Fujifilm discontinues GF670--but still available from Voigtlander-Cosina

Xmas · Aug 28, 2014

Ken Nadvornick said:
Actually, it still is sad news if the $1,600+ version is no longer available, but the $2,200+ version is still available. Now I'm really glad I purchased when I did.

Ken

Ken

Please read link.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gresham's_law

It is a similar syndrome

Noel

Roger Cole · Aug 28, 2014

What the heck does Gresham's law, which applies to CURRENCY, have to do with the discontinuation of one version of a camera??

If anything, stretching the analogy, it would imply that the Fuji, the "undervalued" one, would be hoarded.

I suppose you mean there was a production run of both and people who wanted one snapped up the cheaper one, which does make sense. That what you mean?

Xmas · Aug 28, 2014

karl said:
It was my understand that there was only an initial production run of 10,000 cameras. Marketing ploy?

Lots of Ja companies and some others do short production runs.

Such that they can

for a motorcycle do 50 off
for a lens 500 off

Rumor has it that Cosinas initial batch of 40mm /1.4 M lenses was

500 multi coated
500 single coated

to test market.

The Ja customer base wanted the SC version but it turned out that lots of non Ja ordered SC!

But some of the earlier LTM lenses made for the LTM Bessas are difficult to find. Only made in one or two batches... eg the 5cm f/2.5 which is compact for a 5cm and 1mm bigger than the collapsed folder when the folder is collapsed.

They are not like Leica low volume lenses where they are bought by collectors but try buying one.

The folder is the same commodity item wait until last NOS item sells...

Roger Cole · Aug 28, 2014

Well if they can make such small runs, it's quite possible they'll make another run if there's demand. If you want one and missed out, let Fuji know.

RattyMouse · Aug 28, 2014

dreamingartemis said:
And so ends another beautiful story. Though people who own the GF670 should now see the price of second hand units slowly but steadily climb in price when new ones have all been snapped up.

I will NEVER sell either my GF670 or GF670W. Fantastic cameras.

Xmas · Aug 28, 2014

Roger Cole said:
What the heck does Gresham's law, which applies to CURRENCY, have to do with the discontinuation of one version of a camera??

If anything, stretching the analogy, it would imply that the Fuji, the "undervalued" one, would be hoarded.

I suppose you mean there was a production run of both and people who wanted one snapped up the cheaper one, which does make sense. That what you mean?

HiRoger

Yes last para applies.
It is human nature.

Noel

Richard S. (rich815) · Aug 28, 2014

dreamingartemis said:
And so ends another beautiful story. Though people who own the GF670 should now see the price of second hand units slowly but steadily climb in price when new ones have all been snapped up.

Like the other Fuji medium format cameras?

Ken Nadvornick · Aug 28, 2014

Xmas said:
Ken

Please read link.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gresham's_law

It is a similar syndrome

Noel

OK, maybe...

I never had enough info to conclusively understand why they chose those price points. However, I suspect a perception of the USA market as a volume value market. And when the time came on the ROI progression that they needed to move volume, they then supplied that market. As I recall, there was a significant early delay in doing so. I might also suspect that Harman views the USA similarly.

Along those lines some interesting observations. The distance scale on my sample reads only in meters. No units of feet. And I could have, but chose not to purchase at the higher price point, but happily pulled the trigger at US$1,664.

So there you have it. ROI satisfied, now they can clear inventory.

Ken

Dr Croubie · Aug 28, 2014

I'm still not sure how Gresham's law applies, but I haven't studied it that much.
If the cheaper one has been discontinued and the more expensive one is still selling, then to me that's more a possibility of a Veblen Good.

Xmas · Aug 28, 2014

Roger Cole said:
Well if they can make such small runs, it's quite possible they'll make another run if there's demand. If you want one and missed out, let Fuji know.

That is how companies work but there is risk that a piece part might be unabtainable.

With a lens an optical glass might be withdrawn and a redesign needed. The normal reason for a type II lens.

Tis said that the small galvanometer in the Pentax K1000 meter was unobtainable so they stopped production - donno.

But while there is NOS of a variant they won't.

They have however done M versions of LTM lenses when an adapter is a few dollars. But the M versions sold in volume.

I've got several old folders but the one I use is the Isaksra (can't spell) FSU 6x6.

Lots of people have never seen one and you get lots of questions. Typical answer ' it takes Lomo film ' simpler than explaining 120. Girls with DSLR are the worst.

Xmas · Aug 28, 2014

Dr Croubie said:
I'm still not sure how Gresham's law applies, but I haven't studied it that much.
If the cheaper one has been discontinued and the more expensive one is still selling, then to me that's more a possibility of a Veblen Good.

Hi Dr

Correct.

But if you know it is the same manufacturer and he/she makes in small batches on demand then Id suggest Greshams law is more applicable.

For coins to be hoarded you need to know the intrinsic 'worth'.

It is a camera with two badges.

I'll give you I have a problem with cynicism.

They seem to have made lenses in 500s or that is the rumour.

Noel

Henning Serger · Aug 30, 2014

Oren Grad said:
From Stephen Gandy over at RFF:

I checked with Cosina.

The Voigtlander Bessa III and Bessa III Wide will stay in production for the time being.

http://rangefinderforum.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2383419&postcount=23

Hello Oren,

Ringfoto in Germany (the owner of the Voigtländer brand, and distributor of the Voigtländer cameras in lots of markets) has also confirmed that both Bessa III models stay in production.
In the next edition of the "PhotoKlassik" ( www.photoklassik.de ) a test report of the Bessa III will be published. Photoklassik asked Ringfoto / Voigtländer before the report was written, whether the camera will stay in production, and Ringfoto said yes.
And PhotoKlassik just asked again after this Fuji statement, and Ringfoto said again: yes.

I very well remember Photokina 2008, when the first "Mock-up" model of the Fuji was presented behind glass on the Fuji booth.
A new folding camera for film just at a time, when the "digital tsunami" had its biggest strength.
It was a little sensation.
But already at the introduction there have been rumors that the Fuji version is a single production run, aimed at the Japanese market. And at first the Fuji version indeed was only sold in Japan (USA and UK followed later). Here in Germany the Fuji version has never been offered, but the Voigtländer version.

Kudos and thanks to Voigtländer / Cosina / Fuji for this little sensation!

Best regards,
Henning

rbultman · Aug 30, 2014

Are the Fuji and Voigtlander cameras REALLY identicle? Are the lenses identicle but just branded differently? If you compare the spec sheets side-by-side, they are identicle. If the two really are identicle, why the price difference between the two?

Sal Santamaura · Aug 30, 2014

rbultman said:
Are the Fuji and Voigtlander cameras REALLY identicle?...

Yes.

rbultman said:
...Are the lenses identicle but just branded differently?...

Yes.

rbultman said:
...If the two really are identicle, why the price difference between the two?

Price is determined by the market, nothing more. Not product specifics, not cost of production. Fujifilm set its price based on what it perceived the market for a Fuji-branded camera would bring. Voigtländer set its price based on what it perceived the market for a Voigtländer-branded camera would bring. It's really that simple.

Xmas · Aug 30, 2014

Cosina were more greedy than Fuji.

David A. Goldfarb · Aug 30, 2014

The rebranding arrangement isn't unique to this camera. They also did it with the Fujifilm TX-1 and 2 and the Hasselblad Xpan.

Oren Grad · Aug 30, 2014

David A. Goldfarb said:
The rebranding arrangement isn't unique to this camera. They also did it with the Fujifilm TX-1 and 2 and the Hasselblad Xpan.

And the Fuji GX645AF / Hasselblad H1.

LMNOP · Aug 31, 2014

I've always wanted one. I wonder how the market price will change in the coming months/years - I'd rather have a Mamiya 7, but the folding function is really nice.

Heinz · Aug 31, 2014

If I did not own a Makina 67, I would also try one of them.

RattyMouse · Aug 31, 2014

LMNOP said:
I've always wanted one. I wonder how the market price will change in the coming months/years - I'd rather have a Mamiya 7, but the folding function is really nice.

It's impossible to overstate how small the GF670 gets when folded up. You can really take that camera almost anywhere once folded. That alone makes it a serious winner in my book.

OTOH, I do want a Mamiya 7 for that gorgeous 43mm lens!

GarageBoy · Sep 3, 2014

As much as I like the idea, it seemed to be built in a very plasticky way, and I cannot see how Cosina got away with charging to much. That was way more than they ever charged for the GS690, IIRC

RattyMouse · Sep 3, 2014

GarageBoy said:
As much as I like the idea, it seemed to be built in a very plasticky way, and I cannot see how Cosina got away with charging to much. That was way more than they ever charged for the GS690, IIRC

Have you ever held one?

GarageBoy · Sep 3, 2014

Yup, at Photoplus Expo the year it came out
Ever held the helicoid focusing rangefinders?

Fujifilm discontinues GF670--but still available from Voigtlander-Cosina

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