Gas proof plastic bottles?

FRANOL · Feb 21, 2012

I have put Rodinal in glass bottles because original plastic bottle (PE-HD) is not gas proof.Which kind of plastic bottles are gas proof?Thanks.

fotch · Feb 21, 2012

Marked on the bottom will be "PET" and a "1" inside a triangle. However, Glass is class, first class.

Ian Grant · Feb 21, 2012

The Agfa Rodinal bottles are gas proof as you put it and these are still being used by the various suppliers who have Rodinal packed today albeit under their own trade names. Howver the Orwo/Calbe bottles are different and not so good.

I have had problems with developers oxidising through low density plastic bottles, and have also lost developing agents (Pyrocatechin) stored in these containers as well.

I keep all my old dev bottles for re-use and have never had any issues at all with Rodinal bottles, or Ilford dev bottles, in fact I've Pyrocat HD made up in water tht's fine after 2 years stored in a Rodinal bottle,

Ian

FRANOL · Feb 21, 2012

Thanks!

railwayman3 · Feb 21, 2012

fotch said:
Marked on the bottom will be "PET" and a "1" inside a triangle. However, Glass is class, first class.

Just checked a couple of unopened Rodinal bottles, 125ml, from the AgfaPhoto period, maybe 5-6 years old. The marking is "PET-HD" with a "2" inside a triangle. Is there likely to be a problem with the solution in these...it's very dark (darker than I would expect from fresh product).

R.Gould · Feb 21, 2012

I have used Rodinal, from Agfa that was over ten years old, stored in the agfa plastic bottle, that was very dark indeed, perfect, I wouldn't worry about Rodinal in palstic bottles, it's keeping properties are legendery, I have seen rodinal stored in plastic bottles from the 1980's used this centuary, very dark, but that is common with Rodinal, but it is perfect.
Richard

FRANOL · Feb 21, 2012

FRANOL said:
I have put Rodinal in glass bottles because original plastic bottle (PE-HD) is not gas proof.Which kind of plastic bottles are gas proof?Thanks.

..and num. 2 in the triangle. (PE-HD,2 in triangle)

RalphLambrecht · Feb 21, 2012

FRANOL said:
I have put Rodinal in glass bottles because original plastic bottle (PE-HD) is not gas proof.Which kind of plastic bottles are gas proof?Thanks.

coke bottles are,but i would never store chemicals in food containers!

FRANOL · Feb 21, 2012

fotch said:
Marked on the bottom will be "PET" and a "1" inside a triangle. However, Glass is class, first class.

"There is a 100 bottles on the wall,
Ooops...there is a 99 bottles on the wall"

"There is a 100 plastic bottles on the wall,
Oooooops.......there is a 100 bottles on the wall"

This plastic version is a never ending song

holmburgers · Feb 21, 2012

Best darkroom bottles ever?? -> Dead Link Removed

brianmquinn · Feb 21, 2012

I agree these look to be perfect! I'll have to order a case.

charlief64 · Feb 21, 2012

I am going to put in an out and out plug here. I love glass. Easy to clean. Never a doubt as to permeability. After extensive comparison shopping I found this site to have the best prices on glass bottles. You don't have to buy hundreds at a time and their shipping prices are pretty low. Check 'em out. I have NO connection with this supplier.
www.specialtybottle.com

Roger Cole · Feb 22, 2012

Glass breaks when dropped not only destroying the bottle and scattering glass but spilling the contents. I've not used glass but might, though I'm occasionally clumsy enough for this to be a concern.

Bob-D659 · Feb 22, 2012

I remember the mess a gallon jug of developer made when it basically fell off a 3 foot high counter in a high school darkroom and exploded on the concrete floor. No thanks. Wet rubber gloves have no grip on glass bottles, and PET plastic bottles will bounce, not shatter.

holmburgers · Feb 22, 2012

What about dipping glass bottles in that vinyl dip?? There you go... now you've got your weekend all laid out!

papo · Feb 22, 2012

A good proof of the air tightness of the PET bottles can be seen in the adjacent thread (The keeping properties of XTOL).

nworth · Feb 22, 2012

All common plastic bottles that I know of admit some oxygen. PET is much better in this regard than HDPE, and I have had no problem storing developer in old pop bottles.

Bob-D659 · Feb 22, 2012

PET soda bottles are technically pressure vessels, designed not to let gases out as the working pressure can be up to 75psi to keep the fizz in.

The also don't break when you fill one with 2 liters of water, squeeze the air out and then proceed to pitch it 10-15 feet up in the air and it lands on a frozen brick patio. I gave up after 6 attempts.

holmburgers · Feb 22, 2012

Squeezability is key... the oxygen-proof nature of glass is meaningless if you've got air at the top.

michaelbsc · Feb 23, 2012

I thought Rodinol could be stored in an open container for 29 years.

fotch · Feb 23, 2012

Just treat glass as a camera, lens, or negative, and you won't drop it. One should deal with getting the undused space filled with something besides air. Marbles, or inert gas solves that problem. However, nothing wrong with using the right plastic. Just be careful when reusing water, pop, or other repurposed bottles for the new use.

DREW WILEY · Feb 23, 2012

There's no substitute for glass, though polymethylpentene might be quite good. Just depends how
sensitive something is to oxidation. Don't mistake this for what the bottle is itself doing or not. Even
glass is not impervious, though it might take ten thousand years for oxygen to get thru. Generally
I use up the developer before then! A lab supply catalog will show the different options. But glass
is generally way cheaper once you get past the basic polyethylene choices.

Bob-D659 · Feb 23, 2012

That is a really bad choice for developers, 10x the O2 permeability of PE, according to the maker, http://www.mitsuichemicals.com/tpx_cha.htm

And about 600 times more O2 permeable than PET.

Roger Cole · Feb 23, 2012

fotch said:
Just treat glass as a camera, lens, or negative, and you won't drop it. One should deal with getting the undused space filled with something besides air. Marbles, or inert gas solves that problem. However, nothing wrong with using the right plastic. Just be careful when reusing water, pop, or other repurposed bottles for the new use.

Um, really? Maybe for some folks. I have dropped cameras and lenses, not often but I have. Years ago I destroyed one of the generic 135mm telephotos by dropping it and have the diaphragm blades basically explode. I was able to disassemble it and get them out, then use it as a wide open portrait lens. I've dropped negatives more times than I could possibly count, especially when handling them while printing. I've even dropped wet ones, with the associated horrified reaction. I find negatives very easy to drop because I'm handling a flimsy object by the edges only as delicately as possible. It certainly happens. Plus, I don't normally handle cameras in total darkness or under safelight with wet hands in fairly cramped spaces, nor dig them out from behind others on a shelf.

I'm overstating it a bit, but only a bit. I'd use glass for one or two things that are especially critical, or for bulk ingredients to be mixed at leisure and not right before use, but I'm still leery of them for massive use. I have a lot of plastic bottles of stuff in the darkroom. Replacing them all with glass would look like a disaster waiting to happen.

DREW WILEY · Feb 23, 2012

Bob - thanks for the link. Yes, you're right about the oxygen permeability
of polymethylpentene. But I was referring to the oxidation resistance of
specific developers. Polymethylpentene has other virtues, like the fact that
chemical residues are less likely to cling to it and it stays clean easier. Wonderful for measuring graduates for example, esp sticky syrup like HC110 concentrate. It's also has superior chemical resistance. But for
oxidation, absolutely nothing beats traditional glass with teflon lined caps.
Fussy developers shouldn't be kept in anything else.

Gas proof plastic bottles?

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