FYI- GALLERY ACCESS TO CHANGE NEXT WEEK

Flotsam · Feb 4, 2005

So it's the viewing of full-size images and not the uploading that causes the problems.
I could give up uploading my photos in a snap but losing the enjoyment and inspiration that I get from viewing the work of others would suck. I'll try to limit my number of views from now on.

Sean · Feb 4, 2005

Flotsam said:
So it's the viewing of full-size images and not the uploading that causes the problems.
I could give up uploading my photos in a snap but losing the enjoyment and inspiration that I get from viewing the work of others would suck. I'll try to limit my number of views from now on.

Yes basically, an image is uploaded then 100's view it, it all adds up.

The gallery is being modified at this very moment so you guys might experience some weirness this next hour. Thanks

mikebarger · Feb 4, 2005

I like this site, and will continue to support it (pretty new here myself) and any changes Sean feels needs to be made.

There are a lot of rotten sites out there.

Mike

TPPhotog · Feb 4, 2005

Thinking about this one I fully understand the issue and will support your final decision Sean.

I do feel that it would be good if members who cannot subscribe due to Paypal issues or their banks pocketing 2 or 3 times the value of the subscription for issuing a cheque in the correct currency, could have some access to the gallery.

Maybe if they could see the thumbnails and have a view limit of 5 pictures at 100% a day if it's possible. Even better if they could also upload a maximum of 5 pictures to their personal gallery.

There are many people here who would love to subscribe if they could and are not freeloading, some of them have posted some interesting pictures and have helped several of us with their knowledge in the forums. It would be a shame to lose those type of people.

Just my 2 pence - cents - yen worth

gareth harper · Feb 5, 2005

Hello Tony,

"I do feel that it would be good if members who cannot subscribe due to Paypal issues or their banks pocketing 2 or 3 times the value of the subscription for issuing a cheque in the correct currency, could have some access to the gallery. "

I'll be right up front, I'm not subscribing because I'm penny pinching. I do a lot of photographs for voluntary groups, campaigns etc all stuff I belive in. Occasionally I get expenses covered, once in a blue moon I sell a picture, but 99% of it is totally free. It's my contribution anyway, and I enjoy it.

So as it's the New Year (well Febuary now), I'm trying to work out how to cut my costs and take even more photos this year. Less meetings, printing more efficiantly, getting more out of my chemicals, doing less colour. Anywhere I can pinch a penny I'm doing it, so taking out a web forum subscription for this member is not on the agenda, no matter how reasonable it is, and indeed I fully understand why it may be required.

Meanwhile hopefully soon my web site www.photoecosse.net will soon have a new collective commons statement rather than the current 'all rights reserved' statement. That's so more people can use my web pictures for free, nor do they have to ask me.

Those who throw labels about like free-loader, well it usually tells you more about them than it ever will about anybody else.

TPPhotog · Feb 6, 2005

gareth harper said:
I'll be right up front, I'm not subscribing because I'm penny pinching. I do a lot of photographs for voluntary groups, campaigns etc all stuff I belive in. Occasionally I get expenses covered, once in a blue moon I sell a picture, but 99% of it is totally free. It's my contribution anyway, and I enjoy it.

Gareth that's not penny pinching my friend it's called suvival. Until I got my latest job I was at the stage where I could either afford to shoot film or to print. But not both

127 · Feb 6, 2005

TPPhotog said:
I do feel that it would be good if members who cannot subscribe due to Paypal issues or their banks pocketing 2 or 3 times the value of the subscription for issuing a cheque in the correct currency, could have some access to the gallery.

If this REALLY is a problem, then how about a system of volenteers in each country/area?

If anyone in the UK can't pay by pay-pal, then if they send me the appropriate amount as a UK cheque (about 8 pounds I think?), I'll cash the cheque, and pay Sean by paypal on their behalf.

If a few of others did this in USA, Canada and the euro-zone, then you can't use that as an excuse anymore.

Using Sean's computer is a priveledge not a right - What would you do if I started demanding to upload some images onto your machine?

Ian

Tom Stanworth · Feb 6, 2005

I think we are all appreciative of what Sean has done - create a community of fanatics! For some the issue is practical. There are so many little expenses which add up and arty types are not well known for their robust incomes! Having spent time out of work and only generating some cash by selling loads of gear, I can totally relate to those who may have to draw a line and not subscribe to something which is after all a privalege and perhaps not essential (where film and paper is). For me however, it is totally essential for knowledge and inspiration (priceless?) and it is cheaper than hard drugs. I will be subscribing.

Tom

John Bartley · Feb 6, 2005

127 said:
.......snipped.........If a few of others did this in USA, Canada and the euro-zone, then you can't use that as an excuse anymore.......snipped..........

Ok, I can help with that.

regards

David A. Goldfarb · Feb 6, 2005

127 said:
If this REALLY is a problem, then how about a system of volenteers in each country/area?

It really is a problem. I generally won't do business with foreign companies or individuals who can't deal with credit cards or PayPal, unless it is for something costly enough to justify the bank fees--usually on the order of $25 per international bank draft or wire transfer from New York. In the US banking is regulated by state, so fees can vary from state to state as well--New York being near the top of the fee schedule (anyone in North Dakota who might want to launder money for folks from New York and California?).

Fortunately, Sean takes PayPal, so I could subscribe easily that way.

I don't know that we need volunteers in countries that have PayPal access, but maybe if we could figure out where the problems are and how to circumvent them, we could take it from there.

For those who have PayPal access but just don't want to get an account, it's really no more or less safe than any other kind of bank or credit account. There are no fees if you are only using it to make payments. The seller is the one stuck with the fees, but for someone like me who is not in the business of selling things, the PayPal fees are worth it for the convenience of being able to sell to people who use credit cards, compared to the fees I'd have to pay to get a merchant account needed to accept credit cards like a regular business.

I've had my credit card number hijacked, and it was a hassle, but eventually I got a new card number from the same company and didn't lose any money. I haven't had any problems with PayPal in the several years I've had an account, but I am guessing from horror stories I've read, that the risks are similar.

TPPhotog · Feb 6, 2005

Ian, that sounds like a good idea to me

David, the big benefit of the bank I use it that it is an ethical one, ie it will not invest in countries or companies that make their money through suffering or repression. The disadvantage is that they do not have the verification number on the cards that allow it to be used online or over the 'phone with some companies.

Claude · Feb 7, 2005

High transfer volumes are allways a problem, I agree with you Sean !
Thank you for your efforts.
Friendly
Claude

M. Walter Lyon · Feb 8, 2005

Sean,
First let me say that I have learned soooo much from this site. I am very impressed with not only the idea of a safe haven for analog photographers but with the talent that resides here. Since becoming a subscriber, I have purchased two medium format cameras, sold several fine art prints, and started a small business on the side shooting baby pictures. I owe much of this to advice I have obtained here. Big KUDOS to you and your efforts. I know it isn't easy fending off the recent digital invasion of APUG but I think you have been very diplomatic in your efforts.
Second IMHO I think that you should consider raising your subscription to $20 dollars a year. I think it is very reasonable considering the vast amount of information and commrodery (spelling) we benefit from your brainchild. I am a network admin myself and understand the complications you must traverse (probably on a daily basis) in order to bring this to us.
Thank you again for all your hard work!

Mark

TPPhotog · Feb 8, 2005

After much thought and soul searching as my humble offerings are for the masses that wish for some strange reason to look at some of my work, I have decided that I will no longer post pictures to the galleries. I completely agree with your reasons and the decisions you have arrived at Sean and as long as I am welcome will continue to participate in the forums. I have arrived at one of those crossroads in anycase where I'm not satisfied with most of my pictures at present and look forward to the starting new projects and capturing new pictures .

Aggie · Feb 8, 2005

TPPhotog said:
After much thought and soul searching as my humble offerings are for the masses that wish for some strange reason to look at some of my work, I have decided that I will no longer post pictures to the galleries. I completely agree with your reasons and the decisions you have arrived at Sean and as long as I am welcome will continue to participate in the forums. I have arrived at one of those crossroads in anycase where I'm not satisfied with most of my pictures at present and look forward to the starting new projects and capturing new pictures .

Apug was not started for the galleries. It still is not about the galleries but the forums. The galleries are nice to show what we are doing to others, but it is not the reason for apug.

Enjoy and have fun as you have alwys done Tony. If you notice it is usually the new people or those who have a really great picture they eant to share. If all over 5000 of us felt we had to post a picture at least once a week, it would be a massive headache to Sean.

TPPhotog · Feb 8, 2005

Aggie please don't get me wrong as I fully understand the issues Sean is facing and support his decisions. I also agree that the forums are the heart and soul of this wonderful oasis

Lack of sleep due to two consecutive sleep-over shifts (with aggitated service users today) is probably limiting my communicational abilities at the moment. So I apologise to Sean and anyone else who may have thought that my decision is in any way a criticism.

wdrake · Aug 7, 2005

Sean said:
Hi All,

The gallery has been causing a huge load on this site transferring over 4 gigs of data per day. This is a direct correlation to the peak 6,000+ unique visitors to apug daily. It's a performance hit on the server and our hosting plan's data transfer allowance that we simply can't allow to continue. I have no choice but to make the gallery "Subscriber" only starting 1 week from today. The subscription service will remain the same as always with rates starting at $12 per year (paypal gets 65cents of that as handling fee). You can even subscribe for 3 month blocks if money is tight. If the gallery is important to you then the $1 a month should not be a big deal.

Some may have concerns about non-subscribers being unable to show any of their work, and we will figure out a way to address this (most likely 3 images allowed to be attached to their user profile page).

There may be concerns that the forum will be next as subscriber only, but this will not happen. Essentially the forum is juggling only text as data which produces very little load and bandwidth compared to images.

There will also be a daily upload limit of 4 images per day to the gallery. All of this combined will:
-reduce our load considerably
-prevent mass uploads that many find annoying, also preventing new users from registering and moments later uploading 2 megabytes of images to our server

I anticipated this might happen one day, but not so soon. I think the recent surge in traffic has left us with few alternatives in some areas of the site.

I hope everyone can understand stability and maintaining costs are key to the longevity of APUG.

If you use the gallery and do not plan to subscribe, you have 1 week to copy down your images from the gallery if neccessary.

Thanks!

Sean

I'll add my thanks for your effort, Shawn, hope your new measures will allow this site to continue.

Charles Webb · Aug 7, 2005

The gallery is most important to me. What ever it takes to keep it operating I am in favor of.
Charlie Webb

FYI- GALLERY ACCESS TO CHANGE NEXT WEEK

Flotsam

Sean

Admin

mikebarger

TPPhotog

gareth harper

TPPhotog

127

Tom Stanworth

John Bartley

David A. Goldfarb

Moderator

TPPhotog

Claude

M. Walter Lyon

TPPhotog

Aggie

TPPhotog

wdrake

Charles Webb

FYI- GALLERY ACCESS TO CHANGE NEXT WEEK

Admin

Moderator

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency