For Sale FS: Two Very Rare 135mm f2 Xero-Nikkor Lenses

csalata · Sep 24, 2016

For sale are two very rare 135mm f2 Xero-Nikkor lenses. Both lenses are optically flawless and come with both caps and the original flange. One lens is near mint cosmetic condition while the other has a few scratches and scuffs on the lens barrel.

Lens specifications according Red Book Nikkor (http://redbook-jp.com/redbook-e/fan11/a05.html):

"The Xero-Nikkor is designed expressly for reproduction of CRT traces on the 127mm (5-inch) diameter screen of the Charactron Tube.
It can also be used, of course, with an osilloscope or any other CRT.
Its hight speed of f/2 affords adequate exposure of the high framing speeds of the relatively low-light level traces on the CRT.
Standard magnification ratio is 2X at which corrections are optomal, but aberrations remain well corrected from 1.5X to 2.5X.
Vignetting is insignificant in CRT reproduction applications.
Resolution is comparable to or better than that of the CRT tubes encountered in practice.
Color correction is 400 nm - 650 nm.
The lens is thereaded at both ends for convenience in normal or reversed mounting."

Xero-NIKKOR 13.5cm F2
Construction: 7 elements in 5 groups
Picture angle: 35°
Standard magnification: 2.3 X
Working distance: 639.2 mm
Image area: 275 mm dia.
Corr. wavelength range: 400 nm - 650 nm
Vignetting: 0% at f/4
Distortion: -1%
Aperture scale: 2 - 8
Mount: d=93 mm / p=1 mm
Dimensions diameter: 104 mm
Dimensions length: 99.5 mm
Weight: 1,420 g

I think these lenses have a lot of potential as excellent macro lenses or even general purpose lenses. I would love to mount them and use them on my 4x5 Horseman but I just don't have the time to play around with lenses right now and I am not that interested in macro photography. If it takes me awhile to sell them, I might keep one copy to play with when I do have time (in the hopefully not too distant) future.

I am asking $550 o.b.o. for the lens in near mint condition and $500 o.b.o. for the lens with a few scuffs.

csalata · Sep 24, 2016

Images are available here: http://www.chrissalata.com/gallery/135mm-f2-Xero-Nikkors/G0000z7EE6sg3M30/C0000JbMdsDJmPuQ

Ian Grant · Sep 24, 2016

What's their image circle at Infinity ? It's likely they only just cover MF.

Ian

csalata · Sep 30, 2016

Ian,

I'm so sorry I didn't reply to you sooner. For some reason I didn't get an email notification that you responded to this thread.

I'm going to try and mount one of the lenses to a Sinar board and take a look at the image circle but it does appear, at least based on the specs listed at Red Book Nikkor, that they should cover MF at infinity. I let you know what I come up with.

Thanks,
Chris

Ian Grant said:
What's their image circle at Infinity ? It's likely they only just cover MF.

Ian

Dan Fromm · Oct 1, 2016

Ian, Chris, I just did a Google search on Akiyama's current site http://redbook-jp.com/redbook-e/ for "xero nikkor" OR xeronikkor or xero. Nothing found.

I have a Nikon data sheet on the 135/2 Xero-Nikkor. Short form, corrected for 1x - 3x for 4,000 - 6,000 A. Usual reproduction ratio 2.3x. Image circle ~ 50 mm at that magnification.

csalata · Oct 1, 2016

Hi Dan,

Here is the direct link to the specifications on Akiyama's website: http://redbook-jp.com/redbook-e/fan11/a05.html. Scroll down to the very bottom of the page.

I read "image area" as "image circle" at the standard magnification. Did I misinterpret that?

Thanks,
Chris

Dan Fromm said:
Ian, Chris, I just did a Google search on Akiyama's current site http://redbook-jp.com/redbook-e/ for "xero nikkor" OR xeronikkor or xero. Nothing found.

I have a Nikon data sheet on the 135/2 Xero-Nikkor. Short form, corrected for 1x - 3x for 4,000 - 6,000 A. Usual reproduction ratio 2.3x. Image circle ~ 50 mm at that magnification.

csalata · Oct 1, 2016

Dan,

One more thing: your post got me curious so I held the lens up to a window in a very dark room and used a blank sheet of paper to focus an image. The subject was at roughly 50 ft. and the lens projected an image about 7 inches in diameter. It was obviously very hard to tell how sharp it was at the extremes but from what I could tell it definitely looks promising enough to mount to a lens board sometime soon. Again, please let me know if I am doing any of this wrong. It's mid-morning over here and I haven't had my coffee yet.

Best,
Chris

markbarendt · Oct 1, 2016

normal 135mm lenses focus at infinity at 135mm so thats side x of right triangle
37 degree angle of view
37/2=18.5 to get angle C for right triangle
45.17*2=90.34/25.4 convert radius to find diameter of coverage 3.5"

That math only works if the lens is "normal" in design.
The other wildcard is that the specified coverage may be for only the sharp portion of the image ????

Dan Fromm · Oct 1, 2016

csalata said:
Hi Dan,

Here is the direct link to the specifications on Akiyama's website: http://redbook-jp.com/redbook-e/fan11/a05.html. Scroll down to the very bottom of the page.

I read "image area" as "image circle" at the standard magnification. Did I misinterpret that?

Thanks,
Chris

Chris, thanks for the link. My data sheet is for a lens that has 7 elements in 5 groups. That would be the earlier one.

It says:

Primarily designed to enlarge the image produce on the Charactron Tube screen of about 120 mm (7 inches) in diameter to the xerographical plate 275 mm wide.
<snip>
The effective covering picture angle being about 50 mm in diameter, the positive film or bromide paper of 60 mm wide can also be used without any objection.

I think you're misinterpreting.

Mark, I calculate the circle covered at infinity (focal length = 135 mm, angle covered = 35 degrees) as 85 mm. That's about what you got. Magic formula in pidgin Excel: =focal length*2*TAN(RADIANS(angle covered/2))

markbarendt · Oct 1, 2016

Thanks Dan

TheFlyingCamera · Oct 1, 2016

Another thing to bear in mind with these lenses - they were designed to photograph the curved surface of a CRT tube. As such they will be problematic if you are expecting to use them for normal photographic effect - think inverse Petzval.

csalata · Oct 1, 2016

Thank you everyone for your help. This site truly is a great resource of information.

Dan Fromm · Oct 1, 2016

csalata said:
Thank you everyone for your help. This site truly is a great resource of information.

That's as may be, but it probably isn't the best place for selling cult items. I believe, could be mistaken, that some collectors prize Xero-Nikkors highly. If I had one to sell I'd offer it on eBay.com, which seems to reach more of them than Apug does.

csalata · Oct 1, 2016

Unfortunately I have to agree with you. I thought I would give it a shot on here before I went through the hassle of eBay. Thanks again for your help.

Dan Fromm said:
That's as may be, but it probably isn't the best place for selling cult items. I believe, could be mistaken, that some collectors prize Xero-Nikkors highly. If I had one to sell I'd offer it on eBay.com, which seems to reach more of them than Apug does.

Leigh B · Oct 2, 2016

markbarendt said:
normal 135mm lenses focus at infinity at 135mm so thats side x of right triangle
37 degree angle of view
37/2=18.5 to get angle C for right triangle
45.17*2=90.34/25.4 convert radius to find diameter of coverage 3.5"

That math only works if the lens is "normal" in design.

I agree with everything except the last line.

The 135mm distance is from the lens' rear node to the film plane with the lens focused at infinity.

This is the definition of focal length. It applies to all lenses regardless of the design.

The rear node moves around all over the place depending on the lens design.
It is not in any way constrained to be within the physical structure of the lens.

For example, the rear node of a telephoto lens can be way out in front of the front element.

- Leigh

markbarendt · Oct 2, 2016

Leigh B said:
For example, the rear node of a telephoto lens can be way out in front of the front element.

- Leigh

In practical terms what I'm calling a normal lens is one where the nodal point is roughly centered in the lens.

Telephoto lenses, as you describe, have their nodal points further forward (even well forward) of the lens.

Retro-focus lenses have their nodal points behind the lens. This is typical of short lenses on 35mm SLR cameras.

This a different use of "normal" than saying 50mm is normal on a 35mm camera.

EdSawyer · Oct 2, 2016

Not so. The charactron had a flat face , generally, not any appreciable curvature, and certainly not something that would be designed into the response of a lens.

TheFlyingCamera said:
Another thing to bear in mind with these lenses - they were designed to photograph the curved surface of a CRT tube. As such they will be problematic if you are expecting to use them for normal photographic effect - think inverse Petzval.

AgX · Oct 2, 2016

TheFlyingCamera said:
Another thing to bear in mind with these lenses - they were designed to photograph the curved surface of a CRT tube. As such they will be problematic if you are expecting to use them for normal photographic effect - think inverse Petzval.

As long as you do not photograph charts, walls, coins etc. you typically will not find flat focal plane objects. A lens designed for a curved object even can be benefitial.

Dan Fromm · Oct 3, 2016

AgX said:
As long as you do not photograph charts, walls, coins etc. you typically will not find flat focal plane objects. A lens designed for a curved object even can be benefitial.

Hmm. Which curved object is your dream lens for? Given how irregular the world is, how can you obtain, let alone carry, the right lenses for all of the non-planar surface you're likely to encounter and want to photograph?

AgX · Oct 3, 2016

A curved lens may be quite adeqate for head portraiture for instance.

If I remember right it was Minolta who once made a lens where the curvature of the field of focus even could be adjusted.

cramej · Oct 3, 2016

AgX said:
A curved lens may be quite adeqate for head portraiture for instance.

If I remember right it was Minolta who once made a lens where the curvature of the field of focus even could be adjusted.

It is the Rokkor 24mm f/2.8 VFC

According to Rokkorfiles: "These curvatures can be used to obtain sharp rendition of three dimensional subjects (eg. the surface of a ball, people sitting around a table etc.) even when the depth of flat field is insufficient to do so. Curving the field in this way is particularly effective at relatively close focusing distances and large apertures."

AgX · Oct 3, 2016

Back to the topic: the curvature of a CRT screen is low and thus will be the curvature of plane of focus of this Nikkor lens.

csalata · Oct 20, 2016

One lens has been sold and I am keeping the other.

For Sale FS: Two Very Rare 135mm f2 Xero-Nikkor Lenses

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