the tank. The funnel falling off and the films exposed during development is an experience you can be without. Don't ask me how I know .

2. Yes , it is absolutely OK to skip the agitator and just invert.

3. As Newt_on_Swings state the top lid needs a litle force but that can vary quite a lot between the different combinations of individual tanks and lids.

4. Read 1. again .

Good luck !

Karl-Gustaf

Truzi · Dec 27, 2013

If it's your first time, you might want to run through the process without film a couple times. Just put the empty reels in the tank, and use water. This way you can be relatively sure everything is seated correctly. Do this a few days before you actually develop the film so you don't feel rushed.

I wish somebody had told me I wasn't making a martini the first time I developed film. I took the word "agitate" literally and really shook the tank hard. If I had been told instead to invert, my first roll would have turned out differently. Even after I learned to do it correctly, I didn't understand the role of agitation until I started reading APUG.

Tom1956 · Dec 27, 2013

Any of those grey caps I've ever seen had splits in them after all these years. Watch out--the plastic they made them out of splits easily now. They don't stay on, they just split worse.

gone · Dec 27, 2013

My experiences with the little twisty stick did not go well. At all. Lots of surge marks no matter how gently I twirled it. I went to the inversion method and things straightened out. To each their own, but this was my experience. My method of inversion is a gentle, twisty turn to the inversions, and if I twist it rightish the first time, I twist it leftish the second. Repeat as necessary. There are youtube videos to better illustrate this.

Hatchetman · Dec 27, 2013

Practice putting the film on the reel with an unused roll of film. Obviously you will have to sacrifice a roll, but well worth it. Getting the roll on the reel can be a huge pain. Sometimes it goes on easy as pie. One of the mysteries of life.

RattyMouse · Dec 27, 2013

K-G said:
1 . Be SURE that the inner funnel is locked before inverting the tank. The funnel falling off and the films exposed during development is an experience you can be without. Don't ask me how I know .

4. Read 1. again .

Good luck !

Karl-Gustaf

Heh heh heh.....thanks for helping out with your experience!

RattyMouse · Dec 27, 2013

Truzi said:
If it's your first time, you might want to run through the process without film a couple times. Just put the empty reels in the tank, and use water. This way you can be relatively sure everything is seated correctly. Do this a few days before you actually develop the film so you don't feel rushed.

I wish somebody had told me I wasn't making a martini the first time I developed film. I took the word "agitate" literally and really shook the tank hard. If I had been told instead to invert, my first roll would have turned out differently. Even after I learned to do it correctly, I didn't understand the role of agitation until I started reading APUG.

I'm a graduate degreed chemist so I am sure I can do this process once I have it committed to memory. As I began mentally preparing, I noted a few holes in my process and posted to clear that up. Thanks to the help from you and everyone else here, I'm just about ready. Tonight should be film loading day. I didnt buy a changing bag yet so have to wait until nightfall. There's no other way to make a room in my house perfectly dark.

RattyMouse · Dec 27, 2013

Hatchetman said:
Practice putting the film on the reel with an unused roll of film. Obviously you will have to sacrifice a roll, but well worth it. Getting the roll on the reel can be a huge pain. Sometimes it goes on easy as pie. One of the mysteries of life.

Yes, I have done this, many times. I think I can do it in the dark and will know for sure VERY soon.

Truzi · Dec 27, 2013

To be safe when loading your film, since you can't make a room light-tight, you can get under some thick blankets. Make sure they are not the type that create static and sparks.
Alternatively, go into a closet.

R.Gould · Dec 28, 2013

Before loading the reel run a sharp pencil around the film loading groves, makes loading the film 20 times easier.

RattyMouse · Dec 28, 2013

OK, it took 20 mins or so, but my first roll of film is now loaded up in the tank! I practiced quite a lot and could do it both with my eyes closed as well as in the dark room. But I practiced using Fuji Acros and my first real roll was Tri-X. Tri-X seems waaay more difficult to roll. Not sure why but this film was much tighter, hard to keep slightly unrolled during the threading process.

Anyway, it's loaded in. I hope I dont have too many finger prints on the film. I handled it a lot more than I thought I would.

Tomorrow is developing day.

markbarendt · Dec 28, 2013

Giggle

You are doing fine RattyMouse. A "real" roll is often harder, just a mental thing because there is something to lose. With experience all films will get easier.

Like you my first tries took quite a while, now if my hands are in the dark bag for more than a minute for a given roll I'm surprised.

Truzi · Dec 28, 2013

Cool. You'll get faster at it, don't worry. There is a bit of a mental block between practice and production.

Nothing beats seeing the images when you are finally done processing, but a successful load onto a reel can be almost as exciting when you first start out.

baachitraka · Dec 28, 2013

Tank may leak during agitation but do not worry...

Chris Livsey · Dec 28, 2013

You may find it harder to load in a changing bag than a room because of the increase in humidity. The longer you struggle in the bag the warmer and moister it gets in there. This leads to a film where the emulsion swells and begins to stick to those Paterson reels. If you are struggling, quit for a while as the bag and you cool down. Before you start make sure the small ball bearings are free to move as well. Moisture on the reels is the enemy and yes there is a large variation on how different films handle because of how long they have sat before exposure and how long after encouraging a curl in or out, some cameras reverse wind that can make it worse or conversely with some films better. I suspect some of the X-ray or surveillance films would make the pope utter some latin which he would rather not be overheard.

MattKing · Dec 28, 2013

RattyMouse said:
OK, it took 20 mins or so, but my first roll of film is now loaded up in the tank! I practiced quite a lot and could do it both with my eyes closed as well as in the dark room. But I practiced using Fuji Acros and my first real roll was Tri-X. Tri-X seems waaay more difficult to roll. Not sure why but this film was much tighter, hard to keep slightly unrolled during the threading process.

Anyway, it's loaded in. I hope I dont have too many finger prints on the film. I handled it a lot more than I thought I would.

Tomorrow is developing day.

Each type of film is a bit different, and you will encounter differences between films of the same type, due to differences in storage and sealing technique.

Once you have loaded a few, you will find it easy to adjust between most differences (with a few extreme exceptions).

You will also become attuned to the sound and feel of the film and reels, which also makes a big difference.

madisonhall224 · Dec 28, 2013

I found quickly that the plastic Patterson reels can be difficult to load if the reels are wet. So if you do multiple batches, you may find that drying the reels with a hair dryer may make for a more pleasant experience. I still have my Patterson tank and reels from 20 years ago, but if I ever have access to steel reels, I prefer those. Once I got up the courage to use steel reels, I found them to actually be easier to load, even though that seems impossible until you try it

Getting Ready for First Time: Paterson Tank Question

Moderator

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency