Getting into Medium: Questions.

And now for my $0.02

I tried the TLR thing with a C220. Really nice piece of kit, but neither the TLR way of life nor 6x6 float my boat. I was a hair's-breadth away from actually ordering a Kiev 60 from ARAX when I did some quick research on the M645. The prices at KEH demonstrated that I could get an M645 1000S with an 80mm for roughly the same price as a Kiev 60; and I really prefer the 645 format.

So, for me it ended up being 645 and SLR!

Kent

kaiyen said:

I'm actually going to disagree with Ole just a bit here - I didn't feel 645 was that big of a jump from 35mm, but 6x6 really did. I rarely ever crop, so I generally got the full 6x6 to work with. I found that if I wanted a bigger neg, I always went 6x6 or bigger. And if I wanted a smaller camera and quicker operation, I went all the way down to 35mm. My 645 RF got lost in the process, which is a big reason why I sold it.allan

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Thanks Ole and kaiyen. The reason I asked was that the latest Mamiya 645 was reviewed in a recent Black & White Photography magazine (the UK one) and the reviewer commented that he didn't think it was a huge step up from 35mm.

Then on the Mamiya user forum I saw a message from a wedding photographer who uses 645 for most shots and 6x7 for the formal bride and groom stuff, in case anyone wants a really big enlargement. He said you couldn't tell the difference between 645 and 6x7 all the way up to 11x14 and only a slight difference at 16x20. It would be interesting to know what people here think about that.

Kevin

kdanks said:

Thanks Ole and kaiyen. The reason I asked was that the latest Mamiya 645 was reviewed in a recent Black & White Photography magazine (the UK one) and the reviewer commented that he didn't think it was a huge step up from 35mm.

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Kevin,
I cannot speak to 6x7 and up, but I can definitely tell you, from my experience, that for all intents and purposes, 645 is just like 6x6. Just because of 35mm, I'm used to framing in rectangles, and printing, by its very nature, makes me think in rectangles. I found that in 6x6, there was wasted film. With 645 I get 15-16 frames per roll and nothing is lost.

IMHO, the difference between 35mm and 645 is huge and in my own enlargements, using equivalent film and developer combinations, I can see a world of difference especially at 8x10.

Just my $0.02.

Kent

I rarely print at any other size than 24x30cm (9.5x12"), at which size the difference between 35mm and 645 is painfully obvious. With FP4+ in both sizes I can focus on the grain in 35mm, but 645 and up I have to find details in the negative to focus on. This translates to smoother tones in the finished print, which again means that I very rarely use 35mm film...

I am a former 645 shooter and I agree with most here that the difference is really substantial between 35mm and 645. If you like to print square, then the 6x6 will be quite a bit more negative than 645, but if you like to print rectangular, then they are pretty much the same. (Except, of course, that the 6x6 allows you to print any frame in either a portrait or landscape format, which is kind of nice to be able to do in the darkroom.)

I ended up replacing my Mamiya 645 with an RB67 and I am glad that I did. Mostly this is because I shoot from a tripod and the RB is more convenient on a tripod thanks to the rotating back. I also appreciate the larger negative and the leaf shutter for strobe work. If you like handholding, I think that the mamiya 645 is an excellent choice and the prices are great. If you like to work on a tripod, then I think that the advantages of the RB are pretty significant. (It can certainly be handheld, but it is at a disadvantage there compared to the 645)

However, if you really want to print square, I agree with the folks recommending the Bronica, it is really a nice piece and it is available for a very good price on eBay or KEH. Heck, I just priced some stuff on KEH and it was looking like a nice setup in bargain condition should run you no more than about $300. I am tempted, but I have too many cameras!

I am sure that if you wait a bit for Hasselblad to discontinue their V series then you will be able to pick them up in good prices. They feature them in their 2006 catalogue so maybe next year.

Paul Sorensen said:

I am tempted, but I have too many cameras!

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Sorry that last sentence makes no sense, what is "too many cameras "?

digiconvert said:

what is "too many cameras "?

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A good example of "oxymoron".

I thought 11 LF cameras were enough - until I came across number 12.

I think the people who don't notice much difference between 35mm and 645 are falling victim of a psychological pheomenon rather than working from empirical evidence. I can understand it, we all have the "yes, but it feels like ____" moments with different things, but the fact is, just do the simple math. There is a huge difference - there has to be. Which is not to say that if it doesn't feel right to you then you are wrong to go a different direction (6x6, 6x7, etc) - after all, how you feel about what you're doing, in my humble opinion, has a huge effect on how well you work with it. If it "just feels right" you are likely to get closer to the results you want, simply because you are in the right "head space"... Just my opinon, though...

Peter